RationalWiki:Saloon bar/Archive106

Ok clever people
Please explain to me how this works. --OompaLoompa (talk) 12:15, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * The end result is always a multiple of 9. If you look at the table at step 2, you'll notice that all multiples of 9 are the same item.--ZooGuard (talk) 12:19, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * To quote HS, "Doh!" Thank you for helping this bear with a little brain. --OompaLoompa (talk) 12:27, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * This one uses the same principle http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/flash/mind. I remember having to look it up on google myself because I couldn't figure it out either. --Danfly (talk) 12:35, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Same trick actually, always a multiple of 9. -  π    12:43, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Some mathematical thinking on why it's always a multiple of 9: for every two-digit number, subtracting the second digit gives you the "naked" multiple of 10 (e.g. 25 - 5 = 20). Then, for every multiple of 10, subtracting the multiplier gives you a multiple of 9, which is normal (e.g. 20 = 10 * 2, so 20 - 2 = 18 = 9 * 2).--ZooGuard (talk) 12:45, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I know that π. That's why I said it was using the same principle :P. --Danfly (talk) 12:50, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * What I like about the crystal ball one is that because you will never get a number larger than 81 it keeps 82-99 the same so that you are less likely to notice straight away that the list is randomized or the multiples of 9 are the sames as 99 an 90 are different. -  π    12:58, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

A similar game
I think I've recounted this on here before, but... Some years ago, a co-worker came up to my and told me "pick a number between one and ten, and don't tell me what it is." He went through a couple more steps, then told me to "add the digits together."

I responded, "well, that may take a while, because the number I picked was pi."

His response was something like, "Pick. An. Integer!". MDB (talk) 13:57, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

What is this?
I’m at the Swiss embassy in Slovakia and saw this. The front is even more impressive. I want one. Anyone know what it is? 06:25, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * A car. &mdash;Preceding obvious comment added by: Captain Obvious / talk / contribs 06:34, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Wiesmann GT. You know, it's written on its arse. :)--ZooGuard (talk) 06:37, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I see there is writing on it but I was too far to catch what it says. No shit it’s a car.  Happen to know the company who designed and made it?  06:45, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Er, the name is in the link. And you can zoom in the picture. That's what I did. :)--ZooGuard (talk) 07:16, 28 May 2011 (UTC)


 * Shouldnt you blur the liscense plate or something?? Ancient Greek Pegasus icon.png 07:51, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Not unless it belongs to Brian Macdonald Karajou, and as it's a stinky foreign car I doubt very much that he'd have one. Otherwise, what would be the point of blurring the number?  Lily Inspirate me. 08:30, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I thought that was just what you did with numbers on cars for privacy. Ancient Greek Pegasus icon.png 08:32, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Maybe for celebs or government employees who might be a target but random cars in a street, not really.  Lily Inspirate me. 08:37, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Google street view does it routinely, probably to head off privacy lawsuits. Real first name and last initialTalk, talk, talk skim my contributions 09:56, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * As well as being common courtesy to blur a private car's numberplate for privacy reasons, it also helps in the fight against car ringing - using the plates of a genuine car on a stolen one. Ajkgordon (talk) 18:19, 28 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I'd be very surprised if there were many Wiesmann's being ringed.  Lily Inspirate me. 08:27, 29 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Ringers can get the number of a legitimate silver BMW just by walking down the street. The rarer the car the more difficult it is so the Internet is used as a resource. Besides, it's still common courtesy. Ajkgordon (talk) 09:40, 29 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Actually, it's more of a holdover from the 90s. Nobody worries about it any more, now that we figured out that license plates are sort of visible in public anyway.  07:25, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I dunno what the front looks like (I bet WP does), but those are some awesome lines! 05:06, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's basically a BMW in drag. Top Gear did a thing on its sister car. Ajkgordon (talk) 07:54, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh my. How lovely! Thanks!  02:42, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

Believe in god? The sexy police will fix that.
This new RRS ad goes into Evony territory. On the other hand, I am feeling strangely full of faith, all of a sudden. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 22:16, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Used to be, linking to KYM was one of the most offensive acts on the internet to me. But now it's linking to OI.  Regardless, I fixt your link for you.  Warning: NSFW--  22:43, 30 May 2011 (UTC)
 * @Nebby bleh. @Brxbrx-- I prefer linking to here over all three.ТyUser_talk:Ty 00:37, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * @ bricks and tyring, this isn't ED. Just in case you hadn't noticed. 07:21, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * That was a link to tvtropes, as described below. ТyUser_talk:Ty 11:50, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Yay! I survived a link to TVTropes without a three-hour tab explosion! I think I must be getting an immunity...--ZooGuard (talk) 08:14, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

She doesn't really do it for me. I don't understand what is the attraction of women who dress like she does. I find women far more attractive when they wear normal clothes and just be themselves; when they try to look like this, or like the photos of women in men's magazines, they just feel like... plastic barbie dolls. Anyway, no cute girl's gonna make me an atheist; the cuter they are, the more they make me sure that God/dess exists. 10:35, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * I second that - except for the believe in god/dess part. And because I feel like I have to, to all the woman on this blue marble and in it's orbit: For fucks sake stop dressing up, you look good enough, just be yourself and we'll love you. --ǓḤṂ³ 01:21, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What? Don't listen to Ullhateme! I mean, you have no obligation toward me, but oh the pretty dresses, and the stockings - and the shoes. The wonderful shoes! When everybody (and I don't just mean men) is staring it's because you are making a powerful aesthetic statement, and don't worry the drool will come right out with a damp sponge. We are all equals, but some of my equals have tits and look really amazing in a summer frock (much better than I do, even if I shave) 82.69.171.94 (talk) 16:17, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh Marat, what a silver-tongued devil you are.  Lily Inspirate me. 13:12, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * This is going to save a lot of time wasted shaving legs and armpits! 05:01, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * anybody else think that stripper cop looks a little mannish? Also, Should we really give these guys any of our respect?  Forgive the missing pics.  DeHippo won't surrender the ED database.--  13:28, 31 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Libel, hardcore pornography, broken links? I can't for the life of me work out what ED is actually trying to say, and I have no idea whether anything of what it is saying is true or not. Don't really care about the RRS... but ED, they could be funny sometimes (in a very wrong way), but this page isn't funny. BTW, if you are going to link to ED, you should put a warning next to the link... so people don't click it without realising its ED (or not knowing what ED is), and get bombarded unexpectedly with hardcore porn. 19:34, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

That's actually pretty old. The RRS is more or less dead and Kelly went on to a career in porn and escorting under the name Kasey Grant (seemed to be a lot of "well, at least someone appreciates me" after the RRS collapsed from internal drama). Opinions are somewhat mixed on that aspect of her career. She's still an atheist, though, and an outspoken Linux advocate. EVDebs (talk) 04:40, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Reports of my demise have been greatly exaggerated.
Or something.

I just wanted to give a shout-out to everyone here and let you know I'm still around, just with limited internet access for the time being. I'll be back to add my two cents on whatever strikes my fancy in a few weeks. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 04:26, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I heard there is no such thing as you. Just sayin'...  04:57, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * One of the recent US wars generated a full-on, dead hero soldier counter-example so that Americans had to shut up about that. A Wikipedia search should find it. Not that atheists in foxholes were ever actually rare. 82.69.171.94 (talk) 23:13, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Glad to know you are alright. ТyUser_talk:Ty 23:26, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If you're talking about Tillman, I'd hardly call him a "hero soldier". "Celebrity soldier", certainly.  But comparing Tillman to Sgt. York might be a bit much.  -- 23:57, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I heard about the Tillman thing back when it happened, but I didn't read too much into it. I think the big thing combat did to me was put me in close proximity to a lot of meaningless death. The constant strain of combat patrols and the actions of those patrols made me realize that there isn't any point to it and when you die, you die. That's it. There are no fuckin' guarantees (afterlife, re-incarnation, etc.). Now the Army fitness evaluation is telling me that my "Spiritual Fitness" score may be "putting me at risk" and I should "seek the advice of a chaplain". Whatever. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 00:47, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Calling Father Mulcahy! On another note, glad to see you alive and hopefully coping with the shit you've seen.  04:42, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I'm coping. Contrary to popular (theistic) belief, I feel that my atheism as a direct result of war is what is allowing me to cope with a lot of my experiences. I'm not worried about gaining entrance to a particular afterlife, so I can devote what little time I have in this world to my family and friends, making it truly valuable. (To me, that is...) The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 05:07, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

Care home abuse
Did any UKians watch this last night? Probably one of the most disturbing things I've seen in a while. Crundy Talk nerdy to me 10:52, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I didn't, but I saw the article on the BBC website. Those disgraceful bastards need a fucking good kicking. 11:29, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

WBC vs KKK
I feel dirty that I have to agree with the KKK on this one. But then again, it is the WBC. Wait, the KKK are terrorists. I just agreed with terrorists. Need to reboot brain, will return later--Thanatos (talk) 18:57, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The KKK guys are right about this, regardless of being wrong about everything else.  19:09, 1 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The KKK aren't as white supremacist as they once were. They still are, but not as much. It is a PR thing, if I remember, didn't try to say there are "pro-white; not anti-black" or something like that during the '70s? The KKK is now a historical relic, we are faced with a bigger problem of the WBC. Leninist123 (talk) 00:49, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * So they've gone from being murderers to just assholes? 04:41, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The WBC is a "bigger problem"? Someone slap the troll, please.--ZooGuard (talk) 05:09, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I think the KKK aspect of this story is being overemphasised since the Klan as a whole doesn't appear to be taking sides, just a few buddies in a local chapter who got together to protest against WBC.  06:10, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, they are assholes but they don't do as much murdering as they once did. Leninist123 (talk) 22:42, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Isn't it possible to take a Conservapedia style stance and say their both wrong... like even if it's impossible for both to be wrong. Ancient Greek Pegasus icon.png 23:15, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oscar Wilde nailed this: the pursuit of the inedible by the unspeakable. Howard C. Berkowitz (talk) 01:53, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

Ambien.
Ambien id sa presecription drufg oftend guiven to help wirth seleeep issues. It offeres the partient an uninrtrereupttted 7-9 hours of sleep, usually kicking in aboiut an hour after tqking the poillll.It also apparently can be used for sexual purposes, but I'm all nby my loersome, ...gooodnight...P-Foster (talk) 03:13, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Just don't OD on it. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 03:18, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * G'night. ТyUser_talk:Ty 03:19, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

ljyr o 6ogfdgtuocr 6 o ytuite86459fbv  tffgfgflgg P-Foster (talk) 04:05, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Uh, maybe it's time to call Poison Control? Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 04:09, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Agreed. O______o''--Dumpling (talk) 04:16, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Having trouble sleeping? Try quetiapine (seroquel) I took it for a couple of years and it puts you right to sleep - a good wholesome sleep too, not the kind of sleep whereby you feel worse when you wake up than when you went to bed.  DamoHi 04:37, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * try Lorazepam, its nice. Isnt Ambian the one where a giant glowing green moth appears ? seems creepy. Hamster (talk) 05:08, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That's Lunesta, and it's a purpley-greenish butterfly. I guess the marketing department thought moths were too icky, despite being associated with the night. Which is confusing, because if you think about it, a damn butterfly SHOULD be asleep at night, whereas a moth would be UP all night, but the Lunesta butterfly is out on its insomniatic ass, molesting women to sleep and then flying on to the next house without a care in the world. Ambien, however, had my wife hallucinating tiny Korean babies circle dancing around the rim of a candle. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 05:50, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * @Hamster: Using benzodiazepines to sleep is not the best idea. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 05:57, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Whatever you do, don't drink anything at all (even one beer) when you have an ambien. You'll wake up in a police cell with no idea why. Horrible stuff. Crundy Talk nerdy to me 08:11, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Seroquel has been effective for sleep, although it's not an approved indication. As long as I slept, it was fine, but I had the bizarre side effect of having my legs paralyzed for about 6 hours. Dragging oneself to the porcelain throne, by arm power alone, is not fun. Howard C. Berkowitz (talk) 20:18, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, I don't think that seroquel would be approved for insomnia, its just a side effect of the drug. Having your legs paralyzed by it sounds weird.  How much were you taking?  DamoHi 04:45, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

RegEx help
Can someone give me a hand? I need to find all the code files in our system which use Request.QueryString, but ignore situations where we have a "BackUrl" sent on the query string, e.g. if I have three files containing:

File 1: Request.QueryString("SomeId")

File 2: Request.QueryString("SomeId") ... Request.QueryString("BackUrl")

File 3: Request.QueryString("BackUrl")

Then I want to match files 1 and 2 but not three. So something like /Request\.QueryString\(\"!(Back)/ or whatever the negating character for a group is. I suck at Regular expressions! Crundy Talk nerdy to me 08:17, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What Regex engine are you using? grep? egrep? Perl? It's relevant, because the syntax will differ depending... if you have something like Perl, then you should be able to do this with negation assertions... even though they aren't technical "regular" expressions any more (in the mathematical sense). 08:50, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If this was Linux, how about this:  ... no actual regexes there, just fgrep, but should do the job. Except, given that looks like ASP/ASP.NET, maybe it isn't Linux :(  08:53, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * No, it's a little file search app I wrote in .NET so it's using the MS regex engine. Crundy Talk nerdy to me 08:59, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * OK... turns out .Net syntax is same as Perl anyway, you want negative lookahead assertion, e.g. ... see e.g. here  09:04, 2 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Indeed, negative lookhead should work the trick. In Perl, I would try /Request\.QueryString\(\"(?!BackUrl\"\))[^\"]*\"\)/
 * 09:53, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

If you're writing your own search tool to look through your code, you're doing it wrong. Go install lxr now. Now. Or better still go beat your IT guys until they install a global lxr for your company. I can't imagine how anyone copes without a cross referencer. -- 10:45, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You may not believe this but, my company, we are not allowed to run lxr... the paranoid security nazis are scared of it. They have this strange idea, that source code in web browser = security risk, source code on NFS mount = all good. 10:49, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks, that worked. I wrote my own because it only took about 5 minutes and worked exactly as I wanted instead of downloading a feature-rich tool and working out how the hell it works. Crundy Talk nerdy to me 10:54, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm serious though. Go beat your IT people until they install a cross referencer. On any sizeable codebase, you're shooting yourself in the foot if you don't have one. It's like not having a bug tracker or source control. Also, install cygwin so you can use find. -- 10:59, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * As I said, no lxr for me... but I survive with find|xargs fgrep and less bunged into PuTTY.... and all our source code is dumped on all these NFS servers (why would we use an industry standard version control system when we can write our own, eh?), and I have all these nice scripts I wrote which maintain my own collection of symlinks to our maze of NFS servers :) 11:24, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Rather than xargs you can just use something like find -iname '*.c' -type f -execdir grep -H foo '{}' \; -- 11:39, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What does lxr do? It looks the same as Visual Studio's "Find all references" tool. Crundy Talk nerdy to me 12:06, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Jeeves, not familiar with execdir... what is the advantage, if any, over my usual approaches... xargs or -print0 | xargs -0 or | while read f; do .... what difference between execdir and exec? 12:20, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's ten times shorter. --85.78.156.46 (talk) 12:39, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I type fast and without thinking... to change, I'd have to think about what I was doing, and that would make me slower  12:43, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The difference between exec and execdir is that the latter runs whatever command you specify from the subdirectory containing the file rather than the pwd of where you ran find (all explained in "man find"). As for doing find -exec versus xargs: find runs the specified command on each file in turn ("ls file1; ls file2; ls file3") whereas xargs constructs an argument list and does them all at once ("ls file1 file2 file3"). Consequently, the xargs approach can be faster, but you need to take care with escaping spaces etc: xargs will happily lead to a command+arguments like "ls filename with spaces" which won't do what you want, whereas find -exec will automagically escape such things for you. alt (talk) 17:56, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The spaces issue I usually solve with  and    19:33, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Although a cross reference tool is nice, I really don't find I miss it on projects which don't have it so long as they use git. Things like 'git log -Sfoo' (show me a list of all changes which added or removed mentions of foo in my source code) are ridiculously useful. LXR's existence of course long pre-dates the git project. 82.69.171.94 (talk) 21:51, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

Are there any real economists here who can tell if this article is accurate?
I just read this at Slate Foreign Policy. The basic gist of the argument is that Wall Street speculation after deregulation is the sole cause of the rising cost of food. Can any economist or economics student here evaluate the claims in the article? It's all way over my head, but makes me vaguely furious. Junggai (talk) 13:41, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I have to be skeptical of anything that claims "X is the sole cause of Y", when Y is something as complex as rising food prices. MDB (talk) 13:56, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * This appears to be a reprint of an article that appeared in Harper's last year. Speculation in oil also causes the cost of food to go up because you need oil for just about everything (see here and here for more). However, it's important to take into account the effect of crop failure and climate on prices (Joe Romm has a good post on that here). So, speculation, big cause? Yes. Only cause? No. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 14:29, 2 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Thanks for clearing that up. I had a feeling that the case was being overstated somewhat, but in all fairness, I went back and looked at the article again, and saw that the article's tone is more measured than the headline and bylines, which sex up its claims a bit. Junggai (talk) 15:13, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * In several political forums of different ideology, I'd note that people have been complaining that Slate has gotten more sensationalistic. It's less clear to me if this is more in the headlining or it's actually in the content; I note as information rather than as judgment.


 * There's an econometric concept of a "leading economic indicator", which tends to predict changes, in contrast to short-term measurements, in contrast to measurements taken over time, and especially measurements that are corrected for time series variation (e.g., vegetables are more expensive in winter. Are they more expensive this winter than in corresponding winters?) That should be considered. Speculation is often considered leading. There also can be a disconnect, as with oil, on actual wholesale prices, affected both by speculation on futures and on production cost, and prices at the pump. At least in the US, the retail food margin runs on fairly narrow margins, so they are a bit less willing to raise prices than in a market where there are few alternatives. Howard C. Berkowitz (talk) 17:13, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

What to do about this?
I found this article (http://creation.com/probing-the-earths-deep-places) linked from CP, yeah I think that CP and creationism are bullshit, but what is the whole deal with "runaway subduction" theories? But one other thing ... if the Flood was really just caused by naturalistic processes, then that would obviate the need for God to supernaturally cause the Flood, which was said to have been caused because "people were really violent back then" = self-defeating for creationists to try and use science to back themselves up? Besides the fact that science, as we know it, refutes them every single time. 69.121.43.11 (talk) 20:34, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Write an article about it, here; we're a skeptical wiki. steriletalk 20:42, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Seconded. It's bollocks. Talk.origins has already done this: see Claim CH430 in the index of creationist claims. More views of the same info is A Good Thing and talk.origins is a good reference. Particularly since t.o is quite static nowadays, due to the slow death of Usenet.Gomer (talk) 22:16, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * if you follow a chain of reasoning it all makes sense. God is all knowing. So before he even started he knew it was going to go wrong and that mankind needed to be destroyed so when he built the Earth he built in the caverns containing water at great depth and set it up so they would heat up and the pressure would blow it up at the right moment. God knew physics and geology!
 * Good stuff. TalkOrigins saves the day! 69.121.43.11 (talk) 22:34, 2 June 2011 (UTC)
 * To wit: "Hey! I'm gonna do this thing... but I know right now that I'm not going to be satisfied with the result. I know what to do! Since I also know exactly WHEN I'll be most dissatisfied with it, I'll program a self-destruct sequence set to go at that exact moment. But when I do something, I do it ALL THE WAY, so EVERYTHING is going to be destroyed. So I'll program in a failsafe to collect and preserve the stuff I DO like. Isn't that so much simpler than just doing it right the first time?" The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 23:09, 2 June 2011 (UTC)

Need a computer nerd.
So a friend of mine sent me the following today: "I took several thousand photographs of files during my last stint in the archive. They are all in jpeg format, are of reasonably good quality, and are grouped in folders on my hard drive. I am looking for some easy way to sharpen and straighten all of the pictures, run some form of text recognition on them (they are typed and handwritten in English) and turn them into handy-dandy pdf files. I eventually want to print out quite a few of them; to do that I would probably have to fix the contrast/brightness of the images so that they are readable." Obviously, doing them one at a time in Photoshop/Acrobat Pro is not an option. He's a Windows guy. Any suggestions? P-Foster (talk) 02:54, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * have a look at Fastone Photo resizer. It will do batch processing for size and type converssions and adjustments to brightness, contrast and color balance. Converting the pictures to pdf can be done by pronting to a pdf writer like Primopdf. Dont know about image to text conversion. You might try one of the scanner companies like Canon for a download . Hamster (talk) 04:46, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * thanks! P-Foster (talk) 18:18, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

Energy crisis solved!
Not really. I saw this Salon article bouncing around in the blagoblag and man, this some supreme techno-optimism if I've ever seen it. Peak oil? No problem, we'll have natural gas! (The article on fracking has some good resources on why the issue is way more complex than this.) Global warming? No problem, fire up the nukes! This is a good reminder that beating climate denialism is only the first step toward a better energy policy. Now cue the right-blogosphere with headlines of "Even the liberal Salon" in 3,2,1... /rant Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 03:32, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Comment gold: "Dr. Strangelind, Or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Global Warming." Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 04:32, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * God, I read that turd of an article a few days ago. I especially loved his glib dismissal of fracking concerns ("who needs uncontaminated aquifers?") in practically the same breath as criticizing wind turbines for having killed some birds. Those damned Greens, willing to compromise their love of eagles for a clean underground water supply. Junggai (talk) 11:57, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

My cat and dog.
Just going to post something which has nothing to do with rationality, politics or religion. This is a youtube video of my cat and dog play-fighting. At first you think it's kind of serious but it's quickly clear that it's not.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:17, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh my god, I could watch that shit all day. Too freakin' cute!  --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 18:19, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What I like is that, under those conditions, they could do pretty serious damage to each other. But each trusts the other not to.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:26, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes! I actually wrestle with my dog, biting his ears, and he'll bite my nose, all in good fun.  It's really cute.  Thanks for sharing that.  --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 19:21, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The cat has bad a technique. You should not go to a wrestling position with an opponent that big. --85.77.248.16 (talk) 20:35, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Well at one point the cat seems to "throw" the dog.--BobSpring is sprung! 20:56, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Hah, I like that the cat keeps running away then charging back in for round 2, 3 and 4 then it tries for a surprise round 5. -- 20:51, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, I was thinking of doing a voice-over commentary based on rounds.--BobSpring is sprung! 20:56, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * AWW~ Too cute! Made my day. Thanks for posting that up.--Dumpling (talk) 00:05, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My sisters golden retriever licks my cats balls. True story--Thanatos (talk) 04:35, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * O_____O...Wow. I don't know whether to be weirded out...or to just burst out laughing. I'm leaning towards the bursting out in laughter. --Dumpling (talk) 04:38, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

What would you do?
I saw this video. It's well worth watching and I think anyone who supports gay rights would be really encouraged by some of it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zhl9MLno424 00:59, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That was really touching. It really was worth watching. (TTuTT)Thanks for Sharing! --Dumpling (talk) 01:57, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Awesome. I probably would have just LANCB. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 02:45, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

hi
Hi. Whats RW up to this summer? Alyssa Bryant (talk) 12:15, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I might accidentally delete the server so we can all go on a summer holiday again. We haven't had one for nearly two years. 12:23, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

How can I earn my mop back? Better yet how can I become a crat? Alyssa Bryant (talk) 14:18, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You can never, ever become a crat.  That's just the way it is.   15:12, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Why? Alyssa Bryant (talk) 15:22, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Crats don't exist anymore. Gomer (talk) 15:49, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Then how do I become a moderator? Alyssa Bryant (talk) 16:06, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * By practicing moderation in all things. P-Foster (talk) 16:19, 3 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I know this is late but perhaps you could rename the sysop group to System Overlords ? is nicer title and sounds mor impressive to women in bars. Hamster (talk) 19:53, 3 June 2011 (UTC)

Alyssa, you is once more sysop. Best of luck with with that, and my condolences on your demotion. 06:38, 4 June 2011 (UTC)


 * How can I become a demotion? --87.5.101.196 (talk) 19:00, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Alyssa, I could never trus you as Moderator. Just 'cause.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 22:16, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

Conservative celebrities
Vanity Fair has a slideshow of less-publicized conservative celebrities. Author Dean Koontz is a hardcore teabagger. Vince Vaughn and Arlo Guthrie love Ron Paul. Sam Raimi broke my heart - he gave $900 for Bush's 2004 re-election. Ugh. --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 17:47, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * “I wanna meet George Bush, just shake his hand and tell him how much of me I see in him,” I don't think that's a good thing... Ancient Greek Pegasus icon.png 17:50, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Arlo friggin' Guthrie???? I feel queasy. MDB (talk) 17:54, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I know! Alice's Restaurant!!!  --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 17:57, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Bullshit. Johnny Rotten is a conservative for one name-check of a Republican politician and a quote saying that Obama is full of shit? If acknowledging the fundamentally crappy job that Obama is doing makes one a conservative, I guess Noam Chomsky is next on the list. P-Foster (talk) 18:33, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Here's Johnny Rotten writing in 2008 that the Democrats created racism (choice quote: "READ MY OPINION BELOW ABOUT THEIR MESSIAH, THE RACIST, SOCIALIST LIAR NAMED OSAMA, OOPS I MEAN OBAMA"). Here he is supporting awful Republican Ohio governor John Kasich.  Johnny Rotten, neocon punk rocker ("Until I see an Arab country, a Muslim country, with a democracy, I won't understand how anyone can have a problem with how they're treated.").  You can find more...  --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 19:26, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Re the first link: Don't be a fool.  Some guy who writes one loopy blog entry & signs as Johnny Rotten ≠ Sex Pistols frontman.   21:06, 3 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Alright, there might well be something with the support for Kasich -- but hating on Obama doesn't make somebody a conservative. Neither does being a racist, for that matter. There are lots of liberal/Democratic racists, given that the whole system is based on racism. P-Foster (talk) 19:39, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Liberals, in general, don't use "socialist" as a smear. But you may have a point: this interview seems to support your view ("The one thing I cannot abide is this right-wing interfering, fact- manipulating nonsense. We were taken to war by two right-wing religious half-wits. Bush and Blair.")  He's all over the place, but you made a good point that things aren't black and white.  --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 19:46, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Johnny 'I am an anarchist' Rotton sells butter. There is a reason that all the greats die young. AMassiveGay (talk) 19:56, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I thnik hes just attention whoring and saying stuff just to be controversial for the sake of it. That makes more sense than him having political belief X, Y or Z. Ancient Greek Pegasus icon.png 10:39, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I really don't give a crap about this, and I think that this is just some right-wing guy trying to showcase conservative celebrities. I mean, so what? Michael Jackson was (probably) a pedophile, but I still like Smooth Criminal. Judge Pirro has a show on Fox News, but I still watch her court show. And knowing the political beliefs of Raimi and Alice Cooper is not going to change my opinions on their works. I might boycott some names out of protest (the reason I tore down my Chuck Norris poster from High School) but simply dropping them for who they voted for is stupid. We would be like Andy, not watching Forrest Gump because Tom Hanks votes democrat.--Thanatos (talk) 19:19, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

Fitocracy
I just started on Fitocracy, a website that tracks your workouts and awards you points and achievements. It's a fun way to keep track of your efforts at fitness and motivate yourself. For example, for doing 20 crunches you get the achievement, "o hai abs!" Just wondering if there are any other RWians on Fitocracy? I am here. Or if you want to start, I have some invites left (still in closed Beta). Join here.-- 04:53, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Hahaha. "O hai abs!" XD Awesome. I've actually looked into Fitocracy, but no one I know wants to join me. D: So---I'm interested.--Dumpling (talk) 05:03, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If you decide to join, I made a Rationalwikians group :)-- 05:12, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Niiiice! --Dumpling (talk) 05:14, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * HM~ So do I wait for an invitation or am I supposed to get an invitation code from you? --Dumpling (talk) 05:21, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That "join here" link above is a link to my invitation.-- 05:36, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * OH! Didn't see that! Alright, thanks and done! (^u^)b --Dumpling (talk) 05:48, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You guys are really letting the side down by failing to be obese you know. -- 08:39, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Mens sana in corpore sano! You can do it too!-- 23:45, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

BRIAN BLESSED FOR CHANCELLOR!
According to the local fishwrapper Brian Blessed is running for Chancellor of Cambridge University. -- 20:30, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The font on your heading title is inappropriately too small. AMassiveGay (talk) 22:06, 3 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Now it's juuuust right. XD--Dumpling (talk) 04:35, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I can never remember with Oxbridge. Is a chancellor just a figurehead (in which case, cool!) ? Or do they have real power? I mean, are we talking Lord Mayor of London (some guy who looks good in the robes) or Mayor of London (in practice one of the most powerful politicians in the country) ?
 * It's a titular/figurehead sort of position; the main thing the Chancellor seems to be involved in is conferring honorary degrees. It might help give you an idea if I point out that the current Chancellor is Prince Philip. I think I'll be voting for Brian. alt (talk) 12:54, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Lol, there was a local underground paper in this area decades ago called The Fishwrapper. It had great articles on haggis. 02:30, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

North Korea Best Korea? China Happy? Kidney trade?
http://behindthewall.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/05/31/6754108-are-china-north-korea-happier-than-america Made me laugh.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/yblog_technews/20110602/tc_yblog_technews/17-year-old-sells-his-kidney-for-ipad-2 Made me worried.

--Dumpling (talk) 02:03, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The story about the kid and the ipad made me cry at the library today. No lie. P-Foster (talk) 04:30, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I was in complete shock that it even happened, really. D: It's just...worrisome. --Dumpling (talk) 04:34, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Let's hope he has a job by the time iPad 3 comes out. --85.76.85.231 (talk) 16:32, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Everybody, everybody!
Just wanted to see how many RationalWikians know about or are fans of Homestar Runner.--Lefty (talk) 22:29, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I know about it. I guess I really wouldn't call myself a fan though.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 22:34, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Let me guess: you know about Homestar Runner due to Trogdor.--Lefty (talk) 22:37, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes. A valid reason for self-immolation?--Colonel Sanders (talk) 22:42, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * No, not quite. The Burninator was an average character, but the hype over him caused a good deal of people to watch "dragon" (for the thrash metal song) and quit after that. The best out of all of the Strong Bad emails was "cliffhangers" or "the movies."--Lefty (talk) 22:47, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I've played the "Strongbad's Cool Game for Attractive People" series on the Wii. Highly amusing. Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 23:16, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * YESSSSSSSSSSS. Used to be a huge fan in elementary-middle school stage. Still check up on it for giggles. Never fails. That...and the BadgerBadger and llama song.--Dumpling (talk) 23:55, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Haven't checked it regularly in a loooong time, but even then it was becoming basically All Strongbad All the Time instead of Homestar Runner (not that I have a problem with that). There are so many classic sbemails. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 00:05, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Very much yes. I think it might've been Kick the Can that originally introduced me to H*R. Loved it ever since and hoping that Brothers Chaps are going to end their neverending hiatus someday. At least Regular Show works as a decent replacement at the moment by constantly ripping off H*R. Vulpius (talk) 00:55, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Regular Show isn't half bad........--Lefty (talk) 01:07, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

I'm a pretty big fan, I started watching back when 'Sibbie' was a new Sbemail. You know when people describe a really good BBC show as 'worth the license fee alone'? Homestar Runner was/is the internet equivalent of that for me (along with this fine wiki, of course). I have a clear memory of my jaw dropping when Andrew made the Trogdor reference on Buffy...good times. Started hoarding the DVDs a few months into the hiatus for fear TBC would pull the plug. Oh, and as I'm typing this I just realised I'm wearing my knackered Crazy Go Nuts University t-shirt that I bought a good six or seven years ago, how 'bout that? God I'm tired. Grumblejaws (talk) 21:15, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Casey Anthony
I keep ClusterFOX News on while I go to sleep because it's noise in the background I don't get interested in. Not this time though. I'm following Geroldo get his thong in a bunch over her sexy MySpace pics like it's O.J fucking Simpson. THoughts? 75.23.35.225 (talk) 04:01, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I have no idea what you are talking about, but given a quick google I can deduce from her pictures she is what we call a "bogan" in Australia. Seems like the typical water muddying that is pervasive in both the media and our legal system. None of this is in any way related to whether she is guilty or not. -  <font face=times color=black>π    13:23, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

Homeopathy in the funny pages.
Saturday Morning Breakfast Cereal P-Foster (talk) 16:53, 5 June 2011 (UTC)

WhitePrideTV
WTF?? The Klan have their own TV show? Led by a Pastor? With a youth segment? And the Bible For White People? Hey, isn't that what Andy was trying to write? --OompaLoompa (talk) 11:15, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * They've got a kid reading their propaganda? That's fucking sick. 11:19, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah - but what a great quote:
 * He is proud to be a white Christian boy in America, but he knows that because of his minority status, the odds might be stacked against his people.
 * In one sense of course he's right. The majority of Americans are not white Christian male  children.--BobSpring is sprung! 16:40, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The Youth Focus is fun. Fuck. Why do racists have to be so fucking hot as I'd totally do her white proud ass! Nightwish (talk) 16:52, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Me too. She'd be begging me not to stop. A Song About Buggery (talk) 21:29, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If by "fun" you mean "so badly produced that it's torture to watch" then I agree with you.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:24, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I like the fake bookcase in the background. Sen (talk) 19:46, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Har. It's not even staged, just a poorly done superimposition using a green screen. Doctor Dark (talk) 19:51, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * No, no. Look at 2:30 in the youth focus video for example. Look at that smooth reflections on the top left corner. I believe that what we are dealing with here, is in fact a 2D printout of a library.Sen (talk) 19:58, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Ok scratch that, I just noticed the green screen bleed-through in 5:22 in the bottom right corner. I am confused now. At any rate I believe what we can all agree upon is that, that library is slighty reality impaired. Sen (talk) 20:02, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't discount the possibility of a green screen superimposition of a photo of a 2D printout of a library bookshelf. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 01:22, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I guess that would make it very reality impaired. --Horace (talk) 05:32, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Let me guess.. Shelby Pendergraft is Rachel Pendergraft's daughter? And, I'm guessing Andrew is Andrew Pendergraft too? Maybe the old pastor dude is grandpa or something? Is this ""Internet TV station"" just one family? Probably in their garage? 19:23, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Got it in one. Doctor Dark (talk) 03:00, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Jesus is back!!
Well, according to Alan John Miller Just a little over 2000 years ago, we arrived on the earth for the first time. My name then was Yeshua ben Yosef, or the Jesus of the Bible, the son of Joseph and Mary. Mary's name then was Mary of Magdala, the woman identified in the Bible as Mary Magdalene. Mary was my wife then, and the first person I appeared to after I was crucified.

This is a whole special new kind of crazy. --OompaLoompa (talk) 12:13, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * "Me as I was in the year 2003, age 40, just before I remembered the full details of my life in the 1st century and in the spirit world" [[image:Eyebrow.gif]]  12:42, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The pic on the left looks kind of like Viggo Mortenson's lamer younger brother. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 21:20, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * gee really confused. "we arrived on the earth for the first time. My name then was Yeshua ben Yosef," So that was a bit of luck ? Born of Mary wife of Joseph and your name matched up with the hebrew for son of Joseph ? what are the odds of that ? Didnt I see this in that great ? film Starman ? Where is the beatiful woman in the picture ? Hamster (talk) 00:45, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The pic on the right looks like Liz Lemon's boyfriend, the one who sells pagers. P-Foster (talk) 22:39, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * YAY! Jesus!  And he's here in Australia (in Kingaroy of all places).  Another first for the sunburnt country.  Take that USA!  Where is your Jesus now?  I'll tell you.  He's right here.  HA!  --Horace (talk) 03:34, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My girlfriend: "What is it about Queensland?" Me: "I don't fucking know. Datura in the water or something." - David Gerard (talk) 22:10, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Need an Aussie to weigh in.
Is this really a thing? P-Foster (talk) 05:36, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My dog is a kangatarianist. -  <font face=times color=black>π    09:55, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You'd die of starvation! <font color="blue" face = "Comic Sans MS">RagTop <font color="teal" face = "Comic Sans MS>Gone sailing 12:22, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * How so? -  <font face=times color=black>π    12:24, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Just that it would be difficult for an urban Ozzie to get enough roo to form an entire diet. Slight hyperbole involved. <font color="blue" face = "Comic Sans MS">RagTop <font color="teal" face = "Comic Sans MS>Gone sailing 23:00, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I have never heard of it but it could be done. Where I live (Melbourne) if one shopped at the Victoria Market one could easily obtain enough kangaroo to live on.  And it is excellent.  Generally very lean and tender meat.  --Horace (talk) 02:17, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Here in Melbourne, I find most major supermarkets (Coles, Woolworths/Safeway) sell kangaroo. Quite a few restaurants serve it too (most don't, but it's still a quite common thing to see on restaurant menus). I quite like it actually, but don't eat it that much since my girlfriend isn't a big fan. Australia makes heaps of kangaroo, but far more supply of kangaroo meat than demand for human consumption, so most of it goes to pet food. And, it really is better for the environment (at least here in Australia), having kangaroos rather than sheep or cattle. Not just greenhouse emissions; kangaroos cause less damage to grasslands while grazing, hence less erosion, etc. So, wouldn't be hard to be kangatarian (at least in many parts of Australia), and I can see the environmental benefits of doing so... Whenever I go to the US, I tell the Americans I meet that I eat kangaroo, I get some rather odd looks ("you mean you eat your national symbols?? Like if we ate the American bald eagle??") 19:17, 6 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Is the roo any better now? I remember ten years ago it was hard to find people who knew how to cook it so it wasn't like chewing on a boot - David Gerard (talk) 22:07, 6 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Oh. My. God. Maratrean also lives in Melbourne... and has a girlfriend.  --Horace (talk) 22:30, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * David, the secret is to marinade it well, and not overcook it. 09:44, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What, the girlfriend? Ajkgordon (talk) 11:38, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Concur with Horace and Maratrean. I live in Melbourne also. In fact, I live in the 'burbs and my local Safeway (supermarket) chain carries roo meat. It's very good and not particularly expensive. Don't know I'd want to live ENTIRELY on it, but I'd say the same for beef. You can make good curries with it, good satay, good burgers. It's a good meat. Having said all that, there is a measure of tongue-in-cheek in the WIkipedia entry. Pesco-kangatarianism? Haha.Anaglyph (talk) 09:56, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

First man "functionally cured" of AIDS
It's a little dated, but still..... 18:25, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * And they said stem cells would never lead to anything. Comments section sucks as usual. ТyUser_talk:Ty 02:52, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * As far as I can make out, 90% of the comments are people bitching about the typo in the guys quote, 9% are from xians either thanking god for a cure or being derogatory about people who have HIV, and 1% from people stating this is great medical breakthrough. Slightly worrying. <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 13:20, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Why do people bitch so much about typos? You could come up with some amazing truth or solution to some age old problem and folk would just ignore it because of a typo. Does an inability to proof read effectively make you a bad person? AMassiveGay (talk) 13:38, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I would have hyphenated both "age-old" and "proof-read" so I am go9ing to ignoore yor pint.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:34, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * As a rule I stay away from all comments sections I find on YouTube videos, news articles, Facebook pages, RationalWiki HCM's etc., as it makes you realise that a significant proportion of internet users, and by extension the world, is mentally handicapped. 15:48, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * (ಠ㉨ರೃ) Wise decision. --Dumpling (talk) 15:58, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * @Supergosh: your a moran!!!! their are lodes of grate pages on an internet your missin, they're was sum I sore the other day that we're awesum!!!!1 <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 08:17, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * South Park did it: http://www.southparkstudios.com/clips/164373/they-found-a-cure-for-aids Markedc (talk) 16:19, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Palin, Paul Revere, and Wikipedia
It was only a matter of time. P-Foster (talk) 23:47, 5 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's a well known fact of American History that the British love bells. 02:28, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It could be great sport, goading Sarah Palin to disgorge her version of the great events of history and then writing a book with the result. -- 02:36, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't know how it fits into the timeline, since I'm in Korea and I get my news at weird times, but this morning I saw Palin on Fox News explaining her gaffe and she messed it up AGAIN while admitting she was wrong the first time. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 03:00, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * OI. ‎(ಠ㉨ರೃ) Palin. ---And Yay. Korea. --Dumpling (talk) 13:57, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The comment thread on this BJ post is full of win. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 16:53, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

The lamestream media needs to wise up to Poe's Law. Scanning through through WP:talk:Paul Revere and some of the edits to the page, I can't see much to indicate that genuine Palinites are behind the edit war. Looks more like a few parodists putting her version in for lulz, & some anti-Palin types trying to put content in the Paul Revere article highlighting how stupid she is. 20:10, 6 June 2011 (UTC)


 * The press story is already claiming the article had to be protected because of it, though we're bludgeoning them with the fact that this claim is provably false. God save us from "reliable sources" - David Gerard (talk) 22:06, 6 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Oh, Palin. Will you ever stop being so disingenuously entertaining? Also, TFA: Where are you stationed? I'm down in Yongsan Garrison now, pushing stories for the Morning Calm. They stick you up in Casey or are you in one of the comfy zones? - CodyH (talk) 08:59, 7 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I'm in the senior enlisted barracks at Camp Humphreys. I'm assigned to the 411th CSB, but I am on Team Pyongtaek so Humphreys is home. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 14:23, 7 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Ah, awesome. I've heard Humphreys is pretty cool. If you come up to Seoul sometime give me a ring, first round on me. - CodyH (talk) 23:28, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

"Gadgets for bureaucrats"
I noticed this one while turning hotcat back on. Can someone with the appropriate rights remove the obsolete section? 08:33, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Raging Asshole of the Week: Andrew Klavan edition
Apparently Big Boy Jammies has picked up some new jackass named Andrew Klavan and his douchebaggery levels are already off the charts. First we get his plan for the Middle East: Israeli empire! Fuck the ragheads! And if you don't agree, you're just a leftist anti-Semite. Henry Kissinger? Never mind him, just another self-hating Jew. Now we get his "deep" thoughts on Weiner-gate: It's da wimmen's fault 'cause they make us treat them like shit! This is the kind of butthurt you see on pick-up artist sites (indeed, the PUAs come out of the woodwork in the comments section). Could be fodder for a snarticle, but I don't know if I can stomach any more of his bullshit. Edit: Ah, I see he's the Dark Knight guy. I guess they dropped him and then picked him up again. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 19:32, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Moderators
Just bumping this Forum:Moderators in a more promient place. Tmtoulouse (talk) 06:05, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

If you were a crank...
...what kind of crank would you be? I would definitely be a conspiracy nut. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 02:40, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I feel like they have the most fun. I would probably specialize in aliens. 03:33, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I kinda do still like aliens. Does that make me a bad RWian?? Ancient Greek Pegasus icon.png 10:35, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Who has the most fun -- conspiracy nuts or cranks in general? Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 03:37, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I would have to agree with MordantMaenad. But, I would say cranks in general have the most fun. I wonder what kind of crank I would be. Probably one of the paranoid ones that mumble about.--Dumpling (talk) 03:40, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Larouche guy. No doubt. P-Foster (talk) 04:30, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I would go the Glenn Beck route. Make up alternative histories, misrepresenting documents, et cetra. The money is good with the wingnut crowd--Thanatos (talk) 04:32, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I always wanted to be a conspiracy theorist too, but I find myself stymied by the dark forces afoot within the movement. Röstigraben (talk) 04:40, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I've long been partial to the pseudoscientific side of crankdom, like chemtrails. I probably know enough science to spoof these folks and even make a few drachmas along the way, but am handicapped by a sense of ethics. Doctor Dark (talk) 05:12, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If I were a crank, I'd most likely be a Young Earth Creationist, because anyone this unconcerned with proven facts is always a good time. 06:24, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'd be a communist hippy and go on about how corporations and Big Brother are trying to keep everyone down, because in no other type of wingnut conspiracy do you get chicks that even compare to hippy chicks. 10:40, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * New World Order - there's just so many things you can tack on to that - Illuminati, shape-changing aliens, underground bases, thought control. Why get stuck with just one crazy theory? --OompaLoompa (talk) 10:46, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Something about the supernatural, especially relating to death/ghosts/spirits - ouija boards, seances, past life regression. All that shit.  12:31, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * QUANTUM. quantum. Quantum. cwantoomm. Q u a n t u m. quantum. - Get the idea? Anyhow, what do you mean: "if"? Pippa (talk) 13:53, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Something in alt med. It's where the money is.--BobSpring is sprung! 14:12, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'd probably go down the same road as superjosh. There's a feeling of righteousness that you get by fighting "the man" that you don't get by fighting, say, the scientific community. X Stickman (talk) 15:15, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

I mean a legit crank, not just a huckster. Alt med woo would probably be tops for just making a buck. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 16:05, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * "I'd be a communist hippy and go on about how corporations and Big Brother are trying to keep everyone down." That's not being a crank. That's what's happening. That said, Josh is right about one thing: the hippy chicks rock. P-Foster (talk) 17:08, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The conspiracy theorist thing sounds a little fun in a way, but being in a constant state of fear and paranoia does not sound like an enjoyable way to live life. TrickyDickTurpis (talk) 17:31, 4 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It works for me. Doctor Dark (talk) 17:33, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

I'd be a 9-11 Truther, and a quantum spiritualist physics promoter. 02:29, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * But firmly opposed to audio woo! - David Gerard (talk) 22:12, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Lol, damn no, I forgot ...5 PROFIT! 08:07, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

I'd be Christopher Hitchens. 20:25, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Any one have any miracle cures for tonsilitis?
Honestly, my tonsils are fucking massive. And covered in some unpleasant gunk. AMassiveGay (talk) 13:40, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Depends if it's viral or bacterial. Removing them is the best cure, but it seems that particular operation is scarce now. <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 14:06, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Crundy has a point. Although, when I had it when I was younger, mum made me take Tylenol/Advil, gargle salt water twice a day, and drink lots of water. But, other than that---probably see a physician. Good Luck.--Dumpling (talk) 14:10, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Have you tried prayer? TrickyDickTurpis (talk) 14:15, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Get them removed. king of the rats do you wanna kick it in the backseat? 15:50, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * "Best cure" is true only if you'd also prefer to cure a broken leg by removing the leg. A Tonsilectomy, like C-section is major surgery. If it goes wrong (and sometimes it will go wrong, surgical teams are human) you may die. That doesn't mean we should never do it, like a C-section it may be the best option for some people, even for "mere" tonsilitis. But the past practice of "it's your tonsils, let's whip those out" was unwise. See a physician, or if you can't afford a physician and you live in a country which has something resembling democracy, remember to demand universal healthcare from the next politician you meet. 82.69.171.94 (talk) 16:19, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Fortunately, I have the NHS for all my healthcare needs, I just don't wanna bother them with something that will go away on its own. The temperature I had for few days broke yesterday so that must be good sign. And now I am convinced (read: hope) that the pain I get when swallowing is starting to ease. They are still big and yucky though. AMassiveGay (talk) 17:03, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Did you try something homeopathic? I'd suggest Dr. Shah's save tonsils treatment. 18:29, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'd rather something that might actually work. AMassiveGay (talk) 18:40, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Hey, you asked for a miracle cure, and this one says "miracle cure" all over it. 18:43, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Damn you and your logic. AMassiveGay (talk) 18:50, 6 June 2011 (UTC)

Hmm... well, depends on whether it is bacterial or viral... but I've heard of this amazing miracle cure called "antibiotics". Look that one up. A friend of mine, she had a tennis ball-sized bump on the side of her face, looked really weird, she was too embarassed to leave the house... a couple of days of IV antibiotics in hospital, and her tennis ball miraculously shrunk to a fraction of its former size. A few weeks post-discharge on oral antibiotics, and her tennis ball was miraculouly cured, no sign it had ever been there. Praise antibiotics! (Although, if she hadn't have been unemployed and without health insurance, she could have got her dental problems fixed, and would never have been to hospital in the first place... bring on socialized dentistry...) 19:31, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'd advise you to have no truck with these newfangled so-called "antibiotics". What do "doctors" know?  I'd say that urine therapy or perhaps colour therapy is the way to go.--BobSpring is sprung! 19:49, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Honey, lemon and cayenne pepper dissolved in hot/boiling water for the pain. Honey has some antibiotic properties (although no substitute for a course from your Doctor, and most surgeries will allow you to phone them and ask if the Doctor can call you back after morning surgery, it saves them a lot of time on housecalls), the lemon likewise (acidity), and the cayenne pepper works wonders to soothe the pain.  The trick with the cayenne though is to add as much as you can stand.-- 11:48, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

You young'uns.... I'm from a generation where a tonsillectomy was nearly a rite of passage. When I was in kindergarten, it was almost "who is getting their tonsils out this week?"

It changed shortly thereafter, though. My brother (three years younger than me) and sister (almost six years) never had their tonsils out. MDB (talk) 15:21, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Turns out taking paracetamol/ibuprofen for pain, smoking and doing fuck all else works just fine. I don't need no stinking Doctors. AMassiveGay (talk) 11:42, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Waves
Hello again Rat-Wiki. Take a look at WHOIS on this IP, it holds significance. I llove public WiFi. 208.62.154.8 (talk) 20:23, 6 June 2011 (UTC)


 * BellSouth.net Inc. BELLSNET-BLK7 (NET-208-60-0-0-1) 208.60.0.0 - 208.63.255.255
 * Winn-Dixie Stores, Inc. #2 - JAX BLS-208-62-154-0-24-1004230343 (NET-208-62-154-0-1) 208.62.154.0 - 208.62.154.255
 * Um ... OK? - David Gerard (talk) 22:04, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I give up. How is this IP significant? 22:05, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * He lives in Florida? I dunno. ТyUser_talk:Ty 22:38, 6 June 2011 (UTC)


 * Certainly you all know where your own slogans "getting vandals all the time" and "America's Super(vandal)target" come from? Also, the book "Because of Rat-Wiki"? BTW, I'm in Georgia, not Florida.
 * Uh, no. Can't say that I've heard either of those. ТyUser_talk:Ty 02:12, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Damin it I was trying to start another meme, doesn't look like I've been trying hard enough.
 * I did this from a Bob Evans restaurant in Tally.
 * The vandalism is a rewrite of Winn-Dixie slogans Getting Better All The Time and America's Supermarket, I also did some vandalism using Publix slogan Where Vandalizing Shopping Is A Pleasure. Next in line is Wal-Mart's slogan. 209.188.95.228 (talk) 02:25, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That sounds just peachy.  21:15, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Cabal
Why do people believe in secret Cabals? <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 08:40, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm gonna create a Cabal that really is secretly controlling the world. AMassiveGay (talk) 09:20, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You're gay. I thought "our people" secretly did run the world. Or is that just the entertainment industry? MDB (talk) 10:29, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, obviously the gay mafia thing is too well known. I am talking about a new super secret cabal. You won't need to be gay, but the super secret handshake will involve taking it up the wrong un. AMassiveGay (talk) 11:17, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Well, if it's a jewish cabal, its from a total lack of understanding history where jews never could have been in a position of super power. if its anybody else, paranoia--Mikalos209 (talk) 13:28, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I wish some one would ask me to join a cabal, I am misanthropic and I work hard.  ~ Subsound ~ 13:45, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If you don't mind the bum sex, I'll sign you up. Can never have enough minions. AMassiveGay (talk) 16:25, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * There is no cabal. And bum sex is neither exclusive to your club or necessary for joining it, MassiveGay. P-Foster (talk) 21:08, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * How do you know, i only created my new super secret cabal this morning and it is super secret. Already we control the worlds markets through our bum sex based secret handshake. AMassiveGay (talk) 22:16, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Pay no attention to the Jewish cabal behind the curtain. I am definitely not in your fractional-reserve banking stealing your moneys, nor am I in your Zionist media propagandizing the youth. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 22:54, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Edit warfare
Can anyone do anything about edit waring between Human and Nx? Just take a peek at the Fossil record for Aristotle. Incidentally I feel Human's addition is funny and should stay. Kirk Johnson (talk) 15:06, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It might be funny, but it's also childish and wrong. "Wind" was not one of his elements, "Air" was - and there is a difference. If you want to factually incorrect over a joke, mainspace isn't the place to do it. --OompaLoompa (talk) 15:12, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I've created Fun:Aristotle but it needs a few more jokes to build it up. Can any Rationalwikian think of any? Kirk Johnson (talk) 15:29, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That article is much better now. Kirk Johnson (talk) 16:46, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * do we have any moderators yet?-- 16:47, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Nominations start in a week. So no. ТyUser_talk:Ty 18:34, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

RationalWiki Board of Trustees: Announcement
As the chairman of the RationalWiki Foundation's Board of Trustees, it pleases me to announce to that, per our [http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:RationalWiki_Foundation/By_laws#Section_4..09Vacancies. bylaws], the Foundation has selected ListenerX to fill the vacancy left by Armondikov's resignation. 19:57, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * aghhhhhh pah-toooooooooooooooye akh ghrrrrrrrrrrrrrr@@@@@@@@@ --87.5.101.196 (talk) 20:16, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh, cool. Congratulations, Listener!-- 20:41, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Congrats. When does the white terror begin? AMassiveGay (talk) 21:04, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Comrades, I think it's time to begin planning the october revolution. -- 04:02, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Da zdravstvuyet sozdannyiy volyey narodov! Yedinyiy, moguchiy Sovyetskiy Soyuz!  --Thecomrade

WeinerGate
Apparently Rep. Weiner has admitted to sending the photo...anybody else really fucking disappointed? Moralizing aside, I'm just surprised that he did something so blatantly stupid. Frankly, I expected better from him. Saladin 22:00, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I hadn't heard of Rep. Weiner until this, so I had no stake in the matter and no expectations. All this is is further evidence that there are as many sleazebag Democrats as Republicans. This comes as a huge shock to nobody. TrickyDickTurpis (talk) 23:00, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You'd think that someone born with the unfortunate name Weiner would know better than anyone never to take a photo of their dick. -- 23:23, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I know, right?? Point well taken about the homogeneity of sleaze in politics, and I know I'm naive for expecting otherwise, but even for a Republican sending a picture of your dick publicly to a college student is just sub-Palin stupid. Oh well, countdown to the next Washington scandal starts now! My money's on Romney  Saladin 23:37, 6 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I thought Weiner was a cool dude after his epic rant on the House floor after the ultra-shamful/shameless filibuster of the 9/11 responders' bill. This was a massive dumbass move, but honestly, I don't give a shit about sex scandals (much less a photo on twitter) unless you're covering it up using public money a la John Edwards or a member of the "family values" brigade (for the delicious irony). Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 00:11, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My first real RW post :). Yea I have a lot of respect for Weiner and am slightly disappointed, but he is still one of the few democrats that is not an invertebrate. Markedc (talk) 16:10, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Politicians are lyin', stealin, horny crooks. Ask Clinton, Santorum, Edwards, Nixon (although he claimed he wasn't a crook) whoever else. They don't care about the country they serve, Demoncrat or Repulsivecan--Colonel Sanders (talk) 16:20, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

Can one of our non-American members comment?
I've heard it said that most of the rest of the western-style democracies really don't care about politician's sex lives, unless they get really outrageous (for instance "a Conservative Member Parliament today was caught in flagrante delicto with three underage prostitutes, a John Deere lawn tractor, and an aardvark.") In fact, I've even heard some countries expect their leaders to have mistresses, and wonder "what's wrong?" when they don't. True? MDB (talk) 16:48, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I think you forgot. The American lamestream media goes in frenzy over their leaders' sex lives, especially Republicans since they're supposed to be moral Jeebus-loving people. Sure most other western-style democracies don't care, but this is America we're talking about. Don't you know that is all most Americans think about. That and greasy burgers.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 16:52, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * As a Canuck living in US-America, I don't get this fixation: I mean, if there was some sort of link between the sex and political ethics (abusing power to get sex, giving special political considerations to sexual partners, etc...) that's worth talking about. Cheating on your wife or sexting with another consenting adult? Nobody's business. P-Foster (talk) 16:59, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * While I don't really buy this argument, the one at all reasonable thing I've heard is that it shows a lack of judgment, and "good judgment" is something we should want in our elected officials.
 * The counter-argument, though, is easy -- a lack of judgment in one aspect of your life does not mean poor judgment in other areas. The fact I've done some pretty stupid things in my personal life does not mean I'm unqualified to by a software engineer, for instance. MDB (talk) 17:39, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * A UK perspective: the British media (especially the tabloid end of it, & tv news) is obsessed with the sex lives of celebrities, including politicians, but the fascination is usually more voyeuristic than moralistic - just a fascination with scandal & drama for its own sake. When politicians' indiscretions are publicised, it does harm their credibility to some extent, but it's more to do with them becoming figures of ridicule & the butt of lots of obvious jokes rather than losing support on moral grounds.  Ultimately I don't think the average voter is heavily influenced by what politicians get up to in the bedroom.   17:55, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * But you Brits actually had a sex scandal that may have been a national security matter. I'd think you all would be even more sensitive about it. MDB (talk) 18:02, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * In Spain a politician's sex life is considered to be a total irrelevance by most people. They are surprised by the Anglo-Saxon obsession with such things. My understanding that it is the same in France where politicians have various mistresses and lovers.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:05, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Then, of course, there is Italy.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:19, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Something like Weiner did would not count as outrageous in Finland, unless there was a sexual harassment aspect to it (is there?). It would get widely publicized for sure, politicians are public figures and privacy laws don't protect them. A few years back a minister of finance had to resign because he had sent hundreds of text messages to a stripper from his _work_ phone, but there have been elections and he is still an MP. I believe it's similar in the other Nordic countries. --85.78.194.49 (talk) 18:40, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Watching the news here in France tonight, they simply can't understand what the fuss is about with M Strauss-Khan's indiscretion. Sure, if it turns out it was rape or sexual assault, then he'll be crucified by the French media as is right and proper... (as long as they think it's been a fair trial, etc.)
 * What they can't stomach is the moralising trial by the mob (media) with him being lead away in handcuffs in front of the press and all that malarkey. Innocent until proven guilty? Yeah, right. Wild West justice, more like.
 * As an aside, I can't quite make out why CP isn't making more hay with this one. Filthy foreigner? Check. (French = bonus points.) Socialist? Check. Millionaire socialist? Double check. Head of international type thingy that's probably anti-American and against some part of the Holy Constitution? Check. Kind of Jewish but sufficiently secular for it not to appear we are anti-Semetic? Check. Probable atheist? Check. Elitist? Check. Voted against the invasion of Iraq? Check.
 * I would have thought Aschlafly and Obergruppenfürher Jpatt would have been all over the story like a rash. Ajkgordon (talk) 19:31, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Chris Bryant lib dem MP, got some press over a similar to incident to the one Weiner got caught up in. He had posted pics of himself in his pants on Gaydar. He's still around. AMassiveGay (talk) 23:19, 7 June 2011 (UTC)

I have it on very good authority (a mate who works within the political news section of a major NZ newspaper) that there is a lot of hanky panky that goes on with our politicians that is known about by journalists but is not reported on. I think we are starting to see some cracks in this code of silence lately, but it is no where near the level of the US. DamoHi 02:49, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It used to be that way in the US (just think of JFK...), but it changed. Who knows why.  04:21, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * @MDB re Profumo Affair. As I remember it - I was pretty young at the time - the fuss was not that he enjoyed kinky sex with prostitutes - that was a given - it was that he was sharing these prostitutes with a Russian spy and, worst of all, lying about it in Parliament (Shock horror!). It was the lying that brought the government down, not the sex.
 * More recently as the Tories imploded in the mid nineties it wasn't the endless sex scandles that pissed off the voters, it was Cash For Questions. I mean, apart from the Hamiltons - and there was no sex scandle there, Christine has Neil's balls in a jar on her bedside table - can you remember one of the miscreants? Jack Hughes (talk) 10:38, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I seem to remember some 'back to basics' MPs' resignations over sex scandals, but I think that was more to do with the hypocrisy of the moral agenda of the whole back to basics things. Tim Yeo went for sure, as did Piers Merchant. I seem to remember some chap cheating his wife in a chelsea strip, but I can't remember his name. AMassiveGay (talk) 11:39, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Speaking personally, the revelations about John Major and Edwina Currie soured any enjoyment I could possibly derive from political sex scandals. You don't even want to think about those two getting it on. All things considered though, if it had been revealed he was getting extramarital nookie while he was still in office, it probably would have boosted his popularity. -- 13:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Andrew Breitbart keeps a picture of Anthony Weiner's cock on his cellphone
srsly-- 02:39, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Is there any whiff of entrapment here?
Just curious... Whether or not a sting was afoot, the sexting was colossally dim, and a massive dick move, considering he is still practically a newlywed.

I have yet to meet a politician who suffers from a shortage of hubris, or see one mentioned in the media with any such deficit. Some wymmin may even find this attractive; consider Ms. Lewinski admitting to the press that she flashed her panties at Slick Willie "to show that she was available." Any reliable reading on how much encouragement he got from the object of his affection.? 66.189.117.133 (talk) 17:39, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Hamster needs to Vent -
My Dad died this morning after a day in Hospital. He was 83.
 * He suffered a form of Dementia (lower cortex) and was losing recent memory. On Sunday afternoon he was confused, so we took him to the ER where they diagnosed a stroke of the bleeding sort. He was transferred to another Hospital for care the local hospital wasn't able to provide. We were advised to prepare for his death. At the other hospital we were told he had been examined and a fair recovery was possible.
 * Monday morning we were told the bleed had become worse, and if he survived he would have some motor function but virtually no cognitive ability because of the area of the brain involved. ( He would not recognise us, he could not read or watch television and follow the story or have any meaningful hobbies) We were going to see him today and talk about nursing home care. At 2 am today we got a call saying his heart had stopped , his pacemaker was keepong it going but he was not expected to survive. By the time we arrived an hour later (60 mile trip) he had died.
 * Hamster finds this sucks, but may have been the better outcome  :(
 * Hamster has finished venting, thanks Hamster (talk) 11:41, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My deepest condolences to you and your family. Not as good thing, but as you say, maybe better in the long run. And 83 is a good innings too. --OompaLoompa (talk) 11:53, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My thoughts are with you buddy. Very sorry for your loss. 12:27, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That one's a toughie. It doesn't matter how much it was a merciful release or he had a good innings - it hits you hard and for longer than you think. I know it's normal, part of the circle of life and all that but the person who has been part and parcel of you life is suddenly no more. That hurts. My thoughts are with you. Jack Hughes (talk) 13:15, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Sad for you. I&#39;m not Jesus (talk) 13:17, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My condolances to you and your family. I went through a similar situation with my grandmother a few years back.  She had been suffering with a degenerative bone disease that affected her neck, primarily, and was unable to lift her head at all.  She developed dementia almost overnight, and lost the ability to function normally after only two weeks.  Her death was very sudden, and it took us by surprise.   13:33, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I am so sorry for your loss. ~ Subsound ~ 14:54, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry to hear about your loss. --Dumpling (talk) 14:57, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My deepest sympathies, to you and yours. MDB (talk) 15:12, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My condolences to you and your family. Take comfort in the memories of the times you had with him. I lost my mother a few years ago from complications of what was supposed to be routine minor surgery and still think of her every day. Doctor Dark (talk) 16:17, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm really sorry for your loss. "Bon courage,: as we say in French. P-Foster (talk) 16:56, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm also sorry for your loss, Hamster. --Phil Leotardo da Vinci (talk) 18:02, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry to hear that. It's a tough experience.--BobSpring is sprung! 18:17, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Best wishes to you and your family. Ajkgordon (talk) 19:16, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * We can only go on with them in our memories, but that impression lasts longer than any mortal shell. Condolences for your loss. - CodyH (talk) 23:43, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * thanks for the comments. A small comfort is that he was slipping away with the dementia, and he knew it, so at least this was a quick and fairly clean end. regards all. Hamster (talk) 03:06, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It isn't easy. Seeing how losing people like Susan have left me feeling, losing a close relative must be 10^3 times harder.  All I can suggest is to talk to others who were close... share... I dunno...  04:17, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

My condolences, Hamster. 09:46, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry to hear it. One of my grandfathers went in a similar fashion with early onset Alzheimer's Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 15:51, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Not one of us will leave this world alive. My dad went in a similar fashion at a similar age a number of years ago, still in this century. I remember a visit to the hospital's memory-loss unit when he said what amounted to, "How come I have to stay here? These other guys are all out of it."
 * Still he is well remembered, and I hope yours is too. Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 17:48, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

What do we do with churches once the Christians have moved out?
In the UK, I think we're really heading towards a tipping point in the next 20 to 30 years. As the rapidly ageing pool of regular church goers dies off, the church is going to have increasing trouble with paying for the maintenance of its many fine old churches, especially in rural parishes. While it probably isn't too much of a loss to bulldoze the occasional post-war methodist meeting hall, it'd be a shame to get rid of so many 150+ year old parish churches. The problem is that they're awkward spaces not really good for much other than worshipping invisible sky daddies.

What exactly are we going to do with the churches once their aren't any Christians in residence? -- 03:35, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

In New England some old churches have been rehabed as housing, especially when the architecture is interesting enough to preserve. Thorvelden (talk) June 7, 2011
 * Any church worth its salt should have decent acoustics. Turn them into nightclubs.  04:07, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I think the atmosphere would be great for a BDSM dungeon. That or make'em into poorhouses.--  04:12, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Plenty of churches in the Uk have been turned into homes. As for nightclubs, Mass in Brixton is in a converted church. I think also that one of the Walkabout resturant/bars in London in church (on charing cross road, I think)AMassiveGay (talk) 04:15, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I used to live near a church/hookah bar. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 04:18, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * here is the walkaboutAMassiveGay (talk) 04:19, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Museums? libraries? other public uses that don't insult the fact they WERE a place of worship at one point. --Mikalos209 (talk) 04:21, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * They have usually been deconsecrated. You could turn them into a brothel after that and it wouldn't be insulting. AMassiveGay (talk) 04:23, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm a non denominational so i dont see them as holy or anything, but unless its a "looks like a normal building" church, its rather insulting to use it for anything amoral. --Mikalos209 (talk) 04:26, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * They are just bricks and mortar. Only usage makes a church a church. And the blessing to consecrate them. If they are not being used for worship, then they are not churches, no matter how ornate. Remove the consecration and there is nothing sacred remaining. Just bricks and mortar. AMassiveGay (talk) 04:33, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Personally, if the CoE (one the largest landowners in the UK) has any kind of humanitarian bent, they should turn their unneeded property into affordable housing. AMassiveGay (talk) 04:35, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * {ec}Doesn't mean there isn't meaning, though. The thought of a church, deconsecrated or not, being used for something "immoral" would seriously upset some people. It's a question of politeness, I suppose.  --  04:37, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * ^Exactly what i meant--Mikalos209 (talk) 04:40, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Who would be upset? the people who didn't go the church in the first place causing it fall into disuse? If folk where that concerned these buildings would still be churches. AMassiveGay (talk) 04:47, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm not a muslim and i consider their faith to be a false religion, but i'd still find it to be in INCREDIBLE poor taste to turn a mosque into a strip joint. --Mikalos209 (talk) 04:51, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * There's a famous Mosque in Spain that was turned into a Christian church after the reconquest. I'll bet that pisses them off even more!--BobSpring is sprung! 05:00, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm not sure how things work with mosques, but a disused, deconsecrated church is no longer a church. It is building that was once used as a church. The meaning Brx mentions is given by people going to the church. They no longer go so there is no meaning. You would not be turning a church in a strip club but a church shaped building into a strip club. If people don't want their churches used for things they don't like, don't abandon them. AMassiveGay (talk) 04:59, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * so a nice catholic, shaped like a cross and built pretty much for one purpose, sould at all not look completly wrong as anything anti-christian? and the muslims did their fair share of church into mosque--Mikalos209 (talk) 05:05, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If they don't want the building, why should they dictate who it is used? AMassiveGay (talk) 05:10, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Logically the new owner can do what they like as long as it's legal. They can hold a black mass if they like.--BobSpring is sprung! 06:55, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's not a question of legality. It's a matter of being considerate.  Legally, here in the states, I can unleash a vomitous hail of profanity, but I wouldn't, because it's not very nice.--  07:05, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * There are plenty of old church buildings converted into pubs, clubs, restaurants, hotels, galleries, etc. in a few places around the UK & other relatively secular countries like the Netherlands.  07:12, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * An old church in Norwich was converted to a hands-on science learning centre for kids. One round the corner was leased to a guy I knew who is an artist and used it as his workshop and for exhibitions. <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 08:22, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I've read the Church of England's official guidelines on disposing of old churches. They say they will consider the proposed use of the purchaser, and suggest they will refuse to sell if they disagree with it. If you want to open a library or community centre, I think they'd have no problem; a brothel, they would probably say no. A vendor usually has the legal right to pick and choose buyers as they wish. They also suggest they are interested in imposing restrictions on future use (of the purchaser and future buyers), but it's not clear (from a real estate law perspective) how easy it would be for them to do so, so I'm not sure if this is something which happens in practice, as opposed to just an aspiration. 20:31, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Covenants are the mechanism for a vendor to put restrictions on future use/sale of real property (ie land). The Church of England has experience with covenants having sold huge tracts of lands around the country for residential use in antiquity, many of which have annoying covenants. The main problem in the past was that the paperwork would get lost (hence covenant insurance, which pays out if paperwork is found which ends up costing you money). Covenants are magic because you agree to them without any consideration (a normal contract requires that both parties get some benefit, called "consideration"). But courts increasingly frown on covenants that don't serve an obvious purpose. "This is a shared driveway, don't build on it" is a perfectly good covenant but "It would be too embarrassing if you made this cathedral into a nightclub" not so much. 82.69.171.94 (talk) 09:38, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Large numbers, maybe even the majority of church buildings in my city are no longer used by Christians. Immigration (it's a port city, so it had waves of immigration long before the jet airplane) means that parts of the city see demographic changes that make a Christian worship place useless. Because of their inherent suitability for large group meetings, they're often taken over by a new religion, or by a non-religious cultural organisation. Modern Christian sects in the city have grasped that saving up to buy land and build an ostentatious building is futile in the face of such changes. So they rent hotel meeting rooms or school halls for a few hours a week. Many of the church buildings that are still used by Christians are in very poor state of repair, they're expensive to maintain and the churches are not as rich as they once were. So I guess the answer to the question is "they will fall down or be re-used, it's not a big deal". 82.69.171.94 (talk) 08:53, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * @brxbrx Ha, as AMG says, Mass in Brixton is a converted church and they do indeed host a BDSM club there. The building itself doesn't really look like much of a dungeon from the inside though because they drape all the stone walls in black cloth. ONE / TALK 09:10, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * There are two old churches in Pittsburgh that are now concert venues. And I've seen The Misfits in both of them.   10:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)

Just to play not-the-Devil's advocate, the church I was raised in, and which my parents still (inexplicably) attend, is growing and had a large building project a few years ago. It's technically a United Methodist Church, but they bloomin' hide the denominational affiliation and it's pretty much an evangelical church now. I've told my parents I will not attend services when I visit them (Basically, the only services I plan to attend there are funerals of loved ones.) The last time I attended Sunday services there, I considered walking out, I was so unhappy with what it turned into.

My brother-in-law (who was also raised Methodist) and I have considered sneaking in a bag of rubber snakes, though... MDB (talk) 10:51, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You should get yourself one of those fake coral snakes that mimic the insanely deadly ones, but are actually harmless. Once you've done handling them, suggest that everyone else in the church one up you by drinking deadly poisons. -- 12:39, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * One of the most popular bars in Nottingham is a deconsecrated church. It's a spectacular building, so it's good that the place is still in use and being well maintained. I bet it gets more people in it on a weekend as a bar than it did as a church. Bondurant (talk) 10:09, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Free adwords fun
So google is proomitng their adwords thing by offering $100 in free advertising. I think it might be fun to make a list of word we would want to use that money for, then do a vote on them. Tmtoulouse (talk) 06:07, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * buttsecks?-- 06:14, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That might work if this was ED, bricks. Tumbleweeds, Vaccine, Young Earth, and Woo?  08:15, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Have you got the code for the free $100 credit? <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 08:23, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I hope you understand, human, that I was joking. I am not seriously considering buttsecks.  This works on several levels.--  13:24, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Maybe some words that would pop up for a person trying to do a CP related search? That or Santorum ^_^ Markedc (talk) 15:24, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Help for Heroes
I think it's deplorable that the UK government doesn't provide more support to troops injured in or suffer trauma from combat. And I sort of feel that the above charity, by taking up some of the slack, is actually helping to justify the government's apparent apathy. So I refuse to give to this charity because I would rather see it be paid by the government through taxes levied on everyone. Is this rational? ONE / TALK 13:05, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * rational, yes. moral?  maybe.  By refusing to participate in this flawed system you are not validating it.  However, by refusing to participate you are standing by while others suffer. I should note, though, that if this charity gets enough coverage, that it may galvanize the government to act.--  13:28, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * refusing to support a charity sounds good in theory, and would be the way to go if it got the government to act. If it doesnt then its hurting the very people you want to support. Is there a way to highlight the situation, perhaps push the news media into a feature ? Any government I believe has an obligation to its troops to supply a good quality of medical care and rehabilitation to return them to civilian life as able as is reasonable. (by that I mean good quality prosthetics rather than state of art bionic) In some cases I can imagine a disability pension where restoring function is not practicable. Hamster (talk) 13:48, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * completely rational. Charity as a whole often works to relieve states of their obligations to their most vulnerable citizens, whether it's British veterans or starving people in Ethiopia. Alex de Waal has some fascinating critiques of charitable NGOs in a book called Famine Crimes that get to the point about these links: a lot of that critique riffs off of Amartya Sen's ideas about contracts between citizens and the state. P-Foster (talk) 14:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * No, I don't think it's rational.
 * While there is a strong argument that the state doesn't do enough to support wounded troops, withdrawing your charitable donations hurts the victims themselves.
 * Besides, charitable causes in the UK are part of the fabric of our society. One could argue that almost all the large charities are taking up the slack created by insufficient public funding - RNLI, Cancer Research, Age UK, National Trust, NSPCC, etc. But if a political party made a promise to abolish those charities and take on the funding and service itself, it would be laughed out of the election. And while the old argument of charities relieving the state of their obligations is certainly a valid one, it does somewhat miss the point of charities.
 * That doesn't excuse the government's failure. But it does show that the relationship between the state, the public, the charities, and their beneficiaries is a complex one. Refusing to donate because you disagree with the government's policy is simplistic at best and hurts the victims at worst. Ajkgordon (talk) 16:17, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * And it's not necessarily failure. There are a lot of possible priorities. A government has some central responsibilities which, it is our experience, it must fulfil or expect chaos. It must control a monopoly on the use of violence in order to create rule of law for example. But after those there are unlimited possibilities and finite resources. Charities allow individuals to express their priorities, however irrational. For all the talk of "big government" the government is actually fairly small, it literally doesn't have the budget to fund all the cancer research, build all the lifeboats, maintain every ancient monument and unwanted stately home and so on. To a considerable extent government concentrates on the unglamorous. A "weights and measures" charity seems unlikely, as does a charity to ensure every demonised criminal suspect gets a proper lawyer. 82.69.171.94 (talk) 09:05, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * In most cases I would agree with this, except in the case of H4H (and there are probably others). Here the state has asked soldiers to risk their lives and health in the battlefield and then failed to give them adequate care when wounded. This isn't a matter of opinion - the care provided was woefully inadequate during and after the Afghanistan and Iraq campaigns. Even the MoD admit this. The cause is largely apolitical in nature, more down to failure of risk assessment, planning and a degree of incompetence. They weren't simply waiting for some charity to take up the slack. They didn't anticipate the casualties, particularly the types of injuries during an insurgency, nor the length of the campaigns and so didn't install the additional infrastructure needed. Ajkgordon (talk) 09:55, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Rage.
I can't believe this was done.-- 17:05, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The first youtube comment is very interesting too:
 * "Just in case anyone's unaware, George Rekers, who conducted this "research" is the same George Rekers who was caught not to long ago with a rent boy half his age whilst vacationing whom he claimed had been hired to "help him with﻿ his luggage."

Sen (talk) 17:53, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I bet he helped him with his luggage. Ajkgordon (talk)
 * Shocking & tragic.  21:04, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * VERY! D<--Dumpling (talk) 21:45, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Sickening. I'm sure they would wheel me off to some re-education camp for my "perversions" if they could. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 23:21, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, but you'd probably enjoy it. ТyUser_talk:Ty 23:23, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Depends on who is doing the "re-educating." :P Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 23:32, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Or maybe they will try to bore you to death. ТyUser_talk:Ty 23:34, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * 'Cause that's totally kinky. --Dumpling (talk) 23:55, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I have some pretty weird drill attachments... ТyUser_talk:Ty 01:57, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Wouldn't put it past ya. XD--Dumpling (talk) 15:38, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Part 2
Fuck anti-gays-- 18:53, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * ...His reaction. It's rather infuriating. "I wasn't aware of that. That's too bad." --Dumpling (talk) 00:48, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

any historickers?
I came across this. Anybody wanna back it up or something?-- 00:09, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Wow, this smacks of Afrocentrism with the blacks and Native Americans coming together to fight the white demon ('cause minorities can't be racist, right?). Yeah, there's some truth in this, but many tribes owned slaves for shit's sake. The figures look like ass-pulls. Here are the dummies manuals. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 00:18, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The stated figure for pre-Columbian population of Hispaniola is far, far too high. There's of course no way to know what the exact number was but most estimates put it at a few hundred thousand. That makes me wonder right off the bat about the author's overall credibility. It's a shame, because it's true that the native peoples were (and arguably still are) treated unconscionably, and the author undermines the story by pulling stuff like this. Doctor Dark (talk) 00:23, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * This kind of crank stuff also legitimizes the whining about "liberal academia" rewriting history to be more "PC" by the wingnuts. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 00:34, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * what about the thanksgiving as massacre celebration? Also, TOW is where I found this, as a reference.  thanks guise.  You were exactly what I wanted (nobody catch the reference to John Brunner?).--  01:25, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's genuinely difficult even if you're trying (which this lunatic isn't) to see things through the lens of a different social context. I remember encountering someone who seemed otherwise rational but just couldn't get past the idea that anyone who lived in a slave-holding society and didn't fight to free slaves must have been a monster. We will no doubt seem barbarous to our descendants in turn. Did you know the United States of America was still executing criminals in the 21st century? And polygamy was illegal but you could sell cigarettes without a license? [ Fade to hilarious scene of 22nd century secondary students mistakenly connecting these facts ]. 82.69.171.94 (talk) 08:37, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

section 28
just found this on CP. Is this shit for real? also providing a right for teachers not to deal with homophobic bullying ?!?!?!? No, this is not related to CP. This is about section 28, and my source is CP. Truly, such legislation is evil. Letting teachers ignore bullies?!-- 01:46, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If you can't brainwash 'em, beat 'em. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 02:03, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes, it was real and it was a major victory for gay rights campaigners when it was finally repealed. -- 04:51, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Crazy brits, you would never find this kind of discrimination in America ;-P Markedc (talk) 15:17, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

I don't know why...
...but I really, really like this thing (whatever it is). Much better than the original song. ~<font color="#07517C">Super <font color="#6FA23B">Hamster  Talk 06:21, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Have an internet classic. -- 07:13, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My personal fav Markedc (talk) 15:13, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * But have you heard the even better extended version? ~<font color="#07517C">Super <font color="#6FA23B">Hamster  Talk 17:51, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * No I have not, and the 2nd verse is almost as amazing as his horses' custom styling ballsack, I may have to look into that myself. If for no other reason it may provide a way to get out of a scandal involving pictures of my genitals being sent over twitter. Them: OMG you sent your balls over twitter, RESIGN! Me: Yea but they are purple and NO! Markedc (talk) 19:19, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

The Giggles
It always seems to be Cricket that causes the most commentary double-entendres. From "the bowler's holding the batsman's willey"(unverified) to Beefy's "couldn't quite get his leg over", and now this. <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 08:19, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Nice! Have you heard of the Twelfth Man? Australian comedian, Billy Birmingham takes off the commentary team mercilessly. (Translations provided on request.) <font color="blue" face = "Comic Sans MS">RagTop <font color="teal" face = "Comic Sans MS>Gone sailing 08:29, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Lol, I'd heard of it but never heard any before. I did like "the Indian captain Madonna Khan Singh". <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 08:35, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Oh, yes, he's been doing it for years (20+). We have quite a few of his CD's, they are good listening for long car trips. They're very Australian-centric, but most cricket lovers can enjoy the humour. http://www.myspace.com/the12thmanbillybirmingham <font color="blue" face = "Comic Sans MS">RagTop <font color="teal" face = "Comic Sans MS>Gone sailing 08:40, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

"Question Evolution"
Just saw a link to this campaign on PJR's blog, which contains "15 questions evolutionists cannot answer". The usual strawmen arguments by the looks of it. Seems a good topic for a side-by-side article. Anyone more knowledgable about the issue(s) than me able to make a start? <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 15:48, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * this is a wiki. make a start, we'll join in--  16:02, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I read the first question about the origins of life and could possibly start a side by side, but what section would that be created in? (|en|Ich%20bin%20ein%20Neuling Ich bin ein Neuling) Markedc (talk) 16:18, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Looks great for a side-by-side for me. We were looking for a project and this would be a good one.BobSpring is sprung! 16:19, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * We're a little late: Question Evolution. But it could probably stand an updating and a reformatting.  ThunderkatzHo! 16:33, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Ah yes. I see that we've been there already.  A side-by- side format might be nice.  But I'm no good at setting them up. BobSpring is sprung! 16:48, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * You know, one day I'm going to learn how to look to see if we have an existing article before suggesting a new one :-\ <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 20:49, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

"It's peer-reviewed!"
I've been reading through John D. Cook's blog lately and he has some interesting posts on assessing scientific literature. Two good ones, specifically: I'd also add that the literature on a subject taken as a whole should be viewed as a conversation that creates a context in which each experiment/study should be viewed (i.e., is it new? Has it been critiqued? Has it been replicated? Has it been falsified?) In college research methods courses, the bulk of it (at least in my experience) is spent on how to construct a study, but much less so understanding how to approach a body of literature as a whole. It makes me wonder if spending more time teaching these points and how to apply them, it might inoculate against the classic tactic of cherry-picking literature ("It's peer-reviewed") to some extent. I've definitely seen way too many students who seem to be blissfully unaware of the points in the posts. (Also, insert obligatory "As rationalists, we should..." here.) Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 18:47, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * How Loud is the Evidence?
 * The Cult of Significance Testing

SOMEBODY SPIKED THE ALCOHOL!
Ohhh~ Just one of the days.--Dumpling (talk) 21:35, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I used to work in a factory that bottled vodka with a scorpion in the bottom. AMassiveGay (talk) 21:49, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * WOOOOAH! Really~? :D That's kinda BA! What brand of Vodka was this?--Dumpling (talk) 21:54, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I got some habu sake from Okinawa a few years back. Quite nice stuff.  & Of course there's all kinds of woo about how it has medicinal properties, increases sexual potency, increases longevity, etc. etc.  22:13, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I've heard of that before. There would be a town near my grandpa's second home in Korea where they would sell drinks like that. I believe there was also a restaurant that sold turtle blood soju...as well as the soup. Lots of woo on that stuff too...Ah~ Oh well. --Dumpling (talk) 22:21, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I don't believe I'd like to have the job of gutting live pit vipers. They're bound to be pissed when they wake up. -- 22:42, 9 June 2011 (UTC)

Taggart bridge IRL
Yup, it looks like in the real world, conservatives and libertarians are the "looters!" This is sweet, sweet, irony.-- 02:00, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Breaking news
my childhood has died. AMassiveGay (talk) 22:21, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The voice of my childhood as well. I pretty much graduated straight from Rainbow to Doc Who.-- 23:01, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * At least we still have Lalla Ward, who seems to be going for the Alma Maria Mahler Gropius Werfel Prize for celebrity husband-collecting, with Tom Baker and Richard Dawkins to her credit so far. Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 18:00, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I hope he had a chance to punch Bungle in the face. RIP. Grumblejaws (talk) 09:50, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

New creationist talking points?
Since we already have Question Evolution, have the creationists come up with any new talking points of late? Or is it still all about the lack of transitional fossils, irreducible complexity, etc.? Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 21:16, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I doubt they'll ever come up with anything new. The hoax about finding the ark a while back was the closest we got. To be honest they don't need to come up with anything new. They just keep rolling out the same old PRATT arguments and their offspring lap it up. <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 21:21, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Was that the "Oh look, a plank of wood, must be Noah's Ark" incident? Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 21:42, 9 June 2011 (UTC)


 * I find enlightening people as to creationist stupidity very productive. Whenever I link someone to our baraminology article they reliably gouge a hole in their desk with their forehead at the weapons-grade stupidity of the concept. So I think we should carefully spread the very best creationist concepts as widely as possible - David Gerard (talk) 15:32, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Dr. Oz = medical quack
After the Harold Camping Rapture fiasco, maybe Dr. Oz (whom Oprah Winfrey introduced to the world) would be of interest to those who refute crank science. Today's show (for those who missed the Rapture) featured "Dr Oz’s Longevity Calculator to help you estimate out how old you will be when you will die." Seems a palm reader could give the same advice much cheaper than this medical doctor. nobsViva la Revolución! 01:06, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Am I missing something? It says "estimate". What's the problem with such a calculator? We know that a whole bunch of lifestyle factors are correlated with early death. Whether you're talking smoking (turns out it's bad for you) or poverty (ditto, but you may be able to mitigate that to some extent). I don't know much about this Doctor Oz, but the principle of telling people "Falling asleep every night with a cigarette in one hand, an empty vodka bottle in the other and the remnants of a stuffed crust pizza spread before you is not compatible with extensive post-retirement plans" is sound. Is this particular calculator bad in some specific way? 82.69.171.94 (talk) 11:13, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Then add it to Mehmet Oz. ТyUser_talk:Ty 12:48, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * PZ Meyers has been critical of Dr. Oz for some time now. I knew you two were two peas in a pod. I guess this means you're obese as well? TrickyDickTurpis (talk) 13:52, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Off topic from everything but...
I found out during lunch that Michelle Malkin's website is blocked by the DoD filter. The Foxhole Atheist (talk) 07:26, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Those crazy Christians don't give up
You'd think after another humiliating failed armageddon they'd lay off the end of the world stuff, but I've just seen another one. These guys have paid for a 20 minute (!) long advert to air on Youtube telling us that the Bible prophesied the events of Revelation will occur during the reign of pope Benedict, with the antichrist being a clone of pope John Paul II. How they figure this out isn't entirely clear since their website doesn't say anything about it. They do appear to be having some internal doctrinal squabbles though over some bizarre calendaring issues. Those crazy Christians. -- 07:46, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Do they seem to be the type who genuinely believe the rapture is coming or the type that hype it up so that people donate their life savings to the church (like Harold Camping)? <font color="#777777">Crundy <font color="#00F0A20">Talk nerdy to me 07:59, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I'm going for real rapture junkies. The advert was a long runthrough of the trumpets bit from Revelation. You really had to look to see their website embossed on the bottom right. -- 08:06, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Sorry if this is a repost, I don't remember. A young Pole walks on the streets of Krakow at night. Suddenly, an SS soldier stops him. "Achtung! Dokumenten!" he asks. "Uh oh, I forgot them home" the young Pole replies. "Nein! I have orders to kill on the spot everybody without documents". "Please, I'll go and take them". "I have my orders. To the wall!". Suddenly an angel appears from the sky: "dear soldier, save this poor man's life". The SS doesn't listen "sorry, but orders are orders, and I have to execute this man". The angel insists: "This will be an important man: he will be Pope and he will save the world, including your Germany, from Communism! Save him!". The SS hesitates a moment, and then answers: "Well, I will save him this time, but at one condition: that I will be Pope after him". Editor at CPmały książe 08:14, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Ha, I saw that advert on Youtube. I actually watched the first few minutes because it was so extraordinary set between the adverts for cheap broadband and video games. But once they started working their way through the list of trumpets, I just couldn't help thinking of instead 82.69.171.94 (talk) 14:36, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

so, a great sermon I wish the CP'ers could have heard
at my church last sunday, we got a sermon about how the church shouldn't be pushing a political agenda as their main focus. it's ok if we influence culture indirectly, but if we actually TRY to force it, we lose focus on what we should, something like that (it's been a week, i don't remember as well anymore). Btw, we are a biblical, literal word of god church.--Mikalos209 (talk) 16:06, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yes but really no. I mean, not other wise fully. --87.5.101.196 (talk) 20:36, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

Propaganda Fail
Brad Jones lays the smack down on an anti-rock film from 82.--Thanatos (talk) 01:28, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Good stuff, but I think the best fundy propaganda movie (released during my lifetime at least) is still Mazes and Monsters. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 01:44, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

Good ole rum from across the seven seas
Arrrrgh!
 * Those might good barrels for aging real booze one day. 05:12, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

Ahem
I don't really know if it works that way, but I really hope I didn't get this advertisement because of my "involvement" here.-- 21:43, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Nice resolution & formatting. Thanks.   23:35, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It also featured your real name. I've deleted the file as a precaution. Röstigraben (talk) 07:28, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Fuck! I didn't even notice that.  Thank you.  That's twice in a week...--  11:27, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If you quit upoloading your real name to the site, we can go back to only oversighting/deleting accidental/intentional slurs on others. Rosti, bricks uploaded it, therefore bricks approved of the content.  05:08, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

Ezekiel 23
WTF is this? It reads like smut.--  22:31, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's an allegory for the fate of the two Jewish kingdoms (Judah and Israel). A rather misogynist allegory. 22:34, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Heh. I just read our Ezekiel article today. Vulpius (talk) 23:17, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What kind of allegory for kingdoms can possibly involve the phrase "hung like donkeys and cum like a horse"? Unless ye olde jewish kingdoms were *really* trying to boast about themselves... X Stickman (talk) 14:11, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

Latin help
Need some help for a part of the Aleister Crowley article I'm working on. He retitled "The Book of the Law" as "Liber AL vel Legis." Capitalizations aside, was this proper Latin? Wouldn't it just be "Liber Legis?" ThunderkatzHo! 20:32, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * both are fine. man was well educated--  21:53, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * My knowledge of Latin is limited. What does the AL vel do?  ThunderkatzHo! 21:56, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * "AL" appears to be an abbreviation of some kind, likely unknown what for. The title at one point was "Liber L vel Legis", which supports the notion that the "L" -> "AL" is an abbreviation. As noted by the BoN below, "vel" means "or"... so the English title doesn't properly match up. It would like be more accurate as "The Book of ((the?) AL or the Law)". (Parentheses added to disambiguate the grammar.) But yes, the proper rendition of the English phrase: "The Book of the Law" would be "Liber Legis". -- 23:49, 11 June 2011 (UTC)

vel means or. so it has two titles, AL or Law 58.163.175.134 (talk) 23:02, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Et al = and the rest, so Liber al vel Legis = Book of the Law and the Rest, using vel as or, not xor? Just my 2 cents. NDSP 09:48, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * But AL is capitalized for one, and "et al" is short for "et alii." The only way the title makes real grammatical sense is if AL is an abbreviation of a noun in the genitive, making it "The Book of the AL or the Law," as Eira said. 17:49, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Shermer's new book
Michael Shermer released a new book recently: The Believing Brain. Does anyone have it/know anything about it? It looks like good stuff, but it sounds like it covers mostly the same ground as Vyse, Gilovich, and Hood. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 05:27, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * All I can say is that I read a good review of it and I'm thinking of getting it.--BobSpring is sprung! 09:22, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

My own venting (though no where near as bad as Hamster's)
$3000 in car repairs really really sucks.

The hybrid battery in my Prius needs to be replaced. MDB (talk) 16:39, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Your first mistake was to own a Prius. Ajkgordon (talk) 19:15, 7 June 2011 (UTC)
 * yikes ! my whole car (a 93 chevy lumina) isnt worth 3,000. You are doing your bit for global warming by having a nice environ freindly electric car.be proud . Hamster (talk) 03:02, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * First battery replacement I've heard of (and I'm tuned in to this stuff, a bit). What year is it? PS, the battery isn't a "hybrid", the Pious is. Speaking of which, I was moving a hybrid Camry the other day, what a weird experience.  Push the big "on" button and all that comes to life is the fresh air fan.   Put it in gear, push the "no longer loud" pedal, and it moves.  Want one.  04:10, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's a 2005. I got it in August of that year, and it has 106K miles on it.
 * And I know the battery isn't a hybrid; I just call it that to differentiate between the "regular" battery.
 * I was tempted to replace it, but it's been paid off for nearly a year, and I like not having a car payment. MDB (talk) 10:26, 8 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Can you estimate whether the fuel savings during that time were on a par with the cost of the new juice box? Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 17:51, 9 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Let's see... 106K miles on it, and I'd say I've averaged 45 mpg over it's lifetime. That's 15 mpg better than a similarly sized standard car. Let's say gas has averaged $3.00/gallon over the almost six years I've had it... Dammit, I'm an engineer, I should be able to figure this out. 106K miles, divided by 15 mpg improvement means I saved about 7000 gallons of gas. At $3/gallon, that's $21K. Dang. That's impressive, but sounds so good I think I made a math mistake. MDB (talk) 10:52, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah, that was wrong. Okay, if I had driven 106K miles at 30 mpg, I would have used about 3500 gallons. Driving a Prius at 45 mpg means I used about 2300 gallons, so I saved 1200 gallons. At $3/gallon, that's $3600 saving. So I'm coming out slightly ahead, even with the $3K for the new battery. MDB (talk) 11:27, 10 June 2011 (UTC)

At's roughly consistent with the order of magnitude a co-worker got a few years ago, wondering whether to get a gas-electric car. As I recall, his figuring convinced him to stay out of that market for a while, with the prediction being seven years until he would need a $10K battery. Sketchy memory, so those numbers could be way off... Sprocket J Cogswell (talk) 16:06, 10 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the various numbers. Your battery seems to have died early.  Who is telling you you need a new one?  Have you contacted Toyota about this?  As I said, I'm sort of in the loop and these batteries aren't dying yet, even the ten year old ones (except for a recall one of the two Japanese mfrs did a few years back).  05:20, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * 45mpg isn't particularly special - although I understand that these are puny US gallons and we're talking about the land of 12mpg 'trucks' - in my opinion it certainly doesn't warrant the expense and complications of hybrid technology. Get thee a German Diesel, you'll get better MPG and not have to worry about battery pack replacements or other such shit.   08:09, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I get the impression it's not that easy to run a diesel in the US. Don't some states ban them in city centres and it's sometimes difficult to get DERV at a "gas" station? Ajkgordon (talk) 09:29, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

Climatewiki
"ClimateWiki is moderated and edited by The Heartland Institute". Interesting? Pippa (talk) 18:46, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * All the greatest hits in one collection. Love all the Idso, Singer, Monckton, etc. refs.Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 20:38, 11 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Where's the "Create an account" button? Doctor Dark (talk) 04:26, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Apparently it's a shills only wiki. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 05:48, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Article? Even a stub would be cool...  09:24, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Added it to Heartland's page. Apparently Stoat has skimmed through some edits and they can't even use the MediaWiki syntax properly. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 04:47, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

Lockett Madness
I still don't geddit, but it came back here, CP, and hath claimed a new victim. Any word if this made it elsewhere? I created an account and told the admin there to delete it. And I just wrote about this because it seems relevant to the wiki as a whole. Who is this?--Colonel Sanders (talk) 00:01, 12 June 2011 (UTC). PS: It made Liberapedia.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 00:04, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Heard it before, do not get it. If it's really bogus, I am an Ameriwikii sysop now... I could delete it (if I think George would be OK with that). 00:05, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Nuked it. Still would love to know what the heck the story behind this is. 00:09, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I am Ameriwiki user now, and congrats on the sysopship! By looking at the piece, looks like teen angst over some popular girl who drinks and fornicates and is therefore a neo-Nazi.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 00:19, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The same idiot tried putting this article up on ED. I don't know what his grudgewank is.  As for Liberapedia, of course they took it.  Nobody goes there, so nobody noticed it come up.--  00:22, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Still say it's angst. But if it was on ED, then it must've been around for a while.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 00:29, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Probably is. We were all teenagers once, I guess.--George (talk) 00:33, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yeah it is. If they try to make it again, just delete and block. It's all you really can do.--Colonel Sanders (talk) 01:27, 12 June 2011 (UTC)

Or redirect to DFTT. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 01:32, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Jebus on a pogo stick, are all of these BONs blanking pages and fucking around in general related to this Springlyn Lockett shit? I feel like it would be easier just to protect the entire damn wiki for 24 hours or something. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 05:42, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Why not just turn off anonymous editing for a while, until the BoN-storm calms down? Of course, logged-in editors can still cause problems, but they are a bit easier to manage... 05:49, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * turning off anonymous editing will just lead to an uproar from the likes of MC and NR-- 06:05, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * What do MC or I have to do with this or are you still itching for a fight? I'll bring it if you are. [[file:Nuttysexpistols.png|60px|link=User:Nutty Roux|Nutty Roux]][[file:Nuttytalk.png|35px|link=User_talk:Nutty_Roux|never mind]] 23:19, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * And we give a shit why? Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 06:11, 12 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't forget 41.Gremlin. He likes to make charges in the coop as a BoN. And since when has NR ever used anon editing? And also, why are people so authoritarian?  04:45, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Aw! It's so CUTE - widdle Human's still all butt-hurt because I called his widdle buddy on her unacceptable actions. Oh yes, and his.  PsyGremlin  10:07, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The last time we had that script kiddie, Trent put a captcha on anonymous edits, effectively stopping the vandalism while allowing the usual BoNs to post. Perhaps someone should put a request at the technical support page or here, under a more descriptive title?--ZooGuard (talk) 05:23, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I remember that. Perhaps you could email Trent and/or Nx?  09:23, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * RationalWiki:Technical support. Nx said he has enabled it again.--ZooGuard (talk) 10:03, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

can cats get rabies?
it's not mentioned here. thanks-- 18:35, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Yea, cats can get rabies. I think all mammals can? ~<font color="#07517C">Super <font color="#6FA23B">Hamster  Talk 18:48, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * That is my understanding too. Even goats can get rabies.--BobSpring is sprung! 20:22, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * WP:Cat health mentions it. Googling "cats rabies" will also tend to answer any queries or doubts you may have.   20:28, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * It's funny, but googling it didn't even occur to me. thanks guise--  22:24, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * They very much can, but in North America rarely do. Raccoons and bats are common carriers, with bats causing most human exposures. And for your reading pleasure, only peripherally related is this. -- [[Image:Asclepius staff.png|8px]]-PalMD -- 00:17, 14 June 2011 (UTC)