User:Hamster/Scrappad

This page is WIP essays on stuff to organise my thoughts, such as they are :)

Essay: Problems with Intelligent Design Theory
Constructing something requires a multi-stage process. Specification, Design, procurement of materials, construction. If we allow the designer to also specify what is to be designed, and permit the builder to procure materials we reduce the problem to two steps Design > construction. By proposing Intelligent design the obvious question becomes "who is the designer" and opens the question "who is the builder". For mundane items like pots, buildings we know that a human designer has certain physical limits to incorporate in his design. Doors must be wirhin a range to be easy to use, handles must fit the hand using them. To determine design indicators for a supernatural agent,with no way of determining capabilities, the questions seem unanswerable.

Discovery Institute takes an interesting approach to Intelligent Design. Stage 1 is a claimed scientific theory that intelligent design rather than natural cause can be determined by assessing a value for Complex specified information. A high value indicates design. Having shown design the theory ends with NO investigation of the designer or builder. The issue of who is the designer is NOT part of the theory.

Stage 2 Includes religion. Creation(origins) is both a scientific matter and a religious one, so the DI shows this on an overlapping set diagram. Having shown something is designed they then look to religion to provide a supernatural designer. The stated position of DI is that the designer is of course the Christian GOD. To be fair they do allow that Origins can be secular or religious and allows for either or both to provide the explanation.

Presenting this second stage in a high school would violate seperation of church and state. The DI wedge document shows the intention to get creationism into the public school system.

http://www.ideacenter.org/contentmgr/showdetails.php/id/1136 http://www.ideacenter.org/contentmgr/showdetails.php/id/832 http://www.ideacenter.org/about/mission_affiliations.php

From a scientific standpoint this may be acceptable but leaves several lines of inquiry open. By passing off the creator as a religious matter you close off the enquiry into a secular designer. It should be possible to assess the requirements of creating the object and determine what sort of being could have that capability. Design and genetic engineering are within human grasp for bacteria and viruses, plants and possibly domesticated animals, at least to a degree. Building a moon, solar system or galaxy, or even terraforming a planet are outside human limits.

The design indicator of Complex specified information fails as soon as 1 object of natural cause is found to have a large CSI value. Does ID assume that high CSI proves design,because the creator designed the feature, and supernatural causes are unprovable ? If so, this would seem to invalidate ID as a scientific theory.

Scientific Papers Refuting ID.

Thomas D. Schneider provides a paper which casts doubt on the Dembski proposal of Complex Specified Information proving design.

Shneider on Complex Specified Information

Essay: Why Religion should not argue Science
This is simply my opinion after years of my experiances.

Religion is a matter of faith. Faith is a belief in the absence of physical evidence. If Christianity had clearly documented artifacts, which showed the existance of Adam, Noah, Moses, Jesus etc then faith would be reduced. We would not need faith in God, we would have evidence of him. If that happened, and people had reason to question God , rather than fall back on faith to get them through a rough path they might demand some evidence of Gods involvement.