RationalWiki talk:Moral Matrix

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Filthy socialists!

 * "You scored -4.5 on Moral Order and 6.0 on Moral Rules." Who's Dennis Kucinich? Susan  Prunes and custard  18:52, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Kucinich is the only real liberal running for a major party nomination in the 2008 primaries. human  20:15, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Mm ... I googled him. How do you pronounce him? Kuchinighh? (ch as in Scottish 'loch') or Kukinich? (ch as in charger) or some other way?  Susan  Prunes and custard  20:32, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * It's "Koo sin itch", emphasis on second syllable. human  20:33, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Liberals always have an accent on sin. --206.248.174.192 20:58, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * To say nothing of an itch to koo... human  00:48, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * "Your scored -3 on Moral Order and 3.5 on Moral Rules." Awesome...? GrandSoviet


 * -5/3 without hints, -3/1.5 with.  So maybe somewhere in between.   Weird   DogP  19:32, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * -5/3.5 CЯacke ®


 * Interesting symmetry. I got -3.5/3.5.  Jimmy Carter? --Kels 19:50, 10 January 2008 (EST)


 * -4.5/3.5, and the usual gang of rogues... Carter, Cobb (green party 2004), Kucinich. party: none, system: socialism.  But I knew all that already.  Schlafly hates me!  Someone take it for teh assfly? human  20:22, 10 January 2008 (EST)

Any of you read the explanation behind the grid, or did you just wing it? -- 21:07, 10 January 2008 (EST) I'm sorry if any of you feel I wasted your time. I just find stuff like this endlessly fascinating. -- 23:44, 10 January 2008 (EST)


 * I'm mildly socialist, and 0% are more authoritarian than me. Hurrah, I'm Joseph Stalin. Forgive me if I don't believe this test captures the essence of people's views very well. -- 04:28, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * I think the comparison feature of their calculator is broken. It said 0% of people were more liberal than Andrew Schlafly.  Do you mind sharing the actual numbers you got?  That would make things clear.  -- 05:41, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * I thought that, too, but on this chart "liberal" is not the thing that andy hates - it's "classic liberal". What he hates are us socialists.  If you look at his "dot", there is no way to be lower on the y-axis.  But I might be wrong and it should have said 100% - since there is no way to be to the left of him on the x axis.
 * That said, this is a confusing "compass", because it is a bit different than the others - it only measures a particular two of the many possible spectra available (remember, the usual PCs add a vertical axis to the one dimensional left/right one). And the axes are "moral" in nature, so I think the labelling of the quadrants in political terms is a bit unclear. human  04:10, 14 January 2008 (EST)

I scored -6 on Moral Order and 4.5 on Moral Rules.
 * System: Socialism
 * Ideology: Activism
 * Party: No match.
 * Presidents: Jimmy Carter
 * 04' Election: David Cobb
 * 08' Election: Dennis Kucinich

Of the 408,900 respondents (1,101 on Facebook):
 * 2% are close to you.
 * 82% are more conservative.
 * 1% are more liberal.
 * 1% are more socialist.
 * 7% are more authoritarian.

Neat!  Г ☭  длесс Либерал  19:07, 17 January 2008 (EST)

Bring out the color swatches!
I'm a lazy ass. So you get to pick the color of your own dot on the grid. I already have Human's and my own. There's a page on Wikipedia with a list of computer-compatable colors if you want to look. By the way, if you say something like "green", I'll go with whatever number-letter code Wikipedia gives for it. -- 07:05, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * I think it's pretty much time to port this to its own article, eh? human  07:09, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Well, darn it, I guess so. Can we leave a very prominent link to it here?  RationalWiki:Moral Matrix perhaps?  -- 07:12, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yes, definitely leave a link behind. The hard part (probably) will be deciding what to put in talk and what goes in the article.  Also, if we make it catted as "best of fun" (or is that amusement?), it will end up on the featured content randomly, too. Not sure if we should do that though. human  23:37, 11 January 2008 (EST)

Shit Damn
I knew that the test at politicalcompass.org misscored me. On that test, I only managed to get economic left -8.88, social libertarian -1.74. Not quite liberal authoritarian. Well, now we all know where I really stand. -- 21:33, 10 January 2008 (EST)

People who simulated teh assflinator put his "scores" in this section so they don't infect ours with his conservative advantages
TEH ASSFLY'S SCORE

Your [sic] scored 7 on Moral Order and -8 on Moral Rules.

The following categories best match your score (multiple responses are possible):

1. System: Conservatism 2. Ideology: Ultra Capitalism 3. Party: Constitution Party 4. Presidents: George W. Bush 5. 04' Election: Michael Peroutka 6. 08' Election: Fred Thompson

Of the 406,604 respondents (913 on Facebook):

1. 1% are close to you. 2. 0% are more conservative. 3. 0% are more liberal. [sic, I think we broke it with him] 4. 97% are more socialist. 5. 1% are more authoritarian.

Comment: running endless assfly bots will slightly alter the "overall" outcome data. Oh well... human  00:06, 11 January 2008 (EST)

I tried to briefly channel Ashclafly and got (7,-5). In the process I had a weird urge to vaccinate a dinosaur.--Bayesupdate 23:59, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * I tried and hit 8, -7.5 (woo!). However, I think I may have been being overly honest about some things Andy wouldn't admit his real thoughts on (ex. differences between men and women...). Uchiha KATON! 00:05, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yeah, that's the real challenge...do you answer for what you think he stands for, or what you think he would say he stands for?--Bayesupdate 00:43, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Remember to answer question 9 (About business) with "We should reward businesses that put social responsibility ahead of profitability." Why?  Because in Andyland, businesses that discriminate against "social undesirables" (i.e. anyone he or his mother doesn't like) and censor everything objectionable would be considered "socially responsible", and be rewarded for it.  -- 00:40, 11 January 2008 (EST)

WTF!! I get this analysis:  5% are close to you. (OK)    75% are more conservative.( Maybe in the US.)     7% are more liberal. (Again maybe in the US.)    3% are more socialist.  (again ...)   6% are more authoritarian. But what the hell is this? Only 6% more authoritarian than me!? I don't believe it! There should be a law against tests like this !! --Bobbing up 05:17, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * I thought I were fairly conservative myself, but I must be wrong. What does (-4; +6) mean anyway? Ed @but not the Poor one! 05:24, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yes, some numbers on the matrix might be nice. As far as I can tell the first negative puts you on the socialist side and the subsequent plus puts you up towards the authoritarian bit. --Bobbing up 05:57, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Thanks. That's strange - freedom is the value I deem most important of all. I guess my idea(l) of a Welfare State where people are cared for gave me the plus six. At least, I'm in good company (You won't mind Susan, will you?). Ed @but not the Poor one! 14:47, 11 January 2008 (EST)

Half-done graph of our results

 * Please make my "dot" purple pink the same color as my name!!! human  01:11, 11 January 2008 (EST)

We're all a bunch of Socialists, apparently. -- 07:29, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Can't we get TK and Bohdan to take the test, just for some variety among the dots? -- 07:30, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Nice job on that graph! Looks like we're going to have to stop ironically accusing ourselves of liberal deceit and instead opt for the more accurate socialist deceit. GrandSoviet 12:04, 11 January 2008 (EST)

Now updated! -- 19:21, 15 January 2008 (EST)

Someone else (not me) should take all this stuff and move it to an article called, oh, how about "Moral Matrix"?
I disagree with the above, Human. We should leave this here until everyone who's going to do it has done it. If moved to its own article, it'll be harder to find and not as many people will do it. -- 23:53, 10 January 2008 (EST)
 * Well, I didn't say "move it now", did I, spud peeler? Anyway, when it does finally, eventually get moved, there can be a link here to it for teh little stragglers, eh? human  00:01, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * "Spud peeler"? -- 00:46, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yeah! Come on, mash some taters up and hike on over to Hoji's talk page for the party! human  01:05, 11 January 2008 (EST)

Finished Graph
There! It's done! -- 04:22, 16 January 2008 (EST)

(see article for graph) human  17:06, 21 January 2008 (EST)

I just randomly chose the colors for the dots, except for Human, who requested the same color his signature uses. My apologies to whoever ended up with the same color as TK. :) -- 04:22, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * I hate to be ants at a picnic, but somebody misrecorded my score way up there. I actually posted that I got a "-3 on Moral Order and 3.5 on Moral Rules," not a -3.5 on MR. Oops! GrandSoviet 14:53, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Now worries. It'll be simple to correct that.  And assuming GodlessLiberal ever wakes up from his coma for longer than five minutes, I'll have to change it anyways.  -- 14:59, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Nice work! Do you want some help moving all this to its own article & talk page later? human  15:39, 16 January 2008 (EST)

Can I add myself? How do I do it?- 15:40, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Tell RA your numbers and he'll re-edit the image. One twerk, by the way - "judgmental" is missspelled. human  15:41, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Damn. -- 15:44, 16 January 2008 (EST)

Oh forget me, then :-) - 15:45, 16 January 2008 (EST) Mmm - nice. Susan  Purrrrrrr  15:46, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Tell me your numbers! I'm willing to hear 'em, I'm wanting to hear 'em, I'm WAITING to hear 'em!  -- 15:49, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * 6.0,-4.5 Add Me!!! --Dragon 18:41, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Splendid - and Gulic - welcome to the outer (-6) limits. I'm glad I'm not alone! Silver Sloth 18:45, 16 January 2008 (EST)
 * Can my dot be zinnwaldite [Hex EBC2AF / RGB (235,194,175)]? It's the best-named color on that Wikipedia list. Master Bra'tac<font color="#661111">Kree! 17:51, 17 January 2008 (EST)

Fictional characters
I tried to get into the mind of Emperor Palpatine. I got - MO: 5, MR: -4.5 <font color="#DC143C" face="Symbol">--PRO   <font color="#DC143C" face="Symbol">MH   <font color="#DC143C" face="SYMBOL">QEUS  <font color="#FFD700"> - FORETHOUGHT  12:23, 11 January 2008 (EST)

Flaw
First of all, while I like the idea of having my point be the only one to the right of center, I don't think the test accurately reflects my political views so much as my moral views. The idea of the test is to see how your moral views translate into political views, but this only works for people who want to enforce their moral views politically. A very rough guess would be that my point should actually be the mirror image (across the y-axis) from what it is. I might be slightly further negative on the y-axis, but not by much. Lurker 18:01, 11 January 2008 (EST)
 * Yes, I think we all agree on this. Also, their claim that the test is "neutral" due to the distribution is weak - if it were truly neutral, the average would be at 0,0, and there would be fewer and fewer people in every direction as you move away from the origin.  And the "radial" distribution would be fairly balanced as well.  As it is, they are getting a broad diagonal "streak" of results.  From which, I suppose, we can deduce that at least as far as this test goes, there are very few people who hold the views that would put them strongly in the top right or bottom left quadrants. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms">human  10:32, 22 January 2008 (EST)
 * Actually, I think it probably makes sense that it is grouped diagonally, as this is roughly the traditional "right/left" line. There aren't that many libertarians and there aren't that many fascists/nationalists, so everyone else winds up more or less along the middle. Lurker 00:27, 25 January 2008 (EST)

My dot
I posted the proper coordinates for my dot a couple times, once immediately after taking the survey and again after the initial draft was finished. It's MO: -3, MR: 3.5, which would put me squarely in the socialism.... square. Peace! GrandSoviet 00:29, 22 January 2008 (EST)
 * I liked you better when you weren't complaining about your dot :-)  -- 01:06, 22 January 2008 (EST)
 * I liked you better when you weren't putting my dot in incorrect places. ;/ GrandSoviet 10:25, 22 January 2008 (EST)

Latest iteration of the graph
Kudos, PFoster. You are apparently the most egalitarian person among us—a full point farther to the left than the runner-ups. -- 04:12, 25 January 2008 (EST)
 * OK, so who wants to work out the average "dot" position for RW editors? (leave out the dragon) <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms">human  13:28, 29 January 2008 (EST)
 * I make it MO: -3.9 : MR 2.3 - I left out the dragon and projected results for Andy as not truely representative. If I've got some transposig errors then I wouldn't be surprised. Silver Sloth 13:45, 29 January 2008 (EST)

Oops.
Looks like I gave the coordinates for the OTHER test, last time. I'm actually at MO: -3.00, MR: 4. --Gulik 16:32, 27 January 2008 (EST)

Now you can complain about the test being biased
Guys! The page on moral-politics.com that analyzes the test results by country is back up! W00t!

Now you can start assailing the accuracy of the test! -- 17:18, 30 January 2008 (EST)


 * One thing I just noticed: of the 22 countries with enough respondents to be statistically representative of their country—1,000+ for most polls, as I recall—16 are in Europe.  The remaining six are the US (which comprises more than half of the respondents by itself), Canada, Brazil, Australia, New Zealand, and "unknown".


 * Just an observation. -- 17:33, 30 January 2008 (EST)
 * It's more fun looking at the countries with very few "representatives"! Jordan, Saudi Arabia, the Northern Marijuana Islands... So, the UK has socialism and likes it.  Saudi has their authoritarianism - and likes it... although one of them is a screamin' socialist.  Off with his hands! <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms">human  17:58, 30 January 2008 (EST)

Yeah, it's got pretty leading (and loaded) questions. I mean the one with charity said in the hint for the most "socialist" option "charity is humiliating". Er, no, I don't think that - I think it shouldn't be needed at all. And how are you supposed to choose between options when you agree with more than one, because they all say different things? On the work question I agreed with pretty much all the responses, and they weren't exactly mututally exclusive. Kirkburn 18:17, 30 January 2008 (EST)
 * Well, that's what you get with us Americans. We can only have one moral at a time.  :-)  -- 18:45, 30 January 2008 (EST)

Oh, and the way the results are presented is pretty bad too. The 3D effect is pointless and slightly misleading (given the angle it looks from). A 2D heat map would do the job much better. But noooooo, must be pritty! Kirkburn 18:21, 30 January 2008 (EST)

Schlafly
I took the test as Schlafly as well and got a slightly different result, wonder where are differences lie? tmtoulouse 18:43, 19 November 2009 (UTC)

Redo
I wonder if it would be of interest for people to take the test again. Because: --BobNot Jim 11:57, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
 * People come and go and it would be interesting to newer editors included in the graphic.
 * It would be interesting to see if there has been any general movement in the fundamental position of the RW membership.
 * It would be interesting to see if people's individual positions have changed.

Hey this test is kinda lame
but anyways... 10:27, 17 December 2011 (UTC)


 * Yeah, you'd think they'd just made it up or something. -- MtD Pinko Scum   10:28, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Politics is such a complex issue, the idea you could ever reduce it to a multiple choice test, is rather foolish (albeit maybe there is such a thing as self-conscious foolishness). For many of the questions, I felt the urge to provide, not one choice out of four, but rather an essay. 10:36, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

I can't find my dot
halp-- 16:00, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
 * and with 11/11 nobody ever will… -- 16:07, 17 December 2011 (UTC)
 * It's -11, please. I'm a communist--  17:11, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

I think they changed the scale of the matrix
I just took the test, got -12/7...which is way off the chart. I'm not sure what the new scale is. -- Seth Peck (talk) 17:10, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

Ever considered putting the test on the site ?
I keep trying but the test on the meeting website (are you really serious ?) does not work Because i have to register to do it but I can't do it for some reason. Can you put the test directly on the website ?

Please provide a link that works
This is really annoying. The site doesn't seem to work anymore. Diacelium (talk) 06:47, 26 December 2016 (UTC)