Talk:Elon Musk/Archive1

Topic
We probably ought to start with background.

Biographies: --chipbag01Tolk page 21:22, 23 July 2016 (UTC)
 * On biography.com
 * On The Other Wiki
 * A book

Article needs attention
This article is currently of low quality, with a basic fact list and a few unhelpful anecdotes which don't help us understand him. Lack of references. Should be merged with Hyperloop. TeslaK20 (talk) 21:19, 24 July 2016 (UTC)

Iain M Banks
I saw the article touches on Musk's interest in Banks' Culture series of sci-fi novels. Which reminded me of this article https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/ypw9ky/why-are-elon-musk-and-mark-zuckerberg-reading-utopian-sci-fi from 3 years ago. The 2 autonomous barges that serve as landing platforms for SpaceX's verticle landing reusable rockets are named after 2 of the sentient starhips from the Culture novels. Whilst searching for the above article I also found an article from The Guardian which entirely coincidentally has today's date on it, which suggests that Musk badly misunderstands Banks' views and his work. https://www.theguardian.com/books/booksblog/2018/jun/19/elon-musk-iain-banks-culture-novels. Anyway I hope these articles might prove usefull if anyone wanted to expand upon the existing Banks references.

As an aside, Iain M Banks just happens to be one of my favourite ever writers and I highly recommend that any sci-fi fan that hasn't already done so, should prioritize reading all of the 'Culture' series as soon as they possibly can. Some of his non sci-fi work, which he wrote as Iain Banks, the M is only used for his sci-fi, is also pretty good, I just could not put 'The Wasp Factory' down, read it from cover to cover in a single sitting. not a real jedidamn right i'm paranoid 23:36, 19 June 2018 (UTC)

r/EnoughMuskSpam
https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughMuskSpam/ LuodiWang (talk) 19:38, 15 July 2018 (UTC)
 * That's a nice subreddit. I like thread. We should definitely cover his promises that only serve to hype futurists. 21:52, 15 July 2018 (UTC)

Writing quality
The overall quality of writing in this article is extremely poor when compared to other RW articles. 14:32, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Great. Make it better GrammarCommie! Thanks!!! Shabi  DOO  20:47, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I myself am not interested in talking about his assholish behavior. 20:52, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
 * I know very little about Musk, and am not sure I want to change that. 21:18, 3 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Content is not the only thing you can do. Rewriting some of the text, correcting grammar, cutting out the padding, finding copyright images, add a bit of snark. And as for content, you'd be surprised how little time it takes to read up on him and add a thing or two. I knew very little about him as well. And you don't have to just look up the stupid shit he does or says. It could use a little more of his biography which you can easily find reliable sources for and give a brief overview. Shabi  DOO  21:52, 3 August 2018 (UTC)

Hey, folks! I think the section on his business ventures could expand. His electric cars and space capsules have been receiving a lot of attention recently. Nerd (talk) 21:58, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

Non sequitur?
Under the batshit crazy section it mentions substance abuse and goes on to say he smoked weed on a podcast. Went to find said smoking on Youtube, apparently Joe Rogan offered it to him, whereupon Musk made doubly sure it was legal to smoke it, tried it briefly, and went on to proclaim he never smokes weed. What am I missing here, is smoking weed the aforementioned substance abuse? Are we trying to say that smoking this weed was a bad thing? (Also, he seemed like a genuinely nice and caring person in that short part of the podcast I watched, but that's just an aside thing I noticed, not really relevant since we are trying to find what the bad things about him are.) Oh, btw, this is the bit: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DasnKpMyQ8 Right in the first minute is where he smokes. Feel free to use as citation. 171.33.193.245 (talk) 16:52, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * The substance abuse refers to taking both stimulants and transquilizers to work 20 hour days and try and sleep 4 hours. He admitted this. The pot smoking online, in itself is not a big deal (though a CEO doing that is disconcerting for investors), doing it while you're already stuck in several controversies sets off some red flags. He likely is a pleasant guy to be around, however he has tweeted some very awful stuff, multiple times, about several people and issues and won't back down from it. It is an interesting contrast with his otherwise near Mesiah image (which may deserved to some extent).  Shabi  DOO  22:05, 11 September 2018 (UTC)
 * Fair enough. May be good to put this clarification you provided in the article itself, maybe with a citation to where he admitted it, but by no means are you obligated to do so. 171.33.193.245 (talk) 14:47, 12 September 2018 (UTC)

Up in smoke
Is his future so doing? 82.44.143.26 (talk) 17:20, 10 September 2018 (UTC)
 * He's still a millionaireDoublethink (talk) 04:17, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

Elon
Really sad that he lost his mind. He was a visionary.Doublethink (talk) 04:08, 1 December 2018 (UTC)

Bullshit
While some of it may have been redundant, there's no need to delete the snarky aspects of the article. This is RW, not Wikipedia. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  19:28, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Having two sections on his questionable accusation of pedophilia is redundant to me. Furthermore, there is a difference between reasoned criticism and downright bashing. The former we do; the latter we avoid. Nerd (talk) 19:30, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Really? Bashing counts as snark, and frankly, Elon deserves it. Besides, RW has always been open to bashing, it's called "snark" for a reason. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  19:32, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, really. Verbal attacks are not OK. (We are better than him, no?) Instead of throwing vitriol at him, why not dissect the things he has said and done? This is a place for rational thought, not hit pieces. Nerd (talk) 19:42, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * There's no reason to not make it funny while doing so. Other than that I`m not disinclined to disagree with you. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  20:17, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Ah, but snark or humor to some is offensive or over the top to others. So let's be careful. We do not want to give the impression that we are some sort of angry blog.
 * You are not disinclined to disagree with me. A triple negative is a negative. Care to explain what the problems are in your view? Nerd (talk) 21:55, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * RW has always been snarky, just because some people take offense to it doesn't mean we should take it down. This website was like that for years. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  21:57, 23 December 2018 (UTC)

I disagree. Just because it has always been that way does not mean we should continue. I consider it my mission here to bring in as many relevant facts and and as much nuance as possible, leaving aside the opinions. Readers can certainly think for themselves. Some light humor is totally fine. But abuse is a different story. Furthermore, there is very little difference between your revision and mine. Nerd (talk) 22:02, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * You're free to disagree, but don't go deleting content just because you don't like it, there must be a more valid reason than personal feelings regarding snarky humor. This isn't Wikipedia. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  22:04, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I don't like the big chunk I deleted because it is redundant. We do not need two sections on allegations of pedophilia. Nor do we need loaded language. Nerd (talk) 22:07, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, I agree with deleting the redundant sections of the article, but I disagree on removing the loaded language. This isn't Wikipedia. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  22:10, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * Yes, this is not Wikipedia. We focus on debunking misconceptions. But that does not mean using loaded language, something we can easily and clearly do without. Nerd (talk) 22:13, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * I give up. Obviously you aren't going to change your mind on this. You win. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  22:14, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * In any case, thank you for the respectful conversation. I appreciate it. We should have more of the same around here. Nerd (talk) 22:18, 23 December 2018 (UTC)
 * It's part of RW policy to make articles at least somewhat funny, we don't need to be dry like Wikipedia. — Ɖøn Ĵuan   Harass  11:40, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
 * It's been two years since this conversation occurred. I now find myself agreeing with Nerd more and more. "He who fights monsters...." — Oxyaena Harass  19:26, 9 December 2020 (UTC)

Delete or write a real page
All Musk has to do with Hyperloop is publishing a PDF stating that it is possible. It's definitely not the only thing he does, so it seems unfair to redirect him there. It's as if somebody looked for anything bad about him. At most it could be mentioned as reverse stopped clock. Requesting thread archival (why?) Plutocow (talk)

how the fuck could he win?
when nothing he said about Unsworth was remotely true, and when accusations of this type ruin lives. AMassiveGay (talk) 16:19, 13 March 2020 (UTC)
 * becaues he was tried in Silicon Valley, it's a statistical impossibility to find five people in Silicon Valley and have absolutely none of them be insane Musk cultists who think he's the messiah and can do no wrong and would never under any circumstances vote to convict him.
 * Speaking of which how is Musk not classified as a libertarian wingnut and how is there no section on his insane cult of personality at this point? 76.126.165.152 (talk)
 * By all means 76.126.165.152, start writing it and we'll help you out. Shabi  DOO  17:15, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

Pyramidology
See variously on the net. Anna Livia (talk) 20:04, 2 August 2020 (UTC)

On wanting to launch your own astronauts being “nationalist”
I question the wisdom of ever insisting that we rely on just one launch vehicle to get humans into orbit. But after February 24, 2022, the folly of believing that we wanted to develop our own solely because of “nationalism” should be obvious. So I took the liberty of removing the offending statement from the article. 2600:1006:B142:B24D:69BC:AC32:3109:7845 (talk) 19:11, 21 April 2022 (UTC)A
 * Uh what's going on? --Andrew5 (talk) 21:54, 21 April 2022 (UTC)
 * Is it not obvious? The war in Ukraine and its consequences like massive sanctions? 2600:1700:38E0:A040:5DA4:774:7389:4DA3 (talk) 20:48, 23 April 2022 (UTC) A on a different computer

Ukraine War
This article needs an update for what Elon has done in Ukraine. While he had semi-legendary status in Ukraine due to providing internet through Starlink, he has pretty much pissed away all goodwill when he proposed a "peace treaty" that had straight-up Russian propaganda and screamed "I looked up the Ukrainian conflict on Wikipedia for 5 minutes so now I'm a foreign policy expert." --Anti-Putinist Action (talk) 18:19, 6 October 2022 (UTC)

"Sociopathy" -_-
Can we please refrain from making an ASPD diagnosis for this person? He is (self-admittedly) autistic, and blindly labeling him a sociopath will only serve to further the stigma towards those who suffer from autism and personality disorders. There is no evidence that he is a " narcissistic sociopath" anyway. Where are the reliable sources? What if he's just a rich asshole?. This is page is nothing more than armchair psychology until we hear from his psychiatrist or whatever. Something needs to be done about this section. To even speculate what his psychopathology is based just on watching him on television (and two unreliable sources with a hate boner for him) is completely offensive and inappropriate. Don't act like you know his neurodivergencies more than he does.--RadicalRadish (talk) 04:59, 17 November 2022 (UTC)
 * Sociopathy isn't interchangeable with ASPD. For the record, you can be narcissistic without having narcissistic personality disorder. Personality disorders exist on the extreme manifestation of personality traits that interfere with one's ability to maintain healthy social and occupational relationships. Not every descriptor of a personality with negative connotations is a diagnostic label or a product of neurodiversity. - Only Sort of Dumb (talk) 06:35, 17 November 2022 (UTC).
 * You didnt directly address my argument. The concern was not the narcissistic part alone, I put loads of emphasis on the Sociopath side of things. Sociopathy and ASPD are interchangeable terms BTW. The term sociopath has always referred to people with the neurodiversity, healthline says so, googling sociopath will show you the wiki page for ASPD, and even our own wiki states that people diagnosed with ASPD are often called sociopaths. With that said I still stand with the notion that this section needs a makeover. It is unethical to speculate and suggest the mental health disorders of real people, especially if its being done so to put a person in a negative light... Its just very ableist especially since mental health diagnosis were originally made to harm those who were different. We arent mental health professionals, the youtube video cited as a source suggesting Elon Musk is a sociopath wasnt made by a mental health professional, and even if we were its unlikely any of us are professionally examining Elon Musk one-on-one.--RadicalRadish (talk) 09:46, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * OSD has a degree in psychology, and as a clinical diagnosis ASPD is not equivalent to sociopathy, which as a term is medically disparaged. That being said I otherwise agree with you, although Elon is still a miserable pile of shit. Vee (talk) 09:49, 18 November 2022 (UTC)
 * This is a wiki for thinking people, right? Here's something to consider for you: The fact that he let Trump and other assholes return to Twitter also means that he's now able to say "You're fired!" to them as well. (As I added to the article.) I wouldn't say that's out of question for the future... People who still think Trump was playing 5D chess are wrong of course, but in Elon's case I'm not so sure. - And I agree with Radish about (see above).--Max Sinister (talk) 06:02, 20 April 2023 (UTC)

Elon musk is openly a white supremacist now.
https://twitter.com/Wilson__Valdez/status/1655398486232244224  Requesting thread archival (why?) Plutocow (talk)

Emerald Mines
Should we mention something about this? He's denying that his family became rich from those mines and offered 1 Mil. Dogecoin, if anyone could show him any proof. Arcadium Trancefer (talk) 17:08, 10 May 2023 (UTC)
 * If you have sufficient proof...--Max Sinister (talk) 01:20, 11 May 2023 (UTC)
 * https://www.news24.com/fin24/companies/if-you-can-prove-elon-musks-family-co-owned-zambian-emerald-mine-hell-pay-r16m-in-dogecoin-20230413 Arcadium Trancefer (talk) 13:11, 13 May 2023 (UTC)