Bleh

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Revision as of 2 December 2010 at 08:40.
The [/w/index.php?title=Forum:Use_liquid_threads_in_the_forum%3F&offset=20101202084057&lqt_mustshow=305 highlighted comment] was created in this revision.

It's awful. Totnesmartin (talk) 18:55, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

    Totnesmartin (talk)18:55, 21 November 2010

    and it signs the sig twice.

      Totnesmartin (talk)18:55, 21 November 2010

      This is shit.new threads are supposed to at the bottom aren't they? Is this going to be spread across all of RW? Totnesmartin (talk) 18:56, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

        Totnesmartin (talk)18:56, 21 November 2010

        Going by the heavy opposition here, I am inclined to doubt it.

          Mjollnir.svgListenerXTalkerX18:57, 21 November 2010

          Having to remember to sign posts in some places but not others is going to create a mess.

            Totnesmartin (talk)19:04, 21 November 2010
             

            You can alter the listing order from the top of the page. You can select newest replies at the top or first posted at the top. It's added functionality but since you're either not used to it or unaware of it, you'll assume it's just shit.

              Scarlet A.pngd hominem21:05, 21 November 2010

              Hey, I didn't know about that. Cool.

                -- Nx / talk21:07, 21 November 2010

                I'm just wondering if I'm the only person who assessed the functionality of this before passing comment... yes, it's fugly, I'll agree every day of the week. But when I first started reading Wiki talk pages after years of using bulletin boards I had no clue as to what was happening. You had to invent an entire new piece of etiquette about indents and replying just to make it work. This automates and controls that with specific replies and notifications. The internet spent the best part of a decade working out how best to set up a forum system and it came up with something exactly like this - it's only on Media Wiki talk pages that you get anything different. So if people complain about this I don't see why they don't head over to every other forum on the internet and complain there too.

                  Scarlet A.pngd hominem21:11, 21 November 2010

                  It seems to be crashing Opera 10.63 half the time after saving, however. That is a major problem above any visual fuglyness.

                    Scarlet A.pngd hominem21:12, 21 November 2010

                    Opera crashes from a lot of things (from my experience, it's an unstable pile of crap, at least the linux version), it's not necessarily lqt's fault. Then again, sometimes you can't see your newly posted comment, maybe that's related. Oh btw, https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=MediaWiki%20extensions and select LiquidThreads from the list

                      -- Nx / talk21:18, 21 November 2010

                      Opera isn't that unstable, it just doesn't like things that are a little experimental. Often websites prefer to ban that browser than, you know, check their site actually works... but anyway.

                      I can't seem to consistently find what is the problem. It might be if it's trying to automatically update and reload the thread. If I can figure out the exact issue, I'll report it properly. As you can probably tell, I'm not the sort of person to just say "it don't work gud" and assume tech support can fix it like magic. I've been on the receiving end of generic complaints enough to find that isn't going to help at all.

                        Scarlet A.pngd hominem21:43, 21 November 2010

                        Well yeah, but a decent browser shouldn't be crashing because some website has broken javascript.

                          -- Nx / talk21:47, 21 November 2010

                          Yeah, but sites shouldn't have piece-of-shit javascript.

                          Anyway, it's stopped it now so it might have been a background window being a dick.

                            Scarlet A.pngd hominem21:52, 21 November 2010

                            Postel's Law: be conservative in what you produce, and liberal in what you accept from others. Opera isn't exempt.

                              Evil evil Hoover!22:06, 21 November 2010

                              I'd just rather use IE 5 than start worshiping at the Church of Firefox.

                                Scarlet A.pngd hominem22:09, 21 November 2010

                                Who's making irrational, kneejerk opinions of something based on no evidence or reason now?

                                  Evil evil Hoover!22:11, 21 November 2010

                                  Yay, a browser flamewar. Because there wasn't enough DRAMA already

                                    -- Nx / talk22:12, 21 November 2010

                                    I believe you started it when you said Opera was a pile of crap. You have insulted my honour, sir, and I challenge you to a duel.

                                      Scarlet A.pngd hominem22:45, 21 November 2010
                                       
                                       
                                       
                                       
                                       
                                       
                                       
                                       
                                       

                                      Yes, the battleship grey is ugly. I'll do something about it. But I have a million more important things to do right now. So if you want to do something about it rather than just complain (this isn't directed at you, Armondikov), right-click, inspect element, and play with it.

                                        -- Nx / talk21:23, 21 November 2010

                                        Could do. I can definitely spot some places where it could be streamlined a little, but I'm not sure how much of that would be in the CSS and how much would be in the software itself.

                                          Scarlet A.pngd hominem21:44, 21 November 2010
                                           
                                          But when I first started reading Wiki talk pages after years of using bulletin boards I had no clue as to what was happening.

                                          That is why liquid threads was developed, because people new to MediaWiki were unfamiliar with the system and prefered the blog/facebook/BB style thread.

                                            - π22:48, 21 November 2010

                                            I figured that much.

                                            Now if ONLY the Facebook system was this useful...

                                              Scarlet A.pngd hominem23:02, 21 November 2010

                                              I have just found that the new message thing Human was complaining about on my talkpage is a much better way of finding replies to your post.

                                              I don't use facebook so I couldn't comment.

                                                - π23:33, 21 November 2010

                                                I'm finding it better than scanning recent changes and hoping I've caught the right one. And the fact it highlights new posts is useful if someone is sending threads off in different directions.

                                                I'm in agreement that this thing is far from finished, but the potential is there and I think the benefits for running better discussions could be had now. It might not be best for the extremely short casual chit-chat of the saloon bar, but for where replies tend to be longer on average (with an increased risk of edit conflicts) and where threads go off on tangents this is a far superior way of doing it.

                                                  Scarlet A.pngd hominem23:42, 21 November 2010

                                                  That said, it'd be nice if it could collapse the posts above the highlighted replies, rather than nesting everything and you having to scroll down to find them. But again, this is no different to scrolling down a tl;dr discussion in the normal talk page manner so it's more a problem that it doesn't solve than a problem it creates.

                                                    Scarlet A.pngd hominem23:45, 21 November 2010

                                                    Isn't that what the arrow does? (Which should be a lot smaller and maybe down the bottom of the comment)

                                                      - π01:58, 22 November 2010

                                                      No, it just seems that clicking the arrow above a nest of comments collapses the whole thing into an outline of peoples sigs.

                                                      It's also messed up for me doing that, showing just a repeat of the same sigs over and over again. Unless you and I have had a conversation in this thread with 100 posts apiece without me noticing.

                                                        Scarlet A.pngd hominem02:28, 22 November 2010

                                                        The repetition is obviously a bug. It is suppose to fold so you can see the next reply to the comment.

                                                          - π02:58, 22 November 2010
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           
                                                           

                                                          I wasn't interested in learning a whole new way to interact online this week, sorry. Especially on a site where interaction works just fine already.

                                                          As someone said somewhere, Liquid Dreads might work well on new sites, but existing ones won't like it.

                                                            ħumanUser talk:Human02:58, 22 November 2010

                                                            Apart from the edit conflicts and the difficulty in directing tangential discussions, it works fine.

                                                              Scarlet A.pngd hominem03:04, 22 November 2010
                                                               
                                                               
                                                               

                                                              You get a warning if you type four tildes. The text is cut off, but I think I fixed that, although it's still broken for me.

                                                                -- Nx / talk19:12, 21 November 2010

                                                                I never got any warnings. (EDIT:nor for this) Totnesmartin (talk) 19:18, 21 November 2010 (UTC)

                                                                  Totnesmartin (talk)19:18, 21 November 2010
                                                                  Edited by another user.
                                                                  Last edit: 22:54, 21 November 2010

                                                                  File:Lqt_sig_warn.png

                                                                    -- Nx / talk 07:38, 30 November 2010 (UTC)19:31, 21 November 2010

                                                                    Let's see. Yup. I get the warning as soon as I hit the fourth tilde.

                                                                      SuspectedReplicant retire me23:56, 21 November 2010

                                                                      That is not a "solution", it's a hack.

                                                                        ħumanUser talk:Human02:58, 22 November 2010

                                                                        This is alpha software, hacks become features.

                                                                          - π03:09, 22 November 2010
                                                                           
                                                                           
                                                                           
                                                                           
                                                                           
                                                                           

                                                                          I must admit, these are pretty hideous. I'm going to be a luddite on this and say we don't need to go this route. If you want to keep it in the forum, fine, but keep it off the rest of RW - including talk pages.

                                                                          I looks hideous, navigation is screwed up - I clicked reply and then went on a tour of the other sub-headings. I think most of us by now - even newbies are au fait enough with wiki language and layout that we can move away from this format.

                                                                            Ψ GremlinHable!08:21, 22 November 2010

                                                                            Nobody is going this route (well some people have but that is there problem). This a trial run of a very new feature. After having used it for less than an hour, it was already clear that it was not ready to be used across the whole forum space. After being here for nearly a week, sometime in the last twenty-four hour the chicken littles noticed this page and felt that this little experiment is too avant garde for them and want it burnt to the ground. This wiki is rational, unless the topic is the wiki itself, then all ends of emotional ranting is required.

                                                                              - π08:34, 22 November 2010

                                                                              Well, it's not exactly SensibleWiki is it... But surely if I can figure it out other people can.

                                                                                Scarlet A.pngd hominem08:40, 22 November 2010
                                                                                 

                                                                                Doesn't make any sense to me. Who are the "chicken littles"? People who don't code geeks playing beta with the day-to-day operations? Asterisk (talk) 03:44, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

                                                                                  Asterisk (talk)03:44, 30 November 2010

                                                                                  Nobody is playing beta with day-to-day operation is my point, hence the chicken little analogy. There is only two pages were this is being trialled and the people here are acting like this is the final product about to be hoisted across the entire site. We are unlikely to implement this before Wikipedia does at least.

                                                                                    - π04:21, 30 November 2010

                                                                                    Though I have to note that it's starting to look a lot better. Still haven't seen any other bugs myself.

                                                                                      Scarlet A.pngd hominem12:25, 30 November 2010
                                                                                       

                                                                                      It's the people who are screaming "OMGZ LiquidThreads is ruining my wiki, delete it NAO" and who think lqt should be "uninstalled for a useless piece of junk, the bits that harbored it degaussed, burned over and sown with salt".

                                                                                        -- Nx / talk10:26, 30 November 2010

                                                                                        I don't understand, why does it say I have four new messages, and link here? None of you nice people are talking to me, as far as I can tell.

                                                                                          Asterisk (talk)06:53, 2 December 2010

                                                                                          Shut the fuck up Human.

                                                                                            - π08:38, 2 December 2010
                                                                                             

                                                                                            Sigh. Human, it's not that hard to understand. You have replied to this thread. This automatically watches this thread (similarly, when you edit a talk page, it's automatically added to your watchlist - I haven't tested, but lqt probably respects the preference option). When someone replies to a thread you are watching, it will count as a "new message for you". Yes, the phrasing is stupid, it should be "there are replies to threads you are watching". You have to click Mark as read on Special:Newmessages to clear the notification.

                                                                                              -- Nx / talk08:40, 2 December 2010
                                                                                               
                                                                                               
                                                                                               
                                                                                               
                                                                                               
                                                                                               
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