Talk:Holodomor

Famine Section Lacks Citations
Someone should probably prop up the famine section with a citation or three. The section seems to lack any
 * wp:WP:SOFIXIT EK (talk) 12:00, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Richard spencer
super pleased this article takes the time to tell me what a neo nazi no mark think of holodomor. i would have up all night worrying he thought otherwise. AMassiveGay (talk) 20:30, 27 July 2020 (UTC)
 * It doesn't seem to randomly ask Richard Spencer for his hot take but seem to say there's disagreement among Nazis if the Holodomor did happen. I can imagine we can try to point out a hole in their logic in terms of what genocides they can conveniently deny, but it might be just poorly conveyed. 20:34, 27 July 2020 (UTC)

About the David Duke quote
Should we have strikeouts in a direct quote? It feels wrong, but I know this wiki loves snark so I thought I should bring it up first.-Flandres (talk) 17:58, 27 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I think context makes it clear that the strikeout parts aren't part of the original quote. However, I'm still fine with removing it if you want to do so. 18:47, 27 August 2020 (UTC)

SKP do not deny that it happened
Hi. In the introduction it is claimed that the Swedish Communist Party denies that the Holodomor happened (archive.org link of the page in question). As a Swedish speaker I question this assertion. From SKP's site:
 * Roughly 2,5 million people died in Ukraine from starvation and decease during the worst period.

This is clearly an admission that it happened. What is denied however is that the CPSU under Stalin deliberately caused the famine and that they targeted Ukrainians in particular. The latter would obviously constitute genocide. The section "Blunder or murder?" points out that the Holodomor not being a genocide is indeed a possibility. This is an issue that is debated in the academic literature to this day, and when reading the literature one must be aware of the historikerstreit and Ernst Nolte's "double genocide" narrative (a form of Holocaust denial). I will remove the mention in the introduction in a couple of days if I receive no objections. Folköl (talk) 19:15, 25 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I think you are correct that the SKP did not deny the Holodomor. The main problem from what I have seen from that page in Google translate is engagement in Soviet apologetics. For example, they cite as authoritative, when there are some doubts about his scholarship, having himself been called a Soviet apologist.

Myten om folkmordssvälten i Ukraina avslöjades en gång för alla av en kanadensisk journalist vid namn Douglas Tottle i Fraud, famine and fascism - The Ukrainian genocide myth from Hitler to Harvard, Progress Books, Toronto, 1987. Boken är ett imponerande exempel på historisk forskning, med omfattande dokumentation av citat och fotografier samt tydliga källhänvisningar.
 * Bongolian (talk) 01:10, 26 July 2022 (UTC)
 * They do indeed cite Tottle, and it should be noted that his book was published before 1989 and so necessarily lacks the kind of sources that modern research on this topic has access to, in particular the Soviet archives. But modern research also backs up Tottle's view, for example the works of Kristen Ghodsee and J. Arch Getty. Sneers like "apologist" are little more than ad hominem attacks that, unfortunately, serves a Holocaust denialist purpose. See the Seventy Years Declaration. Folköl (talk) 11:42, 27 July 2022 (UTC)

Should there be a page for Holodomor denial?
I feel like we should have a page for Holodomor denial since (like Holocaust denial) it is common amongst red fascist circles (and occasionally neo-nazi circles as well). Rational Dude (talk) 05:38, 30 December 2022 (UTC)
 * We already have Stalin apologetics. Plutocow (talk) 07:58, 30 December 2022 (UTC)
 * My bad, I forgot about that. Rational Dude (talk) 05:36, 31 December 2022 (UTC)

Funny
This article is very funny to me, as it seems to use anti communist propaganda, especially propaganda used from the 90's by fascists, neo nazis and anti communists, and it doesnt mention how Kazakhstan suffered worse than Ukrainian, and how did the supposed genocide start? What was the reason for it? What were the effects of it? It seems to be missing alot haha