Talk:North Korea/Archive1

More work
This article could use a little work in order to become bronze.A few more minor edits could be made (e.g., What is the OED?). However, the main thing this article needs is references, seeing as the sections on industry and human rights records are completely devoid of references. Add in some references and this should be good for bronze. The Heidelberg Kid (talk) 22:32, 17 October 2011 (UTC)

Looks like Kim-Jong Il found RW! :D Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 04:34, 19 February 2011 (UTC)
 * And editing from Europe to boot! Good for him!   04:39, 19 February 2011 (UTC)

Now i wonder, if the whole "MILLIONS died of starvation in the North", then why North-to-South population ratio is roughly the same 1:2 as it was throughout the known history?

Remove U$ lies
I am going to take action and remove the US lies about the DPRK that plague this article &mdash; Unsigned, by: Juche4World / talk / contribs
 * Oh, don't be silly. 22:10, 6 March 2011 (UTC) TerrySmall.png [[Image:Toast s.png|alt=Toast|text-bottom|20px|link=User talk:SusanG]]
 * Binned him. ТyUser_talk:Tyrannis 22:11, 6 March 2011 (UTC)
 * It's actually kind of strange because he did put some effort into it. I wonder what's the case. An actual party member of the internet having class? An overly industrious troll? A "from distance", N.Korean fanboy? Sen (talk) 00:46, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Methinks he is a Poe. The Heidelberg Kid (talk) 20:28, 16 October 2011 (UTC)
 * That's the problem. Poe's are difficult enough to tell under normal circumstances. With those claiming to be supporters of North Korea, unless you know the claimant personally, you can never really tell.ChrisB (talk) 02:19, 19 October 2012 (UTC)

The US propaganda needs to be removed
Why is there so many lies on the article?&mdash; Unsigned, by: Juche4World / talk / contribs
 * Can you make a clear, concise, and specific argument about what you want changed? 00:33, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
 * The article constantly bases the DPRK, it mocks the title of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, and it denies the existence of industry within the DPRK. The Human rights section is complete fantasy and comes from lies told by 'defectors'. For a website that calls itself ‘rational’ you do have allot of unfound propaganda against socialist nations. Juche4World / talk / contribs
 * "For a website that calls itself ‘rational’" Everybody drink! 03:37, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
 * *Sips tea* ТyUser_talk:Tyrannis 03:38, 7 March 2011 (UTC)
 * Why are you mocking me rather than addressing my complaints, isn't it obvious that this article is full of unfounded Anti-DPRK propaganda? Juche4World / talk / contribs "Man is the master of everything and decides everything" Great Leader President Kim Il Sung 13:30, 7 March 2011 (UTC)/ March 7. Juche 100
 * http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hiwHphbnC-w (NSFW) Wait, that's "everybody dance". Then again, who cares? YAAAY! The Heidelberg Kid (talk) 22:44, 3 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I want an Internet meme based on this dialogue. The Heidelberg Kid (talk) 22:44, 3 December 2011 (UTC)
 * I'll deliver... hehe... 05:40, 21 December 2018 (UTC)

Needs references.
Just that. We need actual references in this article. I'll scrounge around, see if I could find any, but we need to improve this. If there's one thing I learned from the Eve fiasco, wikis are a collaborative effort. The Heidelberg Kid (talk) 22:33, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

How much is true?
I think it's obvous the place is a hell hole, but I often hear a lot about the place which sets off my BS detector. How much is black propaganda? -Albannach (talk) 12:49, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, we can start with you listing specific examples of claims that set off your bullshit detector, and then we can try to research them.--ZooGuard (talk) 14:40, 11 March 2013 (UTC)


 * I apologise, I edit most of the time on my phone, which doesn't allow me to deal with particularly large blocks of text.


 * I have been thinking about this over the past few days, trying to see both sides of my arguments. One of the wilder stories I heard was that North Korea had ordered a number of giant rabbits (yes, they exist, and they're about as big as a dog!) ostensibly to deal with its famine problem. Supposedly they all got eaten in a banquet by you know who and his friends. The other issue I have is that even though the place is just about collapsing, they must have some science expertise. Where are they getting it from? Is it their own education system or are their scientists being educated abroad? I say this, because even to launch a rocket, or you need to have some.-Albannach (talk) 17:28, 15 March 2013 (UTC)
 * It's called China. & The evidence from people who've escaped the country (And the fact people are itching to escape the country in the first place) is the country is a hell hole as bad as most people think. --MikallakiM 17:30, 15 March 2013 (UTC)


 * Used to be China. The PRC and Russia haven't given them much support in recent times, so that doesn't explain everything. China doesn't get anything out of this anymore other than Korean War memories. South Korea is an American satellite, fair enough but the PRC has no reason to stoke up tension. NK could easily go down the same route as PRC and Vietnam, if needed... and would be a massive sweat shop pool of cheap labour, if it opened up.-Albannach (talk) 18:03, 15 March 2013 (UTC)

Saw another example of something I'm not entirely sure of in last couple of days...

28 approved hairstyles for North Koreans? While I'm sure a wild haircut would land you in trouble, it seems to be another case of newspapers copying one another. The same photo of the styles is used in every paper/website and originates with a single Taiwanese newspaper. There's supposedly a TV programme made by NK about this, but the said programmme doesn't seem to exist online. All of which makes me wonder if the entire thing is made up for propaganda purposes.

I believe in the gulags and torture etc but not every single other thing I hear about NK.-Albannach (talk) 08:46, 8 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Who's going to put the program online, and for what audience? How many North Koreans have access to the Internet?--ZooGuard (talk) 16:52, 8 April 2013 (UTC)

If the place is so bad...
... Why does it say this on its website?:

"The Democratic People's Republic of Korea is a genuine workers' state in which all the people are completely liberated from exploitation and oppression. The workers, peasants, soldiers and intellectuals are the true masters of their destiny and are in a unique position to defend their interests.

Answer that Uncle Sam. Scherben (talk) 20:30, 18 April 2013 (UTC)
 * This made me laugh way more than it should have. ClothCoat (talk) 19:12, 10 February 2014 (UTC)

Reunification
In the article it says:

"Add to that the fact that the annexation of North Korea could be the single largest humanitarian crisis in history, and there is a strong disincentive for NATO to go to war. South Korea keeps up appearances, but taking on millions of unfed, untrained peasants may well destroy its economy for decades."

And in the note for this assertion it says,

"Reunification of the Koreas is a noble ideal, and might be seen in our lifetimes, but trying a repeat of West and East Germany will be downright impossible."

I'd like an actual citation for this. It seems to me that there would be an outpouring of support from around the world for newly-annexed North Korea like there has been for other humanitarian crises. Why, exactly, is it that "trying a repeat of West and East Germany will be downright impossible"? In what sense will it be impossible? The Moose (talk) 18:47, 10 February 2014 (UTC)


 * Because both Germanies were industrialized countries. Even so, the wealth difference was so large that reconstruction of the East basically absolutely crippled the German economy for an entire decade or more, and even now prosperity standards in East Germany are considerably lower. And yet, seen from a global perspective, the two Germanies were basically on the same economical level. North and South Korea just aren't. North Korea is a piss-poor agrarian state with repeative bouts of starvations. Could a reunited Korea manage to keep all those people fed? Probably yeah. But bringing up North Korea to a comparable economical level than South Korea would absolutely, completely destroy the South Korean economy. It would be a money drain the world hasn't seen before.
 * Reason 2: Communist propaganda in East Germany was inefficient. Nearly the whole country had access to West German media. They all knew what was going on. This is not true in North Korea, the most isolated country in the world. From what we can tell, people inside North Korea (at least in rural areas) honestly believe the state propaganda, honestly see the Kims as something akin to gods - simply because they have no alternative input of information available to them! The North Korean government can basically control what they know and what they are to believe to near-100% levels. Now, how do you deprogram a population of over 20m people? How do you integrate such a population, most of them with zero education, too, into a democracy?
 * In short, it would be like trying to unite Canada and the Democratic Republic of Congo - that would ruin Canada both economically and politically. The same is true here. Octo8 (talk) 18:56, 10 February 2014 (UTC)