Conservapedia talk:What is going on at CP?/Archive320

What isn't on CP, part 94
I must have missed coverage of this story on CP. Will Schlafly declare Francis to be a liberal and Pope In Name Only? Cardinal Fang (talk) 20:29, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Do you think Ken will use this to denounce all Catholics as fake Christians? Some of his rants I've seen came somewhat close to doing so. - 79.177.22.17 (talk) 20:38, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * He can't actually come out and say Catholics aren't Christians as long as Schlafly is posting about how Catholicism is TEH FUTURE on the front page. He's too much of coward to ever say to the face of someone like Andy or Ed how they're satan's dupes and should become proper protestants like him. -- 20:42, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, by the normal Christian standard taken by most denominations Ed is by far a greater apostate than liberal Christians who are pro gay rights and pro choice. EDIT: You know what? I think Ken has enough sway on that website in order to banish Ed Poor once and for good. Should a war break between the two, Schlafly's interest is clearly to take Conservative's side. Ed does almost nothing by now, while killing Ken would make CP even more of a ghost town. I looked at CP's 500 recent changes, and almost all activity is comming from him. - 79.177.22.17 (talk) 20:47, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * This is clearly a case of Pope Francis caving to the Gay Agenda. That or the Obama administration put pressure on the Vatican. --Inquisitor (talk) 21:40, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Schlafly finally managed to figure out how to spin the Pope's remarks. Props to the lamestream media for helping him out. With that being said, the willingness of Pope Francis to accept celibate yet homosexual clergy stands in contrast to his predecessor's opposition to homosexuals serving as priests. Also, I don't see how Schalfly reconciles Francis's statements with CP's claims that the current Pope seeks to expel the "gay lobby" from the Vatican. - 79.177.22.17 (talk) 19:19, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I finally managed to get into CP to see now Schlafly reacted to Francis' statement. It's definitely Newspeak: when the Pope says one thing, he really means the opposite. Well, if Schlafly really does believethe Pope is (still) right, I look forward to seeing CP say there's no gay conspiracy after all and that gays should be treated nicely, just like anyone else. Cardinal Fang (talk) 23:13, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Alexa
The only Alexa graph for cp that shows a significant anomaly for July is bounce %, which is soaring. Does this suggest that even though the site is blocked for so many now, their attempts to connect are still being logged by alexa as a single pageview?
 * You're mistaking Alexa for real data. It's mysterious algorithmically generated bullshit, based on a sample size of approximately zero people. How on earth would they know what CP's bounce rate is? -- 22:50, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I thought they knew because it is extrapolated from the people who install their toolbar. Since they are owned by Amazon now I would have expected at least some credibility.
 * Does any sane person actually deliberately install those toolbars and keep them? I have had a few and have removed every one, finding them just be a waste of screen real estate; yet I've seen some people with multiple toolbars taking up nearly half their browser screen. Is there a useful toolbar that I am missing?  Генгис silverbrain.png 07:56, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I spend a small but significant proportion of my work removing toolbars in web browsers. Many of them are malware and are back doors for all sorts of undesirable crap that hammers resources and chews up bandwidth. Ajkgordon (talk) 08:42, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * That was my opinion too, but I didn't want to overgeneralise. Генгис silverbrain.png 11:05, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

Offline
CP is offline AGAIN. Proxima Centauri (talk) 08:08, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * You might be getting the same error many others (as well as myself) are getting due to your IP. It's timing out or you get a blank page entirely. Need to use a proxy to view the site, but even then I get random 500 errors when viewing RC or something. Andy's talkpage has several new and old users complaining that they can't view the site either, without the aid of TOR or proxy. [[Image:AndyToad.gif|20px]]Norseman  Cyser Melomel  11:59, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I haven't been able to raise it for over a week now. Not terribly distressed by this. Scream!! (talk) 13:14, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * For an elderly man that shouldn't be too surprising. PongoOrangutans are sceptical 15:06, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Heh, another one of my IP addresses has also been added to the list of doom. Welp, plenty more where that came from. I see we missed a Kendoll shoutout. Seriously, Ken, you need to leave those there for a couple of days. You can't rely on us wandering past in the 5 minutes you put them up. Surely you want us to read your words of "wisdom"? -- 14:31, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Anonymous may have CP in their sights. FEAR Anonymous! Proxima Centauri (talk) 15:01, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Wait, wait, some guy, three weeks ago, makes a bunch of edits on the talk page of a known troll that have the word "Anonymous" in them, and you figure that "Anonymous" is targeting CP? Dear, dear Proxy. Your Occam's razor needs sharpening, I fear. Listening to Ella Fitzgerald sing "Baby, if I'm the bottom, you're the top" is very different  after reading Dan Savage's column. .silverbrain.png 15:31, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * The error/blank page is actually an improvement on Conservapedia. --Night Jaguar (talk) 20:09, 21 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I haven't had access to CP in my home (in a Boston suburb) for some time. I have no problems when I'm on Cape Cod.  Pretty odd. Phiwum (talk) 13:00, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Honestly, the "anonymous" group does seem significantly overrated. A couple of agitated hackers with a penchant for mayhem, and a smattering of ridiculous guy fawkes masks really does not have the political impact that they hope they do. Furthermore, the threat of "Anonymous is coming to get you!" seemed analogous to the threats levelled by disgruntled todlers when denied treats. Regarding the spotty connection from your IPs, some other users have informed me that perhaps Mr. Schlafly has gone a bit overboard with blocking spammer IPs, although I found it strange when he blocked my block here in the UK. Brenden (talk) 20:07, 22 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Hiya Brendan, User Ryancsh here, could you check to make sure my I.P. address isn't blocked? Having the same issues here in that connection keeps timing out and I didn't think it a coincidence that it started happening a day after I got into an argument with Ken
 * I don't have checkuser. At any rate, blocks on the wiki side have no effect on your connection. I suspect that Mr. Schlafly has run into some trouble with his attempts at blocking spammers at the firewall level. Regarding the likelyhood of displeasing user:C resulting in your block, I don't feel that user:C has the influence over Mr. Schlafly on that level, to be able to access the server itself. Furthermore, I suspect that user:C does not have the technical competence in carefully blocking your range from even accessing the site, and making it look like an accident. Brenden (talk) 17:12, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

Question
I wonder if we can get a sense of how much of the English-speaking world is unable to view CP. Can you raise CP from where you are (and, if you don't mind, where, roughly, are you these days?)
 * It has nothing to do with location. I think there's a black list at the Apache layer or lower.  I'm now wondering if any of several criteria can get an IP on the list (proxy, referred from RW, etc.).  I know CP had been aggressively running wikimedia proxyblocker code (the calls to CP:BlockMe show up in any web server running at an IP that accessed CP).  It would be trivial to add IPs that follow links to CP from RW to that black list.  There's probably a white list for the Select, so they can lurk here.  When someone (like Brenden) complains about being blocked, Andy can add him to the white list. This is all just musing, but something's going on. Whoover (talk) 06:53, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes


 * Glasgow, UK, AoL. Brenden (talk) 17:04, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Half way between Berlin and Brussels --Fergus Mason If in the first act you have hung a pistol on the wall, then in the following one it should be fired. Otherwise don't put it there. - Anton Chekov 08:08, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Central Massachusetts. Main page loads promptly. Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 08:13, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * SW France and SE UK. Ajkgordon (talk) 09:24, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Cambridge UK - it came back yesterday after being inaccessible for a few days. Cantabrigian (talk) 09:26, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Southwestern Vermont. Was having trouble the last few days, but able to access it today. Jared (talk) 15:57, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Can read it fine on Cape Cod. Phiwum (talk) 18:07, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Works fine in South Florida Ayzmo (talk) 00:50, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Chicago. I wish he would block me. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 00:52, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * No problems here in Nevada.  Wehpudicabok   [話]   [変]  03:27, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Midlands UK, and all these work: A domestic Zen ADSL service, a domestic BeThere ADSL service, a commercial VPS service in a Simply Transit data centre, and from a pay as you go Three mobile phone. The final one is effectively anonymous internet access (at least for civil action against the IP, and even criminal it'd probably need to be rather serious). 92.40.255.80 (talk) 16:24, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * South Wales reporting in. -- Certified   Sick Bastard  21:21, 29 July 2013 (UTC)
 * No


 * PSandL, Quebec. Listening to Ella Fitzgerald sing "Baby, if I'm the bottom, you're the top" is very different  after reading Dan Savage's column. .silverbrain.png 03:48, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * London, England--. Main page loaded then none of the other pages loaded. Timed out--Buscombe (talk) 09:55, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Hipocrite, NYC. Intentional block of the largest single-market ISP in the world (Time Warner Cable NYC). Hipocrite (talk) 14:45, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * My previous "yes" was around four in the morning here. Now midday or forenoon, and their main page timed out, as did a click or two from the WIGO. Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 15:24, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Haifa, Israel. Works fine on proxy but not from my actual IP. - ConservapediaMarkman (talk) 16:11, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Markman, I just saw your block of Nate Keaton and wanted to tell you that you really are an utterly despicable cock.--Fergus Mason If in the first act you have hung a pistol on the wall, then in the following one it should be fired. Otherwise don't put it there. - Anton Chekov 20:05, 24 July 2013 (UTC)


 * Poznan, Poland. Timeout on main page. Open minded (talk) 17:33, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Can't read it in Arlington MA (Boston suburb). Phiwum (talk) 18:07, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Edinburgh and surrounding areas, UK. Times out on both office and home computers. I don’t read Ken’s blog and so don’t know if atheism has been defeated yet. JumboWhales (talk) 22:33, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Nova Scotia, Canada. Entire website consistently fails to load. —ShadowFan-X 23:52, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Hamilton, NZ. Haven't been able to login for a week or two (and don't really miss it either).DamoHi 00:16, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Been gone for days. Southeast NH.  ħ uman  03:19, 24 July 2013 (UTC) (oops, missed the "sometimes" header).  I miss my main news feed of hate, stupidity, and sideways links to RW. :(
 * Paderborn, Germany, but also couldn't load RW for quite some time. 194.246.46.15 (talk) 06:18, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Surrey, England, BT internet. It's been down for pretty much since the weekend here.  RW's been patchy too.  Every other website I've visited - work and personal - and software working fine.  London Grump (talk) 06:43, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm in SW Illinois and it's been consistently off for me for about a month. --Allosaurus (talk) 13:28, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Wisconsin now although Illinois was still connecting until today; I guess Kara didn't like my criticisms. :P Keep blocking more and more of the country guys. --BMcP - Just an astronomy guy 19:37, 25 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Central Wisconsin since the start of this round of new blocks. 192․168․1․42 (talk) 09:35, 26 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Sometimes


 * Reading at home, Basingstoke at work. Both UK.  And cp is up and down like the proverbials.  I can acces it one minute and not the next.  And this is only recently, for the past 2 weeks I could only access by using proxies.  Oldusgitus (talk) 17:32, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes through last night, but times out since this morning. Eastern Iowa.--Martin Arrowsmith (talk) 02:57, 24 July 2013 (UTC)
 * He blocked AT&T wireless. Watching him shut his site off from the outside world is always a surprise considering his rankings have been steadily declining for a long time. Even his Troll in Chief, Markman has to use a proxy. Weird strategy for success. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 16:50, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Unfortunately my ISP still has access to the CessPit. Forgive me for speaking for the community at large but I think that many of us originally engaged with Conservapedia back in 2007 with the intent of either making it untrustworthy or at least, not available to impressionable minds. On reflection we have a partial success but the general demise of Conservapedia, and its relegation to the nether regions of the Internet, has been accomplished by those very individuals who actively try to defend it. Clickbot (talk) 19:30, 28 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Toronto, the 5th largest frikin' city in North America. For a while I could, but not now.Civic Cat sig 2.PNG Talk to Civic Cat   23:38, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Anger bear again
Oh dear goat anger bear, you are heading towards ken style idiocy here. Really, try to pull yourself together. And considering you posted that in the middle of the night whilst sitting back on your state pension whilst I am actually working as a database developer in a real company I do think you ought to look into the mirror occassionally. Oldusgitus (talk) 10:34, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * So the core of CP is now Ken and Kara capering for our amusement, Terry spamming his site and I presume Andy crying himself to sleep over what might have been. A sad end to an even sadder site. -- 10:55, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * And don't forget Iduan and markman playing at their 'who has the biggest willy' contest. Oldusgitus (talk) 11:00, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * He also updated his previous post and quoted some of the commments from the section above (minus the "foul language"). Since Karajou is reading here: FUCKNUTS, YOUR IGNORANCE IS NOT EVIDENCE AGAINST EVOLUTION. Your moronic experiment would prove nothing since Darwinian evolution says populations evolve, not individuals. Your intellectual dishonesty shows how weak your position is. Why don't you join Ken and start writing about Hispanic/Asian women, flying kitties and bestiality? It might be less embarrassing for you. As for giraffe fossils, you can start your research here. --Night Jaguar (talk) 11:19, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Ah, but you have to understand. Popeye has educated himself to the FULLEST EXTENT, which enables him to understand evolution better than qualified biologists working in the field and certainly better than us rank amateurs. Of course we're ignorant compared to the great Swabbie, after all the Swabbie would never say "fuck." -- 11:45, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * According to Swabbie you're a robotic butler named Otis, so I guess it must be true. --Night Jaguar (talk) 11:55, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I may be a robot butler, but you should see what I have plugged in to my groinal socket. -- 12:03, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * To the FULLEST EXTENT possible of course at the expense of the US government and taxpayer. You know, the one which popeye so opposes taxing him because he's not the one spending the taxpayers dollar this time. Oldusgitus (talk) 12:14, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * That's brilliant! He should do it again. He thinks he's mocking science. Whereas in effect he's mocking himself. It's like having a player on the opposing team scoring own-goals. Ajkgordon (talk) 12:19, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * More like, running round celebrating after scoring an own goal. Генгис silverbrain.png 13:05, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

His wild, impotent rage is both sad and adorable. One thing though, my friend - "'Apparently, the silly little amateurs collectively-named Otis are under the impression that I, and everyone else on the planet, must accept their version of science, specifically in the creation of life'" Nobody has said that. By all means, let's discuss science! The idea of the scientific method is that everyone should at all times be trying to poke holes in theories. My only request is that if you are trying to discredit evolution, you should be talking about evolution. When you say, "Yup, Lamarck's theory is definitely wrong," that says nothing about our modern understanding of evolution, because Lamarckism has already been discreditied. It would be like me saying "Nobody's ever been able to prove that the Four Humors exist. Therefore, vaccinations cause cancer." Carlaugust (talk) 12:52, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Of course, his phrase "their version of science" shows again that he doesn't understand science. Science is a methodology, a toolkit if you like, to develop testable explanations (or theories) that best fit observed phenomena. Nobody has observed organisms spontaneously evolving a long neck to eat leaves previously out of reach, so no explanation has been forthcoming. But they have observed changes in populations of organisms over generations to adapt to their environment through the pressures of selection. Explanations to describe how this process works have been many and varied. But the ones that best explain the empirical evidence through testing and prediction are the ones that make up evolutionary theory. While he might disagree with science itself, e.g. lamenting the exclusion of supernaturalism or the Bible as the inerrant Word of God, the methodology has served us well and continues to do so. Evolutionary biology produces a population of explanations, hypotheses and ideas, which itself evolves. It adapts to new observations and evidence and shows up creationism for what it is - dogma. Ajkgordon (talk) 17:16, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

I always figure they wait with baited breath during our fundraisers hoping we fail to raise enough to keep the site going. Its there last great hope, now that we are immensily more relevant then their little site trying to "outlive" us is about all that's left. Such a strong initial response to our calls for aid has got to sting. Ken usually is good for a blog post or two about how we haven't reached our goal because athesit are uncharitable as well. Tmtoulouse (talk) 20:26, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it kind of blew up fast this time. Ken didn't even have time for his traditional "THEY HAVE ONLY RAISED 3 DOLLARS!" post an hour after the fundraiser starts. -- 20:41, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Is CP dead?
I haven't been able to get my fix of wingnut humour since about this time yesterday. Is CP broken or am I the victim of the paranoid purge of IP addresses? I've got a BT connection in the vicinity of Dorchester (Dorset), UK. Can anyone else see CP just now? Cardinal Fang (talk) 19:09, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I can.  19:11, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * It's not dead, Andy's just been feverishly adding the IP of everyone who visits to his firewall's ban list. So far he's got 4 of my IPs, and as far as I can tell he's even managed to ban his good buddy Markman. I have no idea what he's playing at, but if he's looking to stop the world reading CP then there's a whole load more efficient ways he can go about it. -- 19:46, 30 July 2013 (UTC)

On a lark I decided to test this proposition by choosing randomly from a very large proxy list and doing header requests for random CP pages. There didn't seem to be a maximum number of clicks each proxy was permitted. A large percentage were blocked server side within a minute or so. I'll do the analysis if people really care. He hasn't just banned proxies though, as people are saying, so I don't understand what he thinks he's doing. 198.245.50.171 (talk) 19:57, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * You assume andy thinks. For me - I go to cp from here but I also go directly. So if he is checking server logs he will see me coming directly and as refered.  But he unblocked my ip when I asked him to though.  I go with stupidity, not malice to be honest. Oldusgitus (talk) 20:16, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Another clue is that cookies are involved. If you allow cookies, a proxy gets banned very quickly.  If you don't, it seems to work forever.
 * That's interesting. I've blocked cookies from CP in my browser. I'll see if this IP lasts longer than the others I've used. -- 21:09, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * So, theoretically, one could log in from various proxies w/cookies from a variety of different IP ranges and slowly have them blocked over time, eventually to the point where no one can see his site at all (granted, this would take a lot of effort given the size of the IP4 protocol)? Or is he not doing range blocking?  --Seth Peck (talk) 21:24, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * No, he's blocking individual IPs. -- 21:34, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't think he has a developer and he definitely doesn't know how to set cookies or set up Apache rules to block connections with RW as the referral in the header. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 23:16, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * He seems to be using some Singlehop firewall/security protocols. When an IP is banned, it can't even ping conservapedia.com.  If you do a tracert from a banned IP, it gets to the penultimate hop, which is a Singlehop server and goes no further. Whoover (talk) 23:49, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * It just occurred to me that one way to block proxies uses regexing user agent strings. My understanding is that Tor and the common web-based proxy servers all set their own user-agent strings. This only takes a few lines of Apache from what I can see. Unrelated: I use to fuck with TK by putting stuff meant for him in my user-agent string because it shows up in MW checkuser queries. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 00:05, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * It can't be at the Apache level because a blocked IP can't ping www.conservapedia.com but an unblocked IP can. An Apache block wouldn't affect ping.  Ergo, it's at the firewall level. Whoover (talk) 00:55, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Naup. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 03:09, 31 July 2013 (UTC)CP ping Screen Shot 2013-07-30 at 10.06.19 PM.png


 * When I used to care, I used to spoof my referrer to CP as redhotchristianchicks.com or something similar. Генгис silverbrain.png 06:50, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

Wow. TK did his best to block the world, but Andy's really achieving the dream. They had less than a dozen edits yesterday. Incredible. -- 09:40, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Can't get CP either now without using a proxy either now. I did have a look and it seems PJR's site is still working (He must have fixed those issues). I wonder which will completely die first. I'm betting it will be CP. I wonder if the global fight against atheism will then be based at ASK. EDIT, Fuck you to whoever posted those ASCII images of gaped rectums on ASK. Ghost (talk) 13:47, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I can get to CP only by using Google Chrome with bandwidth reduction enabled (as essentially Google downloads the page for you and sends you a compressed version of it). StarFish (talk) 18:46, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Quite a lot of the techy stuff above is way out of my comfort zone. But the THM seems to be that Schlafly has decided that the best way for the world to read his Truthful Encyclopedia is to prevent the world from reading it... I shall find something else to laugh at (not CNAV - too sick-making). Cardinal Fang (talk) 21:34, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * The reports that CP is dead have been exaggerated, but not by much and I do think it is dying. This must terrify Ken. After his behavior and abuse of power as a sysop he knows that he will never be given that sort of authority again, even at a complete wackjob website. Any attempts at subterfuge will be spotted a mile off which means he will have to post from outside of his safety zone.--Mercian (talk) 15:27, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Today in CP: Ken made two edits to an article, several edits to his userspace, one edit to another user's talk page and several more to mainpage right. Karajou blocked some people. That is all. - 79.177.1.27 (talk) 20:35, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

Conservative news and views
It's all the black peoples' fault.  --2.220.230.224 (talk) 22:02, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * "...and in spades – pun definitely intended." That's pretty unambiguous. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 22:05, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Wow....just...I don't...umm...wow. Acei9 22:24, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh It's Nick Skin-disease, who's no only a thoroughly vile excuse for a human being, but also more batshit insane than Hurlbut. Still good to see the company Terry is keeping. -- PsyGremlin Prata! 22:34, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * I actually kind of agreed with something he said last week, but now he's managed to reduce my opinion of him back to rock bottom. Yep, Mr. The Eagle is certainly a racist, delusional scumbag. Anyone who decides to start an article on race relations with a racist slur is definitely marking themselves out as not serious. -- 22:52, 30 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Chuckarse's blog is such ordure that I don't go there now unless it's to follow a comment from here. So I was pleased to see an enormous Marvel banner ad almost completely obscure the page title, a large SiteLock certification covering the bottom right, and multiple Astrolove ads down the right hand side. Генгис silverbrain.png 06:58, 31 July 2013 (UTC)

I do love the irony in this one of Terry's, though. "You can't make this up" while linking to an article that clearly was just made up. Nothing like that ol' Hurlbut obliviousness and gullibility. Although it's a pretty boring place now that there aren't any commenters. --Kels (talk) 00:34, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Karajou forgets he's a creationist
Psst, Popeye, ix-nay on the elative-ray. You're not supposed to let on that one species is related to another, they're all separate acts of magic 6000 years ago, remember? I suppose it's just a sloppy copy-paste job from some unacknowledged source just like every half-arsed thing he does, but still amusing for someone who just got done arguing the giraffe didn't have any relatives in the fossil record. -- 20:05, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Is CP down?
'cause I can't get it. Talk to Civic Cat   23:07, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * No. Andy has been blocking quite a lot of users from even viewing his site. It's a good growth strategy. Olé olé olé. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 23:08, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Guess that Canadian conservatives are S.O.L. What a buncha ingrates those Conservapedians. Our right wing mayor is part of a family that has a business that opened a plant in New Jersey, and this is the thanks we get?!? Andrew Schlafly or your minions, if you are reading this, this Canadian says you are a worthless puke!! Fuck Conservapedia! Long live Canada! (Long Live Stompin' Tom!)Civic Cat sig 2.PNG Talk to Civic Cat   23:31, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Considering how many edits they've had in the last few days, I think everyone who tries to view the site is SOL regardless of their political opinions. Andy seems to have gone some new species of mental and is blocking everyone who so much as dares view the site. For those who can't see what is going on, all the editing has dried up. There have been like 2 edits from non-sysops all day, and there weren't many more yesterday either. I'd like to encourage Andy in his insanity. I can't imagine what he thinks he's trying to accomplish though... maybe this is his way of turning off CP without ever having to say he was wrong? -- 23:44, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Could be. I really don't believe Andy is as much of a turd as e.g. Hurlbut (my contempt for that man has got so deep I can no longer be bothered to abuse his surname). He isn't obviously racist - some of his heroes include Clarence Thomas and Herman Cain - so I hope he's embarrassed by the shit posted on his website by Hurlbut and his gang. And perhaps someone has pointed out that Conservative's antics don't add to the credibility of the conservative cause. Someone with more of a backbone would have zapped Hurlbut, Conservative and several others years ago but perhaps Andy, poor little rock-pool dweller that he is, has decided just to make it impossible for anyone to see what he's been wasting a fraction of his family's wealth on. There's surely a market for a genuine encyclopedia from a conservative point of view to which well-known conservatives contribute, but I suspect he won't be able to set such a site up because the way he has handled the long slow death of CP means, in his own words, he has lost all credibility. Cardinal Fang (talk) 23:58, 31 July 2013 (UTC)
 * It could have been a reasonable, if still nutty, site if he'd only let his homskollars sign up and edit. But he had to have delusions of grandeur about how CP was going to be this big thing that would correct the bias in wikipedia. So he attracted the nutters from the internet, the Terrys and Kendolls and Eds of the world. The people too crazy for wikipedia basically. Now there's no homskolling and no article writing, and a bunch of episilon grade morons bleating pathetically for our attention as the only audience they have. Ah, it's like karma or something. -- 00:05, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Indeed. Our mayor also gets a lot of flak from the media--a good chunk of it deserved--the crack smoking allegations and the fat jokes, but does he wimp out? No. I guess that Andrew Schlafly doesn't have his stamina. And to think that George Strombolopolous gave this coward air time on Canadian tax-payer funded CBC. At least he gave he gave Henry Rollins 150% more time.Civic Cat sig 2.PNG Talk to Civic Cat   00:07, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

To CivicCat: Here in La Belle Province, my apartment can't get CP (on Bell internet, I believe, I'm borrowing a neighbour's signal) since about a month now. However, today I could raise it from the library. You may still have luck. If you think that's lucky. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?. 00:09, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I got it about an hour ago--to check on the edit count. Then no more.Civic Cat sig 2.PNG Talk to Civic Cat   00:12, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Jeeves, I see nothing wrong with a homeskoolers' encyclopedia. It could be quite a good learning exercise, getting them to organise and present what they've learnt in a systematic manner. But to make it a success, he would need to be ruthless in removing creeps/trolls like TK, Hurlbut and "Conservative". Cardinal Fang (talk) 19:53, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

The Homskollar days were actually a lot of fun. We worked together building the foundations of the classical music section, and also worked on the building trades. There's nothing so much fun as an empty wiki encyclopedia once you realize the rules aren't real. But back on topic. I can't get CP from here, but can get there from next door. Next test - going there next door from a link on RW. Will report tomorrow.  ħ uman  04:03, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

Brilliant! Majestic! Genius!
Andy seems to have managed to firewall of CP from all the legitimate users while leaving it wide open to the spammers. Has Andy been infected by some sort of brain parasite that causes him to want to destroy his creation? -- 03:16, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * You may actually be not too far from the truth here. It is much easier to blame the downfall of your pet project on spammers than ineptitude. Schlafly may be having a horrible dawning realisation that CP has failed at pretty much everything and be looking for ways out. Tielec01 (talk) 03:29, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * This is really weird. Andy is always bragging about page views and greatly exaggerating CP's importance (to the point of delusion). Why start blocking a good chunk of people from viewing the site now? TK's asshole block behavior was understandable. This, I don't get. --Night Jaguar (talk) 04:20, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Never ascribe to intent what could be adequately explained by being the perfect storm of ignorance, delusion and stupidity. --Sasayaki (talk) 05:25, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ken's not going to be happy now that the views via his link bait on CP are drying up. Tacitus (talk) 06:49, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I can still see it here in socialist England. Ajkgordon (talk) 08:06, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I haven't seen it for a month in t'desolate bits of England. I am bearing up bravely! Scream!! (talk) 08:21, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I find it works fine through Google Chrome with Bandwidth reduction enabled. StarFish (talk) 09:53, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

I really think it's something like "ban any IP that returns a cookie that shows it has visited rationalwiki." It may not be that exactly, but that simple algorithm explains much. First, it's why, if your haven't been blocked yet, don't access CP unless you set your browser's privacy setting to "No cookies." Then CP won't be able to confirm you've been here. Second, it shows that he's not blocking vast swathes of the world, only the people who are reading this. Since most of CP's audience, I believe, are people who treat it as a humor site and have found RW, I would expect his audience to shrink greatly. Whoover (talk) 11:48, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I accept cookies and regularly follow links to CP. I just tried it for the hell of it, I have no problems getting there and reading. I'm in South Florida on Comcast. Ayzmo (talk) 12:01, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Has anyone asked Andy yet what the fuck is going on? --Night Jaguar (talk) 13:04, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Several people. He's doing his usual ostrich impression. I'm not sure if that means he knows what's going on and intends it, or that he doesn't know what's going on and has no clue how to fix it. -- 13:16, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm sure it's intentional. He is uncharacteristically courteous when people ask to be unblocked. His language reminds me of the last time he deliberately blocked IPs from viewing. I think there is something in one of the leaked Special Discussion Groups about it. There are plenty of ways around it though, I have to say being a lazy, liberal, pot smoking, slacker I can't really be bothered. StarFish (talk) 13:21, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thankfully, that's not how cookies work Whoover. A site can't see another site's cookies. Not just can't read their contents (you usually can't either - they're hashed before you get them), but doesn't know they're there. Sites don't ask for cookies, browsers send them. That's why they are limited in size and number. If you turn cookies off on a wiki, all that you'll notice is you can't stay logged in. That's because it's sticking an encrypted user ID in a session cookie. Andy definitely can see that an ip has come from RW from the referrer field in the request header. So open a new browser tab instead of following lins from this site if you haven't been banned and are ok with vastly overestimating Andy's competence. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 13:37, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I still dunno if what's going on is intentional. Fucking up is, after all, Andy's specialty. --Night Jaguar (talk) 13:41, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I don't think he is, but if he were blocking on the basis of the referer field, it'd be fantastic evidence for the theory that everyone on CP is there to troll Andy. Since basically every peon has been a victim of his indiscriminate banhammer, that would mean all of them come from here. -- 14:24, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Does he have a legit webmaster? You can do everything he might be doing in cPanel, but now that I'm failing miserably at Apache and Nginx doing it by hand on Linode, I sort of think you still have to have some idea of what you're doing. Hell, I don't know. He's a smart guy. Maybe he figured it out. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 14:29, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Used to be that CPWebmaster guy, but he hasn't been around in years. My guess would be Andy is doing it now. He hasn't even updated Mediawiki since like 3 years ago (perhaps not coincidentally, around the last time CPWebmaster was seen on wiki), there's probably some juicy security bugs in there. He half-heartedly mastered regex for the spam filter, so he can probably manage cpanel or whatever the host provides him with. -- 15:16, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Curious. I am unable to access CP even after resetting my IP but am able to from my mum's house not a 1/4 mile away, and I am pretty sure our lines run into the same exchange and we have the same ISP.--Mercian (talk) 23:42, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The exchange (I don't know what you mean) and ISP part don't matter. He may be banning blocks of IP addresses, or he may be banning individual IPs based on some criterion we haven't identify, like "breathes." [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 00:13, 2 August 2013 (UTC)

@Nuttyroux, I know how cookies work and haven't worked out the details, but the CP cookie is really a mediawiki cookie. That might be the key to info bleeding over, but I haven't been able to actually trace what's going on. I do know that blocking cookies reliably prevents an IP being blocked. Deleting the CP cookie and not blocking cookies does not. When I get back home I might do some more experimenting but can't right now. Whoover (talk) 12:07, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No. Just no. Cookies are keyed to domains. Conservapedia cookies are only sent to conservapedia. Mediawiki, if it requested anything from mediawiki.org which it doesn't, doesn't have magic pixie dust that lets you send cookies to conservapedia from mediawiki.org or rationalwiki.org or any other site. In any case, since another one of my many, many IP addresses just went up the spout I can safely tell you that not having cookies turned on doesn't magically confer immunity from Andy's dumbhammer. -- 15:36, 2 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I like the phrase "dumbhammer". Someone should tackle writing the article in the CP space.   ħ uman  01:27, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Look at the contents of a session cookie, Whoover. They're hashed against a long string that only the app has. You can't decipher it - only the app that encrypted it can. That doesn't really matter anyway since the browser only lets an app see what unexpired cookies it set itself. Andy doesn't know where you've browsed unless the HTTP referrer field tells his server where you're coming from. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 00:59, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Has Andy managed to block TERRY?
There's been a spectacular amount of nothing going on at CP today. Even on Christmas day, I've never seen it so dead. Like a new item from Kendoll, 2 from Andy and Karajou found some people who signed up ages ago to block. No sysop lite edits, no peons. One new signup who was instantly blocked by the Swabbie. Just... Nothing.

The weirdest thing is that Chuckarse, usually so prompt to spam his shit all over CP, didn't turn up to share Bradlee Dean's latest crap. I wonder if he's been blocked? I don't think he's ever been selective in his spamming before. -- 00:59, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No, he did turn up . It's not worth reading though, typical Dean rubbish where he says everything he hates is somehow against the law without specifying which laws are being broken. Oldusgitus (talk) 05:36, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ah, you're right. Not sure how I missed that. -- 08:15, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * @OldusGitus- His underlying argument is that it's against god's law, and that the US is actually a theocracy because a creator was mentioned in the Declaration of Independence-- "Shut up, Brx." 09:20, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ahh, of course. I should have realised the laws he refers to were his interpretation of some 2000 year old (or so) writings in a fairy tale book.  It really didn't occur to me that he meant that, I genuinely thought he may have meant laws on the statue book - or whatever the US equivalent is.  I've just not got this wingnut think sorted out fully yet.  Thanks. Oldusgitus (talk) 12:36, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I know, I know
We shouldn't do this but really ken, if you are going to correct Brenden on his spelling then please forgive me for pointing out it's 4th and not 4rth. Oldusgitus (talk) 12:05, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * If it hadn't been for that he might have won 3rd prize in the spelling bee.. Cantabrigian (talk) 12:19, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Unless you're beeing totally ironic what's the big deal in winning fourth prize? Hell, I got fourth prize in a Reader's Digest spot-the-ball competition and won a Polaroid camera. Генгис silverbrain.png 12:33, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Of all the children in his school at his grade level, he was the 4th best at spelling. I bet he's got a silver swimming certificate too. I think he boasts about it because, as life achievements go, it's better than his other notable success: lying about books he's going to publish long past the time everyone has figured out it's a lie. -- 13:19, 1 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yep. It made me wince a bit because it comes out of the blue when it's been quite some time since we've had an ides or been breathlessly given news of a Swiss creationist who will see if her friend will do something. he has to talk about himself nonstop. His ego and damaged pride demand it. It's just that when he's not telling a grandiose lie, these little truths bob up to the top of the foam. And by "truth" I mean I'm at least prepared to accept that he entered a spelling bee more than 40 years ago. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 13:47, 1 August 2013 (UTC)

Can someone correct Kendoll? The rule is "i before e unless it isn't". Then his speling proficiency might improov.  ħ uman  02:01, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I am not omniscient, but being a feisty atheist of good conscience I deign not to forfeit my sovereign right to weigh in at my leisure and put a seismic end to the reign of those deficient (albeit ancient) policies reiterated by a neighing, plebeian deity-worshipper; neither shall I feign obeisance to the weird sacred heifers of counterfeit spelling lunacies. So, heigh-ho, let me unveil herein not just one, but eight common exceptions: freight, eiderdown, glacier, caffeine, fancied, height, beige and society. And in the same vein there is a kaleidoscope of assimilated foreign words not agreeing with this heinous dictat, such as: edelweiss, gneiss, dreidel, gesundheit, fahrenheit, reveille, leitmotiv, sheikh, stein, zeitgeist, schlockmeister, sensei, peignoir, geisha, concierge and seine. Now, foreseeing a headache from the inconsistencies of English spelling, I shall search from Beijing to Leicester for some neighbourhood pharmacies wherein I may purchase codeine. Генгис silverbrain.png 14:24, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Nice work.  ħ uman  00:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

How do you register on CP?
Curious about Conservapedia, I tried registering there (with good intentions, mind you!). But it seems that standard procedure is to instantly block anyone who registers for a year or two, even if they haven't made any edits yet. Is there a secret handshake you need to do, or something? Kimberly (talk) 15:19, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * That is pretty much how they roll. CP is dead anyway. Better you spend your time editing here, we could always use the help. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 15:28, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Kimberly - if you are blocked, you can contact Andrew Schlafly conservapedia@zoho.com. If you can change your IP address and really want to edit CP, I recommend to create a new account with a sensible name, and after registration quickly make some minor edits (fix a typo, add an internal wikilink or something like that), the administrators might let you pass. I have to warn that there's very little space for constructive influence in this project. Open minded (talk) 21:25, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Were you KimberlyCarlto? While that doesn't strictly abide by the requirement for just a last initial, they generally let that sort of thing pass.  I consider "KimberlyCarlto" to be a perfectly sensible name, whether it's your actual name or not.  Did you put anything in your user page?  It looks as though you did.  What was it?  Was it "spam", that is, a reference to any URL?  If so, you got what you deserved.  If not, follow the advice given above, either creating the account from a new location or after contacting Andy as advised above.  Make some minor edits to real pages.  Not talk pages, and not your own user or talk pages.  Your user page can come later.
 * If you really want to contribute to a general-interest wiki, you might want to consider Ameriwiki.org.
 * SamHB (talk) 00:41, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * That's not my account SamHB, but in any case thanks for the advice. I've sent Andy a message. Kimberly (talk) 11:21, 4 August 2013 (UTC)

Ran a quick test on the IP "blocking"
I am knocked out. Went next door, typing in cp.com loaded fine. Next day, typed in rw.com. Went to WIGO CP and clicked a link. No go. New tab, tried to type in CP.com, no go. So it definitely a server-based block on IPs coming from RW.  ħ uman  05:54, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm prepared to believe that's coincidence, unless everyone who ever edited CP before came from here. I think he's just blocking his viewers indiscriminately. -- 08:18, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I think it is automated, based on RW being the referrer. I suppose my next test will be to unplug my modem for a bit to try to reset my IP address and run the same test from here.  The ideal test would be someone who can control their IP within some range, bouncing back and forth.  <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  01:15, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Surely CP only gets referrals from RW when someone highlights a particular piece of inanity. With so little happening nowadays I can't see what is the point of even thinking of trying that approach. Especially as most of the activity comprises oversighted Ken poop. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 08:47, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, add another data point that might be a coincidence. Loaded up CP before reading this section, and it loaded just fine. Then clicked a link here, and from then on, all my requests (including the clicked link) completely end up in limbo. Either this really is a coincidence, or they're trying to shut out their only audience. --Sid (talk) 09:15, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

I've been following this issue for a few weeks now, both in my own CP access and by watching this page. It appears to be largely based on whether the IP has ever come to CP with a referrer of RW. But not completely or consistently--there's some randomness and ineptness mixed in. As you would expect. First, it's not necessarily done by huge swaths of IP space. Second, it's not always permanent--IP's sometime mysteriously recover, with no request to Andy or anyone else.

I have two computers at work, on the same network concentrator, showing consecutive IP numbers. They have gone up and down a number of times, and not at the same time. There have been times when one was up and the other was down. I've been careful never to actually log in to CP from either of them, though I certainly click from RW. They're both up as of yesterday.

I use several IP addresses at a college that I sometimes get to. I had been doing my actual editing from there (though now I use a proxy.) They have also gone up and down. They're up as of last night.

My home computer has been down solidly for weeks. Ever since the TK blowup a few years ago (my ISP has changed since then anyway) I've been careful never to log in from here, so this IP address has never been exposed to TK/Karajou's checkuser. But I've clicked there from here many times. They say that Andy is nice about responding to email requests to unblock people's computers, but I'm not about to tell him my IP.

I left a note on Andy's talk page a few days ago (logging in through a proxy) explaining that I think this policy, if it is a policy, is counterproductive. Anyone who reads RW knows how to get around it; it's only the rest of the world that are shut off. I pointed out how edits have dried up, by analyzing the RC log, showing that 500 events cover nearly 5 days, and that only 18 events (3.6%!!!) were actual edits by non-sysops and non-sysop-lites. Andy of course will do nothing.

I also issued a challenge to Cons--this was after he took Brenden to task for a spelling error and told us, yet again, that he won 4th place in a spelling bee--to find an egregious spelling mistake in their "commonly misspelled words" page. And I pointed out that the error has been there for years. Unfortunately, GregG (damn you!) went and fixed it, so we'll never know. I apologize for helping them fix a bug. I know we're not supposed to expose existing parody. Sorry. But I've got lots more, of course.

SamHB (talk) 12:33, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * S'ok, brah, you tried. Conservative actually said he won "4rth place" in a spelling bee, and it was captured in a section above, but he fixed and oversighted it. He's THAT pathetic. However if anyone remembers in the past, someone who mocks another's spelling is allowed to be mocked for their own grammatical errors. Even Andy said that was okay. It's somewhere in his talkpage archive. [[Image:AndyToad.gif|20px]]<font face="Comic Sans"><font color = "Green">Norseman  Cyser Melomel  12:51, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * That misspelling was entered by Uncle Ed in March 2007 . <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 15:42, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Can you capture that? <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  01:56, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you! I suppose I am an idiot for not just doing it myself. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:32, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Shock!
Andy responds. <font color=Blue>Генгис 15:31, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * By which he means he'll ignore your email like he does with all the rest. So basically, to be a user at CP now you have to find this obscure message on Andy's talk page (via a proxy, presumably) and beg him to unblock your IP. Good luck getting your users back, Andy. -- 17:56, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I doubt that he was addressing me. He was addressing his current BFF MexMax  Bugler Markman.  SamHB (talk) 18:21, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Someone take an actual screencap, since, surprise surprise, Capturebot is not working and is probably blocked from CP. I would, but I just tried going to CP directly (not through a RW link) in the first time in several weeks and I'm blocked. I'm Canadian, though, so go fig. Andy, you loon, I just hope that this is making you happy. Ochotona princeps<sup style="color:#0066DD; font-size: 0.7em; font-style: oblique">not a pokémon 19:26, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I've made a text copy (rather than a true screencap) here SamHB (talk) 19:50, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Capturebot appears to have worked and although Andy was responding to Markman I presume the message applies to all. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 02:49, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

regained access to cp
After 2 weeks of not being able to access cp, I now can. Happy days.AMassiveGay (talk) 15:46, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * and in flash, I cannot again. Those fickle scamps. Is it them or is it me? AMassiveGay (talk) 15:51, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's when IP's from the heart of america's conservative jesusland can't access you know you are being targeted. --MikallakiM 16:29, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yep, Andy has instituted a boycott on our behalf. I guess he's trying to push Conservapedia out of Alexa's top 100,000 rankings. --Horace (talk) 22:03, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's a contest. First prize is you get one IP unblocked on CP. Second prize is you get two IPs unblocked. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 22:22, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Third prize is you're fired.--JimBags (talk) 00:36, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * We should thank Mr. Schlafly. Now that many of us can't get Conservapedia we won't be wasting time reading through that garbage for cheap laughs. We can go on to do more productive and fulfilling activities (although we'll probably just waste time at some other site). --Night Jaguar (talk) 01:29, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Would it be too radical to suggest working on non-CP content at RationalWiki? <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 01:59, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Meh, I used to do that, but I got ostracized for it. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  02:46, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that's why you were ostracized, Human--68.230.66.230 (talk) 04:39, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * You think, coward? <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  04:47, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Seems to be back for me. 192․168․1․42 (talk) 04:01, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Operation Block The World is paying off
Ken will be livid, all his hard work undone! CP's alexa rank plummets below 90K on the 7 day rolling average. Granted, it'll take a while for the 3 month average to dump them out of the top 100K, but if this strategy of blocking the world continues CP'll be too small to be worth bothering with by Christmas. -- 13:38, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * CP has been too small to be worth bothering about for years now. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 13:40, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * And yet, according to that Alexa page we supply them with 6.2% of their traffic. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 14:31, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I am sure you added an unintentional decimal point in there. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 14:35, 4 August 2013 (UTC)
 * "Bounce Rate 53.20%" That's not a good thing, right? <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  00:13, 5 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Fun fact: Alexa lists "diagram of feritima prostuma" as one of the top search terms for Conservapedia. If you enter that into Google, the top ten hits are all web analytics sites' entries for Conservapedia. --46.165.221.166 (talk) 03:21, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * …Why? What does that even mean? 04:44, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'll be buggered if I know. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 04:49, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * WTF? --Night Jaguar (talk) 06:33, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

May: 10. June: 8. July:6. The site is dead, and it might be time to mothball this page, or at least to get it off the RW mainpage. It has no significance any more. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  04:53, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * LOL. Even Ken is so concerned about CP walling itself off that he now has to post his shoutouts on an external blog. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 04:56, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Clearly recent events will have a very negative effect on their page views and look set to push them out of the top 100,000 (at which point I think we really can claim that it's all over for them) but does anyone know why their Alexa ranking took such a dive at the start of 2013. I know 2013 is the worst year in history for Atheism but who would have thought CP would cop the collateral damage? StarFish (talk) 07:45, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I assume from the chart that they have dropped out of the top 100K several times but scraped back in, albeit at a lower level each time. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 08:49, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The absolute best thing about this is the lack of transparency, and how it is clearly known that's that the way it should be. No one is hounding Andy for an explanation because anyone who wants to stick around knows better. Andy has always bashed liberals for doing things behind closed doors and self-censoring, it's no surprise it's what he does best. Occasionaluse (talk) 13:31, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Obviously I can't give too much away, but "those in the know" are aware of what Andy is doing and Terry is giving him his expert advice. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 13:47, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ah. Terry's expert advice. That explains the complete fucking dogs dinner he's making of his site. Down to 109K on the Alexa 7 day now. Snork. -- 16:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Apparently this means karajou isn't "in the know"... and I realized how redundant that phrase is while I was typing it.
 * I've actually stopped having trouble accessing Conservapedia now for a few days. I still get the odd hiccup, but it's much better. Shakedangle (talk) 18:37, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Meanwhile, on the other side of town
I don't put much store in Alexa metrics but while CP has plummeted to a Global rank of 84,198 and US rank of 21,993, RationalWiki now has a global rank of 34,089 and a US rank of 10,227, which appears to be our highest to date. <font color=Blue>Генгис 05:33, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I also notice that currently the top search term leading here is not "project blue beam" but "rice puller", which is probably why there is so much traffic from India. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 05:46, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * In my efforts to find out what the point of the Rice Puller fraud is, I came across this page which I can only describe as hyper-fraud: rice-pulling AND homoeopathy! Jackpot! Cardinal Fang (talk) 21:34, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Again, Popeye?
Sigh. He just can't get over this one misapprehension he has about evolution, that organisms think about how they need to change then somehow execute their thoughts at the DNA level. I had a go at explaining to him last time why that was idiotic, but apparently he'll go on believing that's what evolution is until his dying day. Well, whatever Swabbie. You carry on believing the magic man in the sky done it, you're not the type of creationist we care about because you're so obviously wrong that you couldn't convince anyone to join you in your wrongness. Probably even Kendoll knows what evolution proposes better than you. Think about that. He's a dribbling lunatic, and he knows more about science than you do. -- 10:14, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Same old, same old. He doesn't understand it, doesn't want to understand it, therefore it must be wrong. This is true of almost all creationists as far as I can see. It's wilful ignorance and/or wilful misunderstanding. It's basically dishonest. Ajkgordon (talk) 11:42, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * If Darwin was so smart, howcome he didn't just evolve into something which doesn't die?? Checkmate, atheists! -GTac (talk) 12:00, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Mind you, quite a few nature/evolution/etc stories I see in the papers or SU are worded that way - as if the organism saw a goal and evolved toward it. Is Karajou guilty of believing the shallow end of pop science? Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 12:56, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He also seems to have no appreciation of the diversity of 'grass'. Like it's all the same thing. Worm (talk) 13:08, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Maybe there's only one kind you can get in small town Tenne...oh, I see. Right. As in lawn. Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 13:11, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Even scientists are guilty of it. I've often seen them use "designed". I know they mean it as short hand but they really ought to resist. I was listening to the Infinite Monkey Cage recently and I heard Brian Cox say something like "Do you believe in evolution?" I had to go and kick a puppy. Ajkgordon (talk) 13:09, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Just as an aside, they had Neil Degrasse Tyson on last week. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 14:32, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * You make them sound like a taxi driver. "I 'ad that Neil Degrasse Tyson in the back the other week. Laaavly bloke!" Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 18:43, 5 August 2013 (UTC)

You know, his whole premise -- even before we get to the silly personification of grass -- is just nuts. He's suggesting that it would be an evolutionary advantage for lawn grasses to be difficult to cut, just like it's an advantage for cacti to be difficult to eat, but how would that work? Lawn grasses are largely selected by humans who have an interest in trimming their lawn. Even weeds would not do well if they had anti-mower defenses, since that would provide a stronger motive to kill (rather than merely trim) the weeds. (Never mind what sort of anti-mower defenses are biologically plausible!) Phiwum (talk) 21:21, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Also he is making the claim that grass has never changed. I think Karajou will find modern lawn grass are probably extremely different from the grasses the descended from. Acei9 02:32, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Indeed (he's apparently not a lawn buff). Also, grass already IS highly adapted to resist trimming and grazing. It grows from the base, unlike most plants which grow from the tip. This protects the meristems and lets grass grow right back after damage, which is one reason why grasslands are a major biome type these days (grasses are actually the newest major group of plants to evolve, missing most of the Mesozoic era). Also, many grasses have silica edge serrations to help deter herbivores. 192․168․1․42 (talk) 04:00, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks to all of you on the botany of grasses. I am an expert, believe it or not.  K has no idea what he is talking about.  Grasses evolved in tandem with herbivores... <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  04:39, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

BTW, Karajou's comment about a butterfly having an owl face pattern proves godidit has been posted on FSTDT. Congrats, Karajou. Now more people are laughing at your ignorance. --Night Jaguar (talk) 06:15, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

My biannual suggestion to mothball WIGO CP
It's been about six months, hasn't it? I reckon it's once again time to talk about shuttering WIGO CP.

Since it's about to be removed from the main page for reason of being too boring, shall we archive this page and move all WIGOs and discussions of CP and its spin offs to WIGO CLOGS? It seems only sensible since a lot of the talk now is about Ken's crazy town, Karajou's angry dome and Terry's loony bin, and almost nothing about CP proper because nothing ever goes on there. What do you reckon, archive this page and put a notice up that we've moved to clogs? -- 21:34, 5 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Why not leave it alone? It does no harm to keep it.  Remove it from the main page if you want, but there's (still) no reason to delete this page.
 * CP's craziness will rise again, I am sure. I'll never understand the desire to call CP dead every so often.  If'n you don't find it worth your time, then feel free to ignore this page. Phiwum (talk) 21:43, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Because we've got a better place to have this discussion, and we should move there? -- 21:45, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Totally agree with Jeeves on this. A WIGO that's had 10 or fewer updates in each of the last three months means that not a lot IGO in the first place. Take out those entries that are focused on bullying a mentally ill man, and it's even grimmer. It's not resting, it's not pining for the fjords: it has joined the choir celestial. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 21:52, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * :) <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:28, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * What place do you have in mind, Jeeves? Phiwum (talk) 22:04, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * "shall we archive this page and move all WIGOs and discussions of CP and its spin offs to WIGO CLOGS?" 22:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Seems a bit weird to disagree with me without bothering to even read what you're disagreeing with... -- 22:39, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I read it, but evidently forgot the details nigh immediately.
 * In any case, I don't want to read about opinions and goings-on in the clogosphere. I don't care to hunt for the bits that interest me.  I like CP and would prefer to see CP-related stuff in a single devoted page.  If that's a minority opinion, so be it. Phiwum (talk) 01:41, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

A preview of more data to come shortly but relevant to this discussion, here are the monthly view for our various WIGOs (there are only from July and only from one squid, can't be arsed to grab the others right now but they are distributed equally):

Tmtoulouse (talk) 22:18, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree that CP updates should be placed on the clogs. Acei9 22:34, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Me too. Firstly, if it's not actually dead it's certainly in a persistent vegetative state. Secondly, just imagine the remaining denizens' rage at being so justifiably consigned to irrelevance.--Fergus Mason If in the first act you have hung a pistol on the wall, then in the following one it should be fired. Otherwise don't put it there. - Anton Chekov 00:33, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Vote for the chaning things to reflect the ground situation! --MikallakiM 02:00, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yay! Move CP to the Clogs!  Since that is what it is... <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:28, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * My suggestion would be to change this from "WIGO Conservapedia" to "WIGO Conservapedia and its spawn" and to document Ken, Terry and Karajou's blogs on the page itself, not just here on the talk page. Oh, well. It looks like I'm going to be starting each visit here by clicking on that picture of a turd, something which I've avoided doing until now. Spud (talk) 06:31, 6 August 2013 (UTC)


 * I repeat my suggestion: create Wigo:Wikis, and put Citizendium, Ask, CP, wikipedia, etc. in it. --larron (talk) 09:47, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I like that idea. Spud (talk) 09:52, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Disagree. While CP may be almost comatose at the moment, it is the reason for this site's Genesis. As such it still holds a privileged position. It doesn't have to be linked from the home page but WIGO CP should be left as is. Including Terry's nuttery or Ken's shoutouts from stillborn blogs is fine as CP is the origin of these fruitcakes. Besides, 17000 views pm about a single website (plus closely related ones) is still relatively high. Wigo World, Clogosphere, and Blogosphere cover multiple sites and subjects, right? All IMVHO, of course. Ajkgordon (talk) 10:15, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

I don't think the problem is that there's nothing to WIGO about but that people aren't WIGOing it. This talkpage is still very lively and contains discussion of many incidents that never find their way onto the WIGO page, even though they have as much, or even more, reason to be there as the stuff that actually gets posted. Vulpius (talk) 10:39, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * True. Ajkgordon (talk) 11:03, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree with Ajkgordon. Keep it intact, at least for now until we see what happens with Schlafly's block the world strategy.  DamoHi 11:07, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * If you want to know, I can tell you in advance CP's entire future. Andy will continue being a terrible leader, Karajou will get bored and wander off, Terry and Kendoll will continue to spam until the ability is taken away from them. There's no chance CP will fight back to be a popular site, it's all stagnation and death from here on out. -- 12:14, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I see Ken's latest trick is protecting every page he touches - Osteopathy‎ &  Integrative medicine being the latest examples. So between Andy blocking the world and Ken preventing anybody else from editing articles... --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Tal! 12:43, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Cant' wait for you fuckers to complain about all the CP stuff on clogs the next time Andy gets some press. Occasionaluse (talk) 14:10, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's been like 4 years since the last time Andy got any press. I think that ship has sailed. -- 15:15, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The only way Andy would get any press again, is if Karajou tried to shoot the President. Between Lenski, relativity and the Conservative Bible, he's painted himself into the batshit insane corner where nobody will ever take him seriously anymore, no matter what he does. On that subject - is there any indication his homeskollar thing is still going? When last did he post homework, or course notes? --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Praat! 15:39, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * When I say "press", I'm speaking relatively, of course. Just saying when Andy creates CP:Sexual Orientation of Hillary Clinton or something and the few of us who still follow CP lose our shit, I don't want to hear bitching about us shitposting in clogs. Occasionaluse (talk) 16:45, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

Three little pics
I wanted to create something similar to Lee Byron's streamgraph, using R. This graph just gives the impression of the contributions of the 12 busiest editors at Citizendium, Conservapedia, and RationalWiki over time. A 90-days moving average is used, i.e., at each day, the thickness of the line indicates the average of number of comments over the surrounding 90 days. --larron (talk) 09:50, 6 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Thank you larron. Do you mind giving Y axis values so we have a sense of absolute scale? Or are they the same for all 3 graphs? Shakedangle (talk) 13:45, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Intersting that at RW, we have all dropped off quite a lot since mid 2012. wonder why. [[Image:green mowse.png|25px]]<font face="Estrangelo Edessa"><font color="Blue">Godot  The ablity to breath is such an overrated ability  19:46, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Follow the gentle aqua-ish wave along the bottom... <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  04:23, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

@Shakedangle: This kind of graph doesn't allow easily for a y-scale. I added the minimum and maximum instead.

@WaitingForGodot, Human:

Over the last half year, the number of contributions of those who joined in the early times of RationalWiki dropped considerably... --larron (talk) 05:59, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 2003? <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 16:11, 7 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Someone messed with the database, I assume: http://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?oldid=825350 --larron (talk) 18:00, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh with the users who aren't in the RW database. Sorry about that. Go ahead and delete/recreate stuff like that if you wish. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 18:14, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

HAHAHAHA. OH MY.
This might explain Andy's sudden decision to block the world, apparently Karajou thinks we're responsible for CP returning 500 errors half the time.

I have news for you, Kara. The errors are because the el-cheapo host Andy pays for can't keep up with the load on their shared servers. It's nothing to do with us. If you guys weren't so busy inventing conspiracies about evil librul attackers, maybe one of you could actually learn some rudimentary sysadmin skills and get yourself a dedicated server. Dimwits. -- 18:39, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * ...I have to admit, for a moment I believed Kara's blog got hacked. It took me a while to realize that he really is advertising CP's server errors as some sort of victory. Captain, we have reached Spin Level "Baghdad Bob". --Sid (talk) 18:49, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * We are Internal Server Error and We Are Legion. Whoover (talk) 18:56, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * What's Otisburg? Who are the amateurs? Why is everything silly and little in Karaturd's world? What a strange person. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 18:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * All your servers are belong to us.--Fergus Mason If in the first act you have hung a pistol on the wall, then in the following one it should be fired. Otherwise don't put it there. - Anton Chekov 18:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * When the dust finally settles, we really should have a page documenting the iDDoS episode. (i for imaginary, of course.) Whoover (talk) 19:02, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Everything anger hates is silly and little in anger's world because he is a silly little ineffectual anger bear. He has done nothing of real note in his sad life, if he had you know damn well he would be boasting about it.  So a sad little man lashes out in the only way he can, by calling others little and silly on t'web.  He knows damn well that to do so in person would end up with him being firmly put in his silly, sad little place.  Oldusgitus (talk) 19:09, 6 August 2013 (UTC) (aka otis apparently)
 * Ah that was a good one. It's been a while since I had a really good laugh at CP. Thanks Kara. Of course I don't speak for everyone but I really don't think anyone here is issuing DDOS attacks. Personally I don't want to CP fail - I love reading it as posts like yours really make me laugh out loud. Yuk, yuk. My name's Otis! Keep the tin foil hat Kara, it suits you. Long may CP last. StarFish (talk) 19:10, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He does live in a bizzaro world, doesn't he? I'm interested though, what event has he twisted to come to the conclusion that we tried to use extortion and threat to take over CP? How would that even work? I presume the trying to force them to debate refers to Ken's debate challenges and subsequent running away, but I can't be sure because it bears so little relationship to actual events... -- 19:16, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Blind guess: All those people who threatened to leave because of Ken's (or Andy's) antics. Like "Bow down to my demands or else (I leave)!". It's a stretch, but if true, then that would still be the sanest part of that post. --Sid (talk) 19:32, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * People like Rob, you mean? I wonder if he's officially an "Otis" now. -- 19:40, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ah that was great. I'm going to have to read that again. CP has been pretty slim pickings for laughs recently but Kata has delivered. Thanks man. StarFish (talk) 19:41, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's still good the second time. BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Can't thank you enough man. You've out Kenned Ken! StarFish (talk) 19:46, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He's talking about the pageview manipulation people did years ago. Wow... Occasionaluse (talk) 19:53, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Actually the pageview manipulation never was a DDOS, and both Andy and Ken welcomed it with open arms. The current problem is with Andy blowing CP up from the inside rather than an external attack. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 03:28, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * What's this "Otis" he keeps talking about? Is it some Mercan reference I don't get? I thought they made lifts (elevators). Ajkgordon (talk) 22:35, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's a reference to the 1st Superman film staring Christopher Reeve. Otis was the dorky sidekick to Lex Luther. Luther planned to rename some towns. Otis suggested Otisburg which was casually and cynically dismissed by Lex.--Mercian (talk) 00:22, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's Luthor, goshdangittoheck! Luthor! Not Luther! Kids today... Dendlai (talk) 01:56, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Read back a few posts and you can see how this Otis thing develops in his silly little mind. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 03:29, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I can't. I might catch stupid. Ajkgordon (talk) 08:31, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

' "So, reader, if you are on Conservapedia or any other website that is dedicated to conservatism or Christianity, and you get one of those silly little displays like the image above, just pretend it's the image of failure..." ' Since quote-mining is a conservative/Conservapedian trait, I think that text taken from Karajou's blog post sums it up perfectly. <font face="Comic Sans"><font color = "Green">Norseman  Cyser Melomel  13:01, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

And now back to our regularly scheduled programming:
"The global warming hoax is again disproved by nature" - Andy. "Lack of water and heat stress, not fall." - reader of the local article Andy cites (from Seattle, where it's been hot and dry lately). The tree in question does look nice, though. 192․168․1․42 (talk) 04:42, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Early August is a little early for Fall, isn't it? What is Andy on about this time? <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  04:55, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Oh pretty leaves, you disprove both global warming and evolution. --Night Jaguar (talk) 08:57, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Andy thinks if Climate Change was true, then chlorophyll never would break down and thus green leaves 365 days a year no matter the type of tree or location on the Earth. Sadly for Andy, it says right in the article, the tree in question is suffering from stress, causing the change.  One can also see the background trees still are a solid green.  In short, he is a moron.--BMcP - Just an astronomy guy 13:22, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I think it's that a warming climate is supposed to cause trees to change colors later, so this one tree changing early means that it's actually getting cooler, making global warming a hoax. Also, the background trees look like evergreens. 192․168․1․42 (talk) 15:14, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The weird thing with this is that Andy's going "Ha! Ha! Liberals, global warming is a myth. The world is getting colder." Whereas if a normal person came to the same conclusion, they'd be like "Holy shit! It's getting colder. What should we do to avert an ice age?" --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Sermā! 15:20, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Schlafly skimming at its finest, just how far did he get in that article before he'd seen all he needed to? <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 16:02, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

A triple spammy
Chuckarse manages to spam MPR with three different vanity spams in one edit regurgitating the Walt Brown's crackpot hydroplate theory. <font color=Blue>Генгис 16:09, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * don't know why, but I found that extra funny today. And to top it off, it's the hydroplate theory, which even Terry will tell you he doesn't actually understand. Occasionaluse (talk) 17:23, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Tempus Fugit: Conservative's three-year-long project ends today!
Three years ago, Conservative a.k.a. Ruylopez promised to address some questions on Nils Heribert Nilsson at A Storehouse of Knowledge: " The exception will be the question related to Nils Heribert-Nilsson as I promised to attempt to answer this question when other matters were attended to. " How long does this take? Well, " I expect to finish the project by August 5, 2013. Feel free to contact me about this matter after August 5, 2013, but please do not ask me before then. I may have an answer before that though."

Unfortunately, he hadn't an answer until now, but the day just started... --larron (talk) 05:30, 5 August 2013 (UTC)


 * As he is committed to never read Rationalwiki again he will not see this reminder--Mercian (talk) 08:57, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Taking wagers on Brave Sir Robin's strategy for refusing to admit he was wrong and tucking tail like a little bitch. Will this unstable crank address the merits of the issue or ridicule LArron and RWians with some deflection? Will we finally see evidence of any ability to self-reflect? Thoughts? [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 14:57, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Simple strategy: "Gentlemen, can you prove beyond a doubt that I/we am/are this "Ruy Lopez" character?" PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 15:10, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * For a predictable outcome why not ask him on his spanking new blog? Currently it's open to comments. (Any bets on how long that will last?) <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 15:26, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No it's not. Comments don't seem to work. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 16:12, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Well, obviously that idea didn't last long at all. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 01:58, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * LArron, not even going to imagine how you keep track of this shit. Occasionaluse (talk) 17:15, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Believe me, I was very surprised when my calendar mentioned it: I set the alarm THREE YEARS AGO! AFAIK this was the first time that Conservative tried to postpone a task for such a ridiculous long time - I assume I got an academic degree in the meantime. --larron (talk) 18:32, 5 August 2013 (UTC)


 * I went to his new blog... --larron (talk) 18:39, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He's now trying to be coy about whether or not the blog is run by "Conservative." I think the name is a bit of a fucking clue, myself.--Fergus Mason If in the first act you have hung a pistol on the wall, then in the following one it should be fired. Otherwise don't put it there. - Anton Chekov 19:56, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * ANNNNND, memoryholed. Just after he admited that it was him.  Bunny hole ken, bunny hole.  Fiver is getting lonely. Oldusgitus (talk) 20:40, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Dang! The committee known as User:Conservative have a hard time sticking to their decisions. I can imagine different quora forming and overturning previous decisions every couple of hours. Seems like a stupid way to run one account. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 01:56, 6 August 2013 (UTC)

--larron (talk) 20:42, 5 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The blog is called "Userconservative"
 * cp:User:Conservative linked to it from one of his shout-outs
 * The style is Conservative's
 * And yes, the behavior is Conservative's, too: stating "I stand by what I wrote. "' just minutes before deleting the whole blog.
 * Thank you, Manchild Ken. That was one of your more amusing dances.Shakedangle (talk) 21:58, 5 August 2013 (UTC)


 * {|class="wikitable"

!style="background:lightgreen"|DiEb August 5, 2013 at 11:38 AM
 * style="background:lightgreen"|Three years ago, Conservative a.k.a. Ruylopez promised to address some questions on Nils Heribert Nilsson at A Storehouse of Knowledge: " The exception will be the question related to Nils Heribert-Nilsson as I promised to attempt to answer this question when other matters were attended to. " How long does this take? Well, " I expect to finish the project by August 5, 2013. Feel free to contact me about this matter after August 5, 2013, but please do not ask me before then. I may have an answer before that though."
 * style="background:lightgreen"|Three years ago, Conservative a.k.a. Ruylopez promised to address some questions on Nils Heribert Nilsson at A Storehouse of Knowledge: " The exception will be the question related to Nils Heribert-Nilsson as I promised to attempt to answer this question when other matters were attended to. " How long does this take? Well, " I expect to finish the project by August 5, 2013. Feel free to contact me about this matter after August 5, 2013, but please do not ask me before then. I may have an answer before that though."

Will you try to weasel out of it? !style="background:pink"|LetFreedomRing August 5, 2013 at 12:41 PM
 * style="background:pink"|Dieb, first of all, who said this blog has any relation to a RuyLopez account or this blog is being run by "Conservative". No true skeptic would ever claim this without absolute proof. I can tell you are not a true skeptic/atheist/agnostic.
 * style="background:pink"|Dieb, first of all, who said this blog has any relation to a RuyLopez account or this blog is being run by "Conservative". No true skeptic would ever claim this without absolute proof. I can tell you are not a true skeptic/atheist/agnostic.

Second, you are being the weasel as there was no promised deadline as you claim according to your link. For example, "expect" and "However, the situation is subject to matters relating to the unforeseen circumstances and it is difficult to know when these matters will be resolved." !style="background:lightblue"|Fergus Mason August 5, 2013 at 12:51 PM
 * style="background:lightblue"|"who said this blog has any relation to a RuyLopez account or this blog is being run by "Conservative"."
 * style="background:lightblue"|"who said this blog has any relation to a RuyLopez account or this blog is being run by "Conservative"."

It's called "Userconservative." Some people might think that's a bit of a clue. !style="background:pink"|LetFreedomRing August 5, 2013 at 1:11 PM
 * style="background:pink"|There are letters of Paul/Peter used in the first century church with their names on them that atheists/agnostics spuriously claim were not written by these apostles. I stand by what I wrote.
 * }
 * I love the "tu quoque": no, you are a weasel... --larron (talk) 21:15, 6 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Good old Ken - managing to be utterly predictable and perfectly pathetic all in one go. Ken, you are aware that liars burn for eternity in Hell, right? With red-hot pokers jammed up their jacksies. Run back to your non-intellectual bunny hole coward. --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Tala! 08:04, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Good old Ken - managing to be utterly predictable and perfectly pathetic all in one go. Ken, you are aware that liars burn for eternity in Hell, right? With red-hot pokers jammed up their jacksies. Run back to your non-intellectual bunny hole coward. --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Tala! 08:04, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

The fruits of three years of labor
Conservative shows his work by adding to the article on cp:Nils-Heribert Nilsson:  He was also a member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences.  A a source, a link to creation.com is given, where a quote of Nilsson is introduced by stating "Heribert-Nilsson, Nils (former professor of botany, Lund University, Sweden, and member of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences) in the book Synthetische Artbildung p. 1194, describing the famous Baltic amber deposits". Especially in the light of this little exchange at AStorehouseOfKnowledge, this is very disappointing indeed! --larron (talk) 09:06, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

Ken's new opus.
He's been feverishly jacking himself for three days straight (almost literally, I don't think he's had a break longer than 3 hours) to produce this masterpiece. I don't think he really understands hypocrisy. There's the not even wrong, like his usual atheism is a religion shtick. Then there's the just plain stupid ones like Atheism and Mental Illness, where he somehow thinks it's hypocrisy to say someone else is mentally ill when you yourself might possibly have a greater risk of mental illness than the general population... er, yeah. But most of them just fall in to the category of "someone vaguely like you might believe something you're accusing others of, so you're a hypocrite!" Ken, you're doing it wrong. Hypocrisy isn't something you can accuse a whole category of people of unless they're ALL hypocrites. (Oh and he made it the article of the month. No doubt the Kendoll Kommittee staged a vote to decide that.) -- 19:26, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Heh, article of the month ... For about a day. Dance for me little man, DANCE! -- 20:01, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's utter utter drivel. The grammar, the arguments, the logic, the analogies, the writing style, the repetitiveness, the pictures, the quotes, the conclusions....all of it. Utter drivel. How one man can have learned so little over such a long period of time is astonishing. Ajkgordon (talk) 20:07, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He started it while we were deciding to moth-ball CP on the mainpage. It is merely an attempt to get our attention again. I was hoping no one would take the bait because it is just too obvious and pathetic. Acei9 20:15, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I was going to say; we are the only people who are even ever going to read this, and too many of us are starting not to care. Kudos to Ken though, he still manage to get a section to himself here once again. His only real achievement, RW recognition.
 * I was close to making a new section about his editing pattern. For three days, he took one 5 hour break, then a 3 hour break followed by another 3 hour break (one edit between the two), and finally a 6 hour break. And that's only his log activity, not contribs. [[Image:AndyToad.gif|20px]]<font face="Comic Sans"><font color = "Green">Norseman  Cyser Melomel  13:12, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I actually hate seeing this. The meds didn't work, he's lost control and he's exactly where he was a few years ago. I have no faith that Andy et al have made a single effort to see that he gets care and it's sad to think that they might be all he has. Occasionaluse (talk) 13:38, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I agree. At least we (RW editors) and most other human beings give a shit about people we spend time with. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:03, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Rubbish In, rubbish out.
Is the new mainpage headline. So is Andy dismissing these kids as "rubbish" since birth and public schools failed to turn the rubbish into something else? What a odious little man he is--Mercian (talk) 04:15, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * For a supposed Catholic he has quite a Calvinist streak. Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 08:22, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Remember, we are all automatically guilty of sin even as newborns. We are fallen. Praise Jesus, homeschooling and the American Way. Ajkgordon (talk) 10:42, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm pretty sure that the "Garbage In" he's referring to is the "liberal indoctrination", not the students. Phiwum (talk) 13:22, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ironically, total depravity started out as a sort of equalizer — a doctrine that put oh-so-pious, holier-than-thou jerks in the same boat as the most wretched of sinners, with the only way out being repentance and love. Martin Luther in particular would probably turn in his grave if he could see what was being made of the doctrine today. 14:56, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Obama made a speech yesterday(or Thursday) expressing his wish that many gay athletes win medals at the Moscow Olympics. I am surprised Andy has not jumped all other Obama's support for the homosexual agenda.--Mercian (talk) 14:58, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Story time with Karajou
Aw! Look - everybody's favourite swabbie is giving us his special take on some speech by somebody. SPOILER - It's all Obama's fault, who's actually Satan.

If only he was man enough to open the comments section on his blog. Hell, even wimpy Terry Flingbotty does that. --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Fale! 21:15, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I always thought Karajou to be sane, albeit a nasty piece of work, seems I was wrong--Mercian (talk) 23:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * What on earth gave you that idea? Was it the sadistic glee he puts in to blocking, or the dribbling stupidity he brings to main page right? -- 05:54, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It all depends upon how you define sane. Dull, stupid, reactionary, gullible, authoritarian - yes. But he's not away with the fairies like Ken is. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 06:51, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It is bizarre, isn't it? I mean forget about all the really horrible evil committed around the world - child prostitution, slave labour, torture, mutilation, genocide and so on. What's really evil is a man in God's own country who is slightly politically left of US centre. I mean, WTF? Karajou, you need to get out more. Ajkgordon (talk) 09:21, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm going to go with Karajou staying locked up indoors with his own delusions. This fucking whackjob is probably walking around open carrying a gun right now, just looking for a reason to use it. Think about that for a second and tell me you want him out in the real world. Occasionaluse (talk) 15:09, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I have always said, Karajou would be the only CP user I wouldn't approach on his own turf. The guy has such a pathological hatred of those he sees as "the enemy" (liberals, RWians, atheists etc) that I think he is potentially dangerous. Acei9 21:11, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ah, but you don't understand. If he had a cooperative congress he'd probably make you pay slightly more tax. And that's the greatest evil of them all. Even thinking about it qualifies Obama as an imp of Satan. -- 09:49, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

RE: The "biannual suggestion to mothball WIGO CP"
So we had this conversation a couple of days ago, and there seemed to be a sense that some people were behind the idea. Ace's comment above, that a certain CP editor became increasingly active on the heels of recent developments here re: how we position ourselves re: CP, made me think about this again. Before the idea gets lost in the shuffle, I'm proposing we put it to a vote, just as we did with the idea of removing the front-page link to WIGOCP.

Proposal: That WIGOCP and its associated talk page be merged into WIGO-Clogs.

Agree

 * 1) PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 22:04, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 2) Yep - why not. Acei9 22:09, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 3) --Revolverman (talk) 22:11, 7 August 2013 (UTC) Let put a bullet in it once and for all. Now that its off the main page, I see no point in keeping its own WIGO now.
 * 4) yep. -- 22:18, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 5) I want to set the world on fire.--Token Conservative (talk) 22:20, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 6) I'd personally prefer WIGO:CP to itself remain for things directly on Conservapedia proper, with Clogs for the associated constellation of shitblogs owned by Ken et al., but I can see the structural problems with maintaining that artificial division, so agree. Ochotona princeps<sup style="color:#0066DD; font-size: 0.7em; font-style: oblique">not a pokémon  22:28, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 7) I'm all for it. As we all know, CP has become the go to place for Kendoll, Swabbie, and Hurtbutt to link whore their respective blogs and not much else.Bobafan (talk) 22:49, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 8) Pointing and laughing at the crazy people is amusing only for so long. Doctor Dark (talk) 23:32, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 9) I still pop by here daily, sometimes more than that, but there's no reason to have it as a separate page.TallMan (talk) 23:52, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 10) Fark it! Fark it with fromage!.--X-Wing-icon.png  Jabba de Chops 00:18, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 11) Tielec01 (talk) 00:33, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 12) CP is an increasingly small part of the clogosphere, so it makes sense to me.   01:18, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 13) Yah. At this point its just the same few things over and over honestly, not very interesting or worthy of it's own page anymore. The latest resurgence is only after we discussed us getting bored with it. --MikallakiM 01:55, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 14) Second. AntiDeathPill (talk) 02:09, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 15) As much as I love WIGO:CP and its Talk Page, its just not generating enough material to warrant its own page anymore. We can only poke fun at Ken and Karajou for so long before it starts to get monotonous. RachelW (talk) 03:14, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 16) Can we replace it with "what is going on in the Wacky World of Bitcoin"? If not, I vote for the merge. -Soviet Hologram God (talk) 03:23, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 17) This will be a good step forward. We can broaden our horizons! Freep! Breitbart! The Blaze! TPC! There's so much out there that's more entertaining than CP. Cow...Hammertime! 03:31, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 18) Conservapedia was fun while it lasted but there's nothing really notable about it now that warrants it being set apart from everything else in the Clogosphere. Merge. Wykked Wytch (talk) 04:07, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 19) CP is deader than a dodo's doornail on VHS.  Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 08:15, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 20) The good bits of CP are rare, but when they happen, they are definitely clogworthy.  VOX  HUMANA  10:55, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 21) CP is all but dead. MDB (the MD used to be for Maryland, but now means Magically Deliciousthe B is still for Bear) 11:11, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 22) Yeah, why not. I just hope I don't have to shuffle through other riff-raff to find something funny about CP. [[Image:AndyToad.gif|20px]]<font face="Comic Sans"><font color = "Green">Norseman   Cyser Melomel  13:15, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Clarification: That is precisely what you'd have to do if WIGO:CP is merged with WIGO:Clogs. Do you agree or disagree with that proposal? 192․168․1․42 (talk)13:47, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Disagree then, dadgummit. [[Image:AndyToad.gif|20px]]<font face="Comic Sans"><font color = "Green">Norseman  Cyser Melomel  14:43, 10 August 2013 (UTC)


 * 1) Yes.--Weirdstuff (talk) 16:36, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 2) I was trying to think of an alternative to 'status quo' and 'WIGO:CP gone forever' and this is it. Semipenultimate16:48, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 3) Yeah. -- Certified    Sick Bastard  22:22, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 4) Yes --Ohio (talk) 15:51, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 5) Definitely!  16:15, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 6) Dead. Make the talk page into an archived forum page for the remaining people who care - David Gerard (talk) 16:17, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Disagree

 * 1) No point in filling the Clogs talk page with CP banter. Vulpius (talk) 22:19, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Why not? There isn't much other banter to speak of. Acei9 22:22, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * And CP is part of the clogosphere, albeit a small part now. So is QE!, Kara's Angrydome and CNAV. You can expect the CP talk to taper off as CP continues its decline and fall. -- 22:34, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Then let it taper off properly first. Right now Clogs would become WIGO:CP in all but name. Vulpius (talk) 01:14, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The clog talk page had nine edits in July. It's not really anything much now, and the CP crowd can add their snark to what else is going on. This'll merge one active page/inactive discussion with an inactive page/active discussion. It'll work. Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 08:21, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) --DamoHi 01:43, 8 August 2013 (UTC)  Still premature for mine.  The glory days too recent.
 * 2) WIGO:Clogs and WIGO:CP are two different things; WIGO:Clogs is directed more at the general public, while WIGO:CP is more for our own enjoyment. Putting any in-joke-laden Conservapedia WIGOs on WIGO:Clogs would probably just confuse the casual readers. And, as we seem to have taken it off the main page now, we can just let it peter out of its own accord, as we did with other WIGO pages.  03:18, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 3) "Clogs would become WIGO:CP in all but name."  This.  Burndall (talk) 03:40, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 4) Purely selfish reason: I'm interested in CP oddities, but not the clogosphere generally.  I don't want to have to wade through the clutter.  Phiwum (talk) 04:08, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 5) This is wrongheaded; everyone is jumping at assuming CP is dead - but this is a down time for interest in politics in general. They'll pick up as 2014 elections near and 2016 candidates make themselves known.--Danielfolsom (talk) 04:42, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 6) As I said before, keep this WIGO separate but make it "WIGO Conservapedia and its spawn". Document Ken, Terry and Karajou's blog posts on the main page (not just here on the talk page). In the unlikely event that Andy appears on TV or on the radio again, that should be documented on the main page too. Spud (talk) 06:35, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 7) I am against this idea as the WIGO:CP talkpage is still very active and would likely overrun any WIGO:Clogs talk. Besides I thought the whole WIGO:CP section is still sufficiently active enough to justify keeping the page (Unlike the forgotten WIGO:CZ page was) 124.171.132.101 (talk) 07:11, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 8) My interest is narrowly focused on CP, so merge with Clogs would be an unnecessary burden. Hclodge (talk) 09:11, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 9) RW was started in reaction to CP. That alone is enough to keep its own WIGO. Besides, as others have said, this is the quiet season in politics. And while the actual WIGO page itself is quite thin at the moment, the talk page isn't. WIGO:CP is a good examination of a project that had a good chance of becoming something useful to its target audience but ultimately fails because of the autocratic tendency of the religious right. It's a good thing to keep it intact as a living historical record of how poisonous theocracy is, even to itself. Ajkgordon (talk) 10:38, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 10) Nope. The various reasons were already pointed out. I don't want any Schlafly in my clogs. In addition to that, let me point out that WIGO:Citizendium still exists as a separate page. Removing CP from the front page was enough, let's not get carried away. If you want to distance yourself from the CP obsession, forcibly integrating the WIGO while it's still relatively high-activity seems counter-productive to me - it will be no longer possible to point out that the CP-obsessives are a subset of the users.--ZooGuard (talk) 10:50, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 11) Leave it for now. Obviously the bi-annual suggestion should probably continue, for the sake of the exercise as much as anything.  The Invisible Man  <sup style="font-style:italic">I spoke to Him   11:56, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 12) Think it's part of RW history and should stay. There is also quite a lot discussion still going on in here. <font color="green" size="2px">Timppeli  13:30, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 13) Don't want to hear you buys bitch about all the CP in clogs every time something funny happens. Occasionaluse (talk) 13:34, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 14) Don't cross the streams. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 14:03, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 15) So CP's dead enough to yank it off the main page, but not so dead that you want to shift its users somewhere else? Make your mind up. If you think it's dead, go away and the last person to leave will put a template on it like we did for 3rd Reich. That being said a total merge of to WIGO: Wikis for CP, CZM, 3rd Reich would be something I'd vote for. --  I  scariot   Andy Schlafly for Congress 2012! 14:07, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 16) Although the WIGO is pretty much done, this Talk Page is clearly active and enjoyed by a subset of the community.  Additionally, RW hasn't removed CP from the Main Page; Andrew Schlafly and the Lenski Affair are all about Conservapedia, and are featured articles.  Homeschooling parents need to know what sort of teacher AS is.  The inquisitive need to know that Creationism isn't science.  Few people need to know the daily minutiae discussed on CP's TWIGO. --TheLateGatsby (The end of the dock ) 14:41, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 17) --<font face="Wild Words"> PsyGremlin Tala! 16:25, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No, this talk page is still active plus I like having all the CP related discussion concentrated in one place, even though so far I've only read it rather than participated in it. - Bill Rawls (talk) 16:54, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) Oldusgitus (talk) 16:56, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 2) No. Leave it where it is, it's not doing any harm here. Besides, if you move it I'll have to reset my favourites!Mick McT (talk) 18:01, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 3) No.--Mercian (talk) 19:04, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No, sort of. "WIGO in CP and its Spawn" sounds good to me." Cardinal Fang (talk) 22:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) No way, broham. I appreciate the subtle difference between CP and a clog.  Removing it from the main page seems like a logical step forward, but to essentially remove it from it's own entity is too much in my book.   02:18, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * no, keep it from easy public view but the numbers dont seem to show its dead yet. Hamster (talk) 03:19, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) No - Two problems with the suggestion. 1) "Clogosphere" is a term barely recognized anywhere other than RW, so anyone coming here has no fucking idea what it is, and how it's different from the blogoshpere.  2)  The level of knowledge here at RW on the individuals at CP utterly overwhelms the level of knowledge on any other random webshite designated a 'clog'.   So entire conversations will go on about Ken, Andy, TK and the like, and the casual visitor would find it so insider as to be utterly befuddled.   It;s actually a good idea to keep CP stuff separate as a result of our expertise on them.  DogP (talk) 06:48, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 2) No. CP is nothing more than a clog these days, but most of the CP-related posts and comments rely on an understanding of the back story, jargon and running jokes.  The Clogs material is all self-contained and obvious for any new reader. Since the CP-related material takes some context to fully understand and appreciate, it's best left in its own section. -DinsdaleP (talk) 12:41, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No, no, just no. Someone cares for CP, someone for clogs. Editor at CPmały książe 16:34, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) CP may be a clog, but it's a very special clog that holds a very dear place in my heart and in the hearts of many other RWians. Its brand of idiocy is so unique--Ken, Terry, Andy, and Brian are all clearly insane, but they synergize woth each other so well.  I like having a page dedicated to this special brand of insanity.  --JimBags (talk) 16:40, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Goat
I'm pretty non-committal about the whole mess. I wouldn't mind if it happened, but there are downsides to that. I would like to see stuff like Terry's site and Ken's QE blog(s) that aren't directly part of CP move over to Clogs though. --Kels (talk) 22:05, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 1) However it goes, I'm easy. Potato, potato, bədeidə. Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 00:52, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 2) I was going to say "Kill it with Fire!!!" but ZooGuard's comments have made me backtrack. I won't vote "No," but I feel comfortable with a nice "Goat" vote. Reckless Noise Symphony (talk) 11:17, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * 3) In favour of a merge, but only for the convenience of a front page link, now the CP one has gone.  Bevo74 (talk) 19:00, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Kels' idea is a good one. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:05, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Had to happen once in a century, eh? --Kels (talk) 18:33, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Chucky's nasty blog is worthy of Clogs but Ken's QE stuff is just an extension of his CP shoutouts, it wouldn't probably get a look in unless he had to ramp up the crazy to get our attention. CNAV only really pops up here because Terry is nominally a CP sysop and he linkspams his bile on MPR.  <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 10:38, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I still support moving the QE amd related to Clogs, but I'm pretty easy about it. I would definitely say move Koward's rantblog over there, same as CNAV.  Do we need a concensus/vote to start moving convos over, or just go ahead and do it? --Kels (talk) 14:09, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

Discussion
What if we (i.e. you guys who are here far more often than I) had to separate them again? What if CP enjoyed renewed popularity after major exposure, big donation, or a big shake-up? Talk to Civic Cat   22:42, 7 August 2013 (UTC)


 * (EC) Is there any info on how this merge is likely to affect site traffic & pageviews? The vote counts certainly suggest that this is still a much more popular page than Clogs.  22:44, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Actually, it's not: Trent gave us some data during the original discussion -- page views over the last month:


 * If, by some miracle, there's a reason that CP becomes relevant again, the beauty of wikis is we can start this page all over again. But there's no evidence that CP will ever enjoy that sort of renaissance. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 22:51, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * What was it the month or so ago before they started to go wacko on the accessibility?Civic Cat sig 2.PNG Talk to Civic Cat   22:58, 7 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Good question. Ask the Big Man. EDIT: Actually, the Big Man is busy dealing with our white slavery thing, so maybe you could wait awhile. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 23:35, 7 August 2013 (UTC) PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 23:02, 7 August 2013 (UTC)

Numbers for June squid1:

Tmtoulouse (talk) 01:55, 8 August 2013 (UTC)


 * Does that include the relevant talkpages as well? I tend to think that the CP talkpage is much more interesting than the WIGO:CP page itself.  --DamoHi 02:46, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * So 13% less than the #2 WIGO, when #2 is 42% less than #1. That doesn't strike me as a merge-worthy number on its own. Is there some way to see how many pageviews reflect people who visit WIGO CP and NOT Clogs? And perhaps a comparison for unique visitors of the others? 192․168․1․42 (talk) 03:01, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I'm with Damo on the talk page issue. I read WIGO:CP talk, not WIGO:CP.  The clogs talk page is nigh dead by comparison.  Hard to see how it will look after the merge. Phiwum (talk) 04:26, 8 August 2013 (UTC)


 * The name-space "Conservapedia Talk" is still going strong, and it is comprised mainly by edits to this talk page.
 * WIGO:CLOG isn't such a bad solution, but no one should complain when the talk-page is overrun by comments on CP
 * When visiting RW, I generally start at Special:RecentChanges or my watchlist. So, I visit this talk page much more frequently than the corresponding WIGO. I suppose that many of our regulars do so which makes the numbers above irrelevant: could you please look up the numbers for the talk pages? Thanks. --larron (talk) 10:08, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * If I'm reading this graph right, it's almost time to mothball everything. Occasionaluse (talk) 13:40, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

CP Talk page numbers: July-14957 June-16194. Tmtoulouse (talk) 18:10, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * So, less than the WIGO page, which is the lowest-rated of the four active WIGO pages? Not what i might have expected. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?.silverbrain.png 18:12, 8 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm still puzzled by the massive difference in votes counts. WIGO:CP entries are still getting up to 50 or 100 people voting for them, while WIGO:World entries (the most viewed WIGO according to the above data) rarely scratch in more than 20 or so votes. Any theories? Is the pageview data just listing unique page views? I guess WIGO:CP is more likely to get regular lurkers and the other WIGOs more likeley to get casual site visitors. 19:13, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I think the number of votes a WIGO gets is about proportional to the time it spends at the top of the screen. So counter-intuitively, a less active WIGO will accrue more votes per WIGO. As long as it isn't terrible, you tend to get up votes from just about everybody, so the more time it spends up there, the more up votes. -- 19:57, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I guess that makes sense. 19:59, 8 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The problem for most of us will be that we don't give a fuck about other blogs, and the vote numbers show that no one else does either. I think I'd either respond by downvoting everything that wasn't CP or just going somewhere else. Probably the first, honestly. Occasionaluse (talk) 15:01, 9 August 2013 (UTC)

Close the vote?
Even if a few more people vote yes and push the affirmative over the top, this is not a move that should happen without a clear mandate. That mandate is obviously not there. Thanks, all, for participating. PowderSmokeAndLeather: Say something once, why say it again?. 12:46, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The Main Page link was removed because people realised it was the right time to do it. The same will happen with WIGO:CP one day. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 13:32, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Keep the vote open, I'm interested to see who de-lurks next. Sophie  Wilder silverbrain.png 19:24, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yeah, it is interesting to see who comes out of the wood-work. Acei9 05:23, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It's a little disappointing the result wasn't a close victory for the mergers. The ensuing fight over whether there was a mandate to merge could have been like old times.  Oh well, I understand there is another vote coming up in 6 months - perhaps then.  --DamoHi 05:28, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Everyone's a RINO
Just took a look at cp's page on cp:RINOs and noticed that they list 41 current US senators as RINOs. There are only 46 Republican senators in office. Apparently true conservatism is dead in the US. Think they can bag the remaining 5 by the end of the weekend? --JimBags (talk) 15:14, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Definitely one of those times when Markman is worth his while. Occasionaluse (talk) 15:30, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Markman and PatrickB (another parodist who joined the witch hunt) are merely taking genuine conservapedian insanity to its logical conclusion. By Schlafly standards, anyone who even slightly deviates from his true conservatism (as he defines it) is a RINO. Since everybody who gets elected into a political office has to make some compromises at one point or another, by CP standards every Republican who's ever been elected to anything is liable for the RINO label for something. With enough motivation and creativity they can make Bachmann into a RINO.


 * The only question is whether or not the big honchos on CP are willing to allow such transparent parody. I see that Ken was active after Markman's and Patrick's witch hunt and he didn't seem to mind, I wonder what Schlafly and Karajou will do. - Bill Rawls (talk) 15:54, 9 August 2013 (UTC)
 * I noticed that Markman added Category: Lunatic to the Thomas Paine article (because Deism is a mental disorder) but Karajou reverted it and burned the evidence . Whoover (talk) 04:16, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * That's not the first absurd addition he's made to that category. Andy and Karaturd are slumlords. They only care 'sometimes' and then not enough to deal with big problems. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 15:28, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Please use capture tags so the blocked IPs among us can laugh along. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:14, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

Doh, I just realized - how smart am I - that I can do it myself. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:15, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Bloody hell, human. Are you going senile? You did the same thing a couple of days ago. <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 06:09, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Bloody hell, GK, you know there is a giant banner when editing this page that asks you senile editors to use cap tags. Sorry if you people can't read. Then keep reading and understand why it matters for the young and agile to use the simple tag, not for the old and slow to edit with it in hopes of seeing the silliness. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:19, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Some things really aren't worth capping. When is somebody going to go through our file list and remove the shitload of uncategorised useless caps which we've accumulated?  <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 06:04, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Because hard drives are pretty much free these days, it doesn't matter. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  01:59, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Sorry, but I have been able to get in for a week or so and thought they undid the Great Banning. Is it not the case? Whoover (talk) 13:53, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * From my vantage point, he seems to have undone a lot of it, but not all. He's unblocked most of my IP addresses, but not all of them. And then he reblocked one after I clicked a link from here through to CP, which I don't think was a coincidence. I think after we laughed at Karajou for being an idiot about the 503s, he got the message that what he was doing was pointless and counterproductive, but he's still kind of in love with the idea of blocking us lot from viewing CP. -- 00:37, 11 August 2013 (UTC)

I don't suppose anyone managed to cap this
Before ken burned whatever departure he was announcing did they? Oldusgitus (talk) 06:03, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * No, but given it's right after someone challenged him about Nils Heribert-Nilsson I presume he's scampered down his intellectually bunny hole for a while. Now, who on earth would have expected that to happen?  <font color=Blue>Генгис silverbrain.png 06:12, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The user who announced his departure wasn't Ken, it was JAnderson. I don't have a screencap of it but it went something like "Andy is not doing anything to solve this site's problems, Ken is writing terrible shit all over the place, fuck this I'm leaving." - Bill Rawls (talk) 08:47, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thanks, I was intrigued I admit. Oldusgitus (talk) 08:48, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * It was mentioned a few posts back by Occasionaluse that no one at CP gives a damn about Ken, in particular Andy and I agree. I honestly believe should something happen to him he would be mourned more on RW than he is on CP who probably would not even acknowledge his departure where some on RW may even shed a tear or two. I am not suggesting his garbage go unchecked but do feel he has more friends on RW than he has on CP which is very sad.--Mercian (talk) 13:21, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Conservapedia only found out about TK's death through us, barely mentioned it and did almost nothing to commemorate him. Sadly, Ken would probably get even less. --Night Jaguar (talk) 14:09, 10 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ken's own family doesn't take good care of him. Andy Schlafly and Karaturd sure as shit aren't going to. Heck, Karaturd is the only one who's even mentioned Ken's identity as far as I can see, and he now apparently thinks everything is hunky dory with that guy. [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 15:27, 10 August 2013 (UTC)

I guess we could be proud of our sad tidings when we lost Susan. Also we do nothing to help Proxima - I hate her edits, but surely she needs a little help? I don't think we care much about Ken. From my perspective, he has from time to time tried to destroy my business. No love lost there. By why aren't his wiki-mates seemingly concerned with his well-being? We joke about it, but we also are serious and want to see the disabled get high quality help. OK, that was my fitty cents. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  05:32, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Doesn't Andy think Ken is somekinda SEO god who brings all the people to his wiki? Perhaps that's why he lets him do what he does? --Revolverman (talk) 14:54, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * He tried to destroy your business, that is not very conservative. Seriously, did he?--Mercian (talk) 15:40, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Yes. He even tried to use CP in his attacks, but Andy, to his credit, removed the weird attempts. Of all the RW editors, I am in many ways vulnerable on the internet, since I depend on it for my living.  Might be under a fresh attack right now.  That's not paranoia, it's Google for some reason not returning my files that match search requests. Hoping this will be fixed soon.  I don't think Ken has actually ever succeeded in messing with my business, but he tried. <font color="#DD00DD" face="comic sans ms"> ħ uman  02:03, 12 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Ken has actually admitted he suffers from multiple personalities or something like that: . Whaddaya think? --2.228.141.122 (talk) 21:19, 11 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Did anyone say how fucking scummy it is for Karaturd to blame liberals or RWians or anyone but Andy Schlafly for 500s and server issues on CP? [[file:Nuttysig.svg|68px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]]100x100 anarchy symbol.svg 21:59, 11 August 2013 (UTC)