RationalWiki:Chicken coop/Archive132

GrammarCommie and 2friedeggs
Both users are terminally unable to resolve a conflict despite multiple interactions and chances, and their interactions have led them being handled on ATIM several times. I've tried stepping in and giving advice, though this is ineffective, with 2friedeggs continuing to prod GC (while 2friedeggs has had a very rocky history with interacting with other users in the wiki) while GC has continued acting incivil and assumed bad faith in me and baselessly accused me of dishonesty (while also lashing out at other users). Their disruptive actions are not conductive to the site, and discussion is needed to deal with both of them. 03:09, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * The reason I kept talking to GC is because from my end it looks like people like to turn a blind eye to the way he talks to other people. I have been called out for flaming in the past (playful language, like "dingledorf"), which I have ceased when I was. This guy routinely does it in bad faith, with much harsher language, and does not even cease when asked to stop, and assumes everyone is out to get him in the occasions he realizes he might have to face consequences, like now. A banned user has given me a theory of why he gets away with it and to say the least it's one I do not agree with at all. I've already mentioned on ATIM I'm ok with an iban. Generally speaking a couple of people on here I wont mention by name have been hostile to me in the past which might explain the rocky history, but yes I have blood on my hands so to speak.--2friedeggs (talk) 03:16, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I would support an interaction ban as well. We have all the proof needed to say eggs and GC can't resolve their differences via discussion. Neither of them will de-escalate on their own.-Flandres (talk) 03:38, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * It's almost 11 PM. I'm tired, I've had multiple anxiety attacks (unrelated to this drama), I'm depressed, I'm annoyed, and I really don't have the energy to fight over this crap, on this site, any further. I left of my own volition, and honestly, I don't know why I even responded to LGM's comments, since in hindsight they were just... I don't even know what. 2friedeggs can go fuck himself though, given he started this crap. Do what you feel needs to be done. I'm beat. 03:53, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Nope but I do also call attention to their history. Both of them have been at the core of multiple disputes with multiple users, so they're both looking like problem users on their own. I'll do a rundown later, but 2friedeggs does seem tiresome to moderate while GC has been slinging insults at everyone in the community and has now twice accused me of dishonesty, the second time being a passive-aggressive insinuation of insidious motives from me, accusations I do not take lightly and should not be within spirit of discourse for this wiki. Not to mention his swipes at the community at large. One example: Block log on Let Them Eat Cake while I was going through the ATIM process because that's how we normally handle trolls on the wiki, through getting opinion of the mob: ("You people are idiots."). Second example: ("I quit. Rot in hell".) Third example: unwarranted attack on the moderators while also regularly contributing to disruption  "Obviously someone needs to keep some level of order around here, and it sure as shit isn't the Mods or yourself." It's going to continue. It doesn't matter to me "who started", they're both problems.
 * I'm not particularly sympathetic to your personal issues either, GC, not much anymore, especially after your graphic all-caps remarks in spite of my pleas to stop through discord dms and block logs, and your horrible personal attacks on me, but you're letting it spill over on this site a few too many times and I'm still going to say you need a ton of self-control and improvement on your end. I don't like how this all soured, I don't like cooping you at all, but I care about the community too. 04:07, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * GrammarCommie has been complained about multiple recent times at ATIM, and was nearly blocked recently but Plutocow and 2friedeggs were recently ibanned, suggesting it could be more on Eggs then GC, as weird as that feels to say, where GC was also being hyper-aggressive. Andrew5 (talk) 11:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If a recent iban of all things makes it more on me fine just end this, resysop me, and iban me from him so that I don't enable his stage-like drama any longer, it'll be good for both of us.--2friedeggs (talk) 11:35, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Full support behind IBAN. In addition, I'd soft propose a sysoprevoke on 2friedeggs. I don't have a concrete policy reason for this, but their behavior over the past few months illustrates a clear lack of baseline competence to be able to manage anything more than a potted plant (much less a wiki). -- Techpriest (talk) 11:36, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * It can be hard to stay calm sometimes, but that seems to be the expectation in the world over. Since GC already quit, it's just a matter of giving infractions like anyone else if they're in clear violation of site rules. I haven't been paying enough attention to eggs to say much. Basically, if you stop to think for a minute whether your comment is actually worth posting over going for a walk or playing a game and saying "okay fuck that noise" for a while, avoiding the conflict tends to work out better. It also tends to work out better for you because the person you are pissed at will tend to get themselves in trouble more when you don't respond. Basically, just don't fight people. There is no pride to be won in an internet argument. This comes from frankly too damned much experience on that issue. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 11:44, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Sysop revoke for GC for long-standing incivility and longstanding misuse of sysop revoke functions (randomly doing it without going to ATIM, and unecessarily), editing of other people's comments, threatening behaviour, and goading of other editors. Also re-sysop for 2fried if GC or a Discord buddy of them once again desysopped 2fried.  GC is also not an active or contributing member, and has stated, for multiple reasons, he will no longer want to be contribing to various talk pages and saloon bar discussions, so an iban makes no sense.  His only presence is on a Discord room that appears to be totally defunct, and so the only people who will defend him are fellow Discord mods.  I have not encountered any issues from 2fried but once shared with him that I experienced similar issues with GC.  2fried also seems to be a very active contributing member to mainspace, and with a lack of history of incivility on his end, I see no reason to have this ATIM blow back on him.  Now leftygreen is also experiencing unecessary drama from GC.  Basta, it's enough Neiltyson1fan (talk) 11:51, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Should the topic of GC's incivility, goading, editing of other people's comments, threatening behaviour, and inability to get along with bread and butter editors once again grace the coop, where they try to resign or bow out before more comments, and who's only contributions to the wiki have been spam cleaning and talk page drama over years now, would propose an idef ban on GC. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 12:24, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

I don’t think eggs should be sysoprecoked, but 2 Ibans means I can’t oppose. I support a sysoprevoke on GC. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 13:41, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Someone informed me GC desysopped 2fried against sysop rules, and without consultation with the community. I have resysopped 2fried as it was not in consultation with the community.  I don't know much about 2fried's talk page history, but I have not seen any abusive behaviour from him, including misuse of sysop, and his mainspace edits are good.  Should this coop vote to desysop 2fried I'd respect the decision, but right now the coop is leaning in favor of dysopping GC and perhaps an iban btw 2 Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Current thoughts: I wondered for awhile how my little comment on GC's page, a little critique spiralled into a coop issue and really he sysoprevoke me because I banned him and disabled talk page privileges for harassment. That right there was not cool in hind sight and was because he kept reverting my criticism of him while name-calling me at the same time. But I probably should have been patient. The mods sure seem to be and perhaps they know something about GC that makes them try to be patient with him. GC is not shy from bringing his mental health up. I don't know GC well.


 * I wanna make one thing clear: GC has likely stopped many a spammer. He's a wonder at that, that's for sure. The problem is for some reason he's a little too aggressive doing it. I do wonder how many people who could've been productive editors we're chased off by him though. I want him to keep his mop if he can learn to manage his anger. I don't want him to chase off editors over trivial matters and flame people into intimidation. I don't want him to turn to theatrics when he is not getting his way.--2friedeggs (talk) 14:14, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Oxyaena before she left informed me that GC's manipulative behaviour was partially a reason for her leave. Or maybe it was after she left I don't really remember.  There is no reason this should even be a coop but once again GC has made people obsess over him.  Some form of permanent desysop would be in order, as last time he was dysopped he got someone to resysop him almost as soon as he asked. Leftymario asked GC to stop teasing his permanent leave, and either leave or come back and not start fights, and he chose to 1. come back and 2. start a fight immediately and 3. break another sysop rule by desysopping a good contributor without community consultation. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:19, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Oxyaena was banned by the community after causing continuous strife, engaging in endless LANCB's and getting more interaction bans than any other member of the community ever. Whatever may be happening with currently with other individuals the main person responsible for her behavior and departure was her.Bob"Life is short and (insert adjective)" 14:49, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * LMAO. Oxyaena was herself a manipulative psychopath who would block IP editors (including myself back in the day) claiming to have a hunch that said IP editor was a sockpuppet whatever troll she had an obsession with at the moment and cry "YOU HATE ME!" like wp:Nancy Oleson on Little House on the Prairie whenever someone would call her out for it. She is a big reason why I registered this account, and boy it feels good to call a spade a spade right now and NOT worry about it creating a shitfest because, frankly, watching everybody come to her defense whenever someone who wasn't an established user called her out was pathetic. 71.208.x.x (talk) 05:00, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Not a mod so can't really actually make the decisions like this but I've been weighing these options:


 * 1. Just an iban


 * 2. Temp sysoprevoke


 * 3. permarevoke


 * 4. Making him unable to revert his self-ban until he asks to be unbanned


 * Seeing though I'm partially accountable though it seems I feel a little weird talking like this--2friedeggs (talk) 14:29, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * People will decide on what is warranted, they don't need instructions on what to do. Also unrelated, in my coop comment, I addressed that I had once accepted a request to comment on the matter from 2fried via his dicosrd account weeks ago. That the only person defending GC in the coop is also in contact with GC on Discord is not a reason to bring that to people's talk pages.  I did not ask anyone to start the current atim or coop.  that people are elevating discord drama I am not involved in or interested in to my talk page is not wanted, please do not do that.  That the current coop and atim were started without my involvement, means that I am just giving my opinion, along with Leftymario and Andrew.  I have never been in contact with Leftymario or Andrew but agree with them here. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:43, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll see what I can do via DMs. HendrickTheGross (talk) 14:45, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I support it. The issue with GC is really one with toxic masculinity, honestly...constantly yelling and jeering at everyone he does not like, then going into horrible detail about self-harm in order to scare people into silence. Quite abusive behavior.--A p r i l Chat? 15:43, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Leave my self harm issues out of it. Those were brought up only when they are relevant, which they currently are not. 16:36, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Only probably up when they were relevant...? I have seen you scream about it at people's faces multiple times, and you went into extremely triggering detail about such harm. I understand you have these issues, but frequently bringing them up in arguments without prior reason is very toxic behavior, sorry.--A p r i l Chat? 17:03, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Sigh... You're right, sorry. The outbursts in question were toxic. Sorry, again. 17:10, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you--2friedeggs (talk) 17:14, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Glad to see you recognize this issue and apologized, GC.--A p r i l Chat? 20:41, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Logs
Edit: Relevant logs are here, here, here, and here. If it comes down to it, I can also upload my DMs with anyone I'm accused of conspiring with, if they give their consent.


 * 2friedeggs butts into a conversation that does not involve him in any way shape or form, thus antagonizing by default.
 * I tell him to fuck off.
 * He restores the comment.
 * I explicitly tell him that he's engaging in harassment.
 * 01:08, 5 July 2022, He disables my talkpage access.
 * He restores his comment again.
 * 01:20, 5 July 2022 I take his mop.
 * He starts an ATIM case to complain.
 * Bear in mind that at this point he has engaged in goading, which I have logs for him engaging in during my initial quitting of the site.
 * "Never Change man"

[https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=RationalWiki:Chicken_coop&diff=2467544&oldid=2467540 He's a liar when he says he just wants me to be better behaved. That is a lie.] He wants me to lash out so he can have an excuse to bar me from the site. 14:57, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Where did I lie?--2friedeggs (talk) 15:17, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I have logs for everything these two have done leading up to the present time, and if pressed can show them. They have secret Discord DMs. This Coop is a farce. 15:00, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Ok--2friedeggs (talk) 15:02, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * And now he's edit warring over a misformatted comment in a further attempt to goad me. Are the Mods going to do anything about this? No. No they are not. 15:09, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm tired.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:11, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Dude I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt but you seem to be very good at making people not want to do that.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:16, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Liar. 15:17, 5 July 2022 (UTC)


 * For the record Andrew has voted for a sysop revoke of GC, LeftyGreen is stating GC is misusing DMs, and I have voted for sysop revoke of GC. Utilizing Discord (within the last few weeks) is only being done by one person rn as far as I know, GC Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:18, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I also now support an IBAN btw the two as well Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:18, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * "LeftyGreen is stating GC is misusing DMs" where? It certainly isn't on this page. Am I to be tried in secret? 15:20, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * "especially after GC's graphic all-caps remarks in spite of my pleas to stop through discord dms and block logs, and your horrible personal attacks on me, but you're letting it spill over on this site a few too many times and I'm still going to say you need a ton of self-control and improvement on your end. I don't like how this all soured, I don't like cooping you at all, but I care about the community too"

- leftygreen I assumed that meant your personal attacks against leftygreen were via Discord DMs, as I did not see them on RW. Therefore, yes you are misusing Discord DMs, or telegram or whatever it is Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:22, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't have a Telegram account. Those don't factor into the current conflict as I haven't talked to LGM in Discord for roughly a year. We have both blocked each other on that application. 15:24, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Meanwhile at least three users are now exchanging secret DMs over Discord which are claimed to have evidence pertinent to this case. None of those users are me. 15:29, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I am not trying to present new evidence for this case. I was just talking to spoony about what happened with him and Neilty. HendrickTheGross (talk) 15:34, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Leftygreen started the coop bro Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:30, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If as GC showed, a person is being told to stop harassing on another person's talk page and refuses, then that is rather clearly harassment. I think 2friedeggs should be sysoprevoked. An interaction ban is also called for. Bongolian (talk) 15:31, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * But was I harassing him? Because if you think it is you better go look at exactly what was removed. Then compare that to how GC talks to everyone around him.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:33, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * None of those logs posted above show harassment on GCs or 2fried part. The worst shows 2fried locking the page of a user that claims to have been resigned weeks ago, which happens all the time without coops.  Regardless if people wanna desysop 2fried over locking a LANCBd persons page, thered be many more people, including mods, to desysop Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:34, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Neilty, I might just start an ATIM case about you if you continue a stangle over ancient drama. HendrickTheGross (talk) 15:35, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll discontinue from this coop, but leave with the statement that I will vote the same as Andrew and likely leftygreen. Also threatening ATIMs over a coop so far in Andrew and I's favor is really bad faith. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:36, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If required, I can upload evidence of me having blocked LGM on Discord. Correction: the block was in March of this year. 15:37, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Last time we had an iban discussion it also involved Spoony/eggs. Back then, proved that he lied. Now, GC also gave some evidence that he's lying. You don't have to like GC, but we can all agree that he's honest and has the best intentions on his mind, even when he's wrong. If you want my opinion, 2friedeggs is clearly exploiting GC and his anger issues for fun. GeeJayK (talk) 15:42, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * What did I lie about then and what did I lie about here, jog my memory. Edit: Oh, hi Discord guy. I don't expect to see any evidence then. Focus on the matter at hand instead of my supposed motives. You know what you are doing.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:43, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * (EC)(EC) You claimed you didn't harass GC. Well, you did. He removed your comment from his talk page. Why did you put it again? He saw it, you put it there again just to needle him For the record, I don't support sysoprevoking you yet. GeeJayK (talk) 15:49, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I don't need to walk on eggshells around him in fear of him starting theatrics when he thinks he can say whatever he wants to everyone. If refusing to do so is harassment, guilty as charged. If you mean, uh "aggressive pressure or intimidation" (aka "harassment") I wonder who is guilty of that? Not me.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:54, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * it is true that techpriest, gc, and geejay talk together via the "RW support discord" that no one uses. Therefore disengagement and awaiting decision from the person who started the coop would be  in  2frieds  favor Neiltyson1fan (talk)
 * Go ahead. I would like some confusion cleared up. HendrickTheGross (talk) 15:54, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * :::We’ve had issues with the Discord being used for gossip. See RationalWiki talk:All things in moderation/Archive49. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 15:55, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * (ec) I can upload my entire post history from that server if need be. I can also upload further context if the relevant users consent to it. Can 2fried and Neilty do the same? 15:56, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I already gave Hendrick my side and you will see it if he uploads his DMs with me. Stop thinking everyone is out to get you.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:58, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll be willing to upload the DMs if you're also willing to upload the DMs you had with Neilty. HendrickTheGross (talk) 15:59, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * (EC)(EC) Yes? We use the server to discuss RMF matters. Trent is there too, maybe he's also part of this conspiracy against you and Eggs? Oh, wait,you guys are also there, and literally no one discussed this case on that server. Last time I talked to GC in private was almost a month ago. GeeJayK (talk) 16:00, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I have no DMs with Neilty to my knowledge. I am being accused of conspiring with . 16:02, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Not you, spoony. HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:03, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Everyone in the that "RW support Discord" has immediate DM access to each other, including GC, techprist, and Geejay. I think that Techprist and (at some point) GC were/are mods there. Leftygreen started the coop and he did not conspire to start it, so people hoping to change the subject of the coop are being very bad faith. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 16:03, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * It could also just be a simpler "GC shuns everyone who doesn't assume he's 100% in the right" situation, not a "I have goons to keep me covered if any oppose me" situation. Last night makes the former feel more likely to me.--2friedeggs (talk) 16:23, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * You two started spuriously accusing others of conspiracy. You derailed this coop, not I. 16:28, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * "You two" Stop.--2friedeggs (talk) 16:31, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * For clarity's sake, I am not conspiring with anyone. I've had some choice comments about this entire case, but it's not really anything I didn't say yet down below. Also, because I do have a few standards - no, I do not take editor rights away from people who I argue with. I in fact do almost the opposite of that; I start pissy coops and ATIM cases when I see other editors do that stuff to get it resolved cleanly. So neiltyson1fan can take that bad faith accusation and put it where the sun don't shine. -- Techpriest (talk) 17:40, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Requested Discord DMs
Neilty refused to let me and I'm respecting that it's not on my hands or I would--2friedeggs (talk) 16:03, 5 July 2022 (UTC) Nevermind he's a creep. He wanted to figure out who GrammarCommie was irl after admitting he's an Incel and an Antipsychiatrist to me and started spewing insults about GC when I drew the line.--2friedeggs (talk) 18:01, 5 July 2022 (UTC) HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 
 * 
 * 
 * 
 * Neilty being weird
 * GeeJayK's most recent DMs with me. 16:22, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * File:Neiltyson1fanIsACreep.png - proof of neiltyson1fan being a creep to me on Discord. Consent was not asked for frankly obvious reasons. -- Techpriest (talk) 17:57, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Gonna be honest, maybe an ATIM for Neilty is more in order because trust me after seeing that I care a bit less about above.--2friedeggs (talk) 17:59, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Also, pretty much all DMs I had with GC about this case, just to clear my name. -- Techpriest (talk) 18:15, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Also I did block GC on Discord. It's only tangentially conflict but at one point I was anticipating triggering comments, too anxious to interact with him directly. Makes me feel sad about how this relationship soured but I need to put my own psche first; it's for my own sake to avoid this sort of graphic, content warning stuff. 00:24, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Leaving until more people are on or I'm less exhausted
I'm not lying. Stop accusing me of lying until you can and will prove it. Stop bringing up hidden motives you think I have, stop accusing me of goading because I sure have opinions on why GC acts the way he does. Just focus on the crap people are doing at hand. I don't care who is reading this no cabal is out to get you in case this DM chore wasn't enough yet.--2friedeggs (talk) 16:30, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

The logs on RW support an IBAN btw 2fried and GC, and a sysop revoke of GC. There's a reason not a single court in the world admits (self-admitted) plain computer desktop screenshots without as evidence of something, or even more a lack of something. If people wanted to make an argument about bias, they should question whether or not GC currenetly or has in the past moderated that "RW support" discord referenced in past coops as a source of bias. Think if 2fried moderated or has moderated the rationalwiki support discord people would be accusing him of bias Neiltyson1fan (talk) 16:33, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * This is not a court trial with lawyers. HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:35, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Does GC currently moderate the support Discord of which everyone supporting him has come from? If so, stop accusing anyone of bias. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 16:36, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Where, where in this thread did I call (dishonest) bias? HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:39, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * A better question is why aren't you releasing your own DMs, as I have? For someone fond of accusing others of conspiracy, you sure are fond of hiding your own history. 16:38, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * The reason he refuses to is likely, to put it very simply, the DMs show he really, really, does not like you.--2friedeggs (talk) 16:58, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I would like to see an example of his "strong dislike". Even if you put in DMs. HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:00, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * You didn't answer the question, does GC moderate the site support discord as a LANCBd person who regularly breaks sysop rules? Neiltyson1fan (talk) 16:44, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * That's like the definition of corrupt bros. Good luck not editing and not contributing to the site while just making drama, because that's all you do. Happens to every wiki Neiltyson1fan (talk) 16:45, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * From a to another, I think you're taking the 90/10 Rule too seriously. GC might not contribute to the main space very much, but he's one of the few users that actually engage in talk page discussions. These discussions do improve the Wiki. GeeJayK (talk) 17:14, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Time for cooler heads to prevail
Preface: Because of the sheer amounts of HCM on display, I will not put up with any slapfighting in the replies to this section. That is to say, I am throwing a mod fiat and any slapfighting will be moved under a collapse. If you don't like it, further complaining will result in beatings until the morale improves may lead to short term blocks.

Okay so first. Let's unpack this situation instead of just commenting on it during work breaks (me). For some reason everyone is exploring the full range of potential that HCM holds and isn't posting any logs until GC did so a bit earlier. Let's walk through those and try to build a timeline.

Timeline of events (timestamps are in my timezone - they're still chronological, which is what matters):


 * 16 June 2022: GC bans himself from the wiki alongside temporarily banning 2friedeggs. Events prior to this and the leadup to this LANCB will not be considered for this timeline, mostly because we need to cap this timeline off somewhere.
 * 1 July 2022: GC shortly unbans himself to remove an old essay made on the site. He reblocks himself immediately after.
 * 3 July 2022:
 * Let Them Eat Cake (LETC) is reported to All Things In Moderation by LeftyGreenMario for transphobic trolling.
 * 16:20 GC unbans himself, indefinitely blocks LTEC (16:30), and blocks himself again immediately after (16:31).
 * 20:59 LGM makes this comment on GCs talkpage, to attempt to resolve the initial events that led to LANCB of GC (afaict).
 * 4 July 2022:
 * 00:24 GC replies with this comment and LGM replies again (00:26).
 * 01:30 2friedeggs replies with this inflammatory comment.
 * 13:54 GC reverts 2friedeggs comment and responds to LGM (13:54-14:10, 3 edits, cut down for brevity's sake).
 * 5 July 2022:
 * 02:35 2friedeggs and GC edit war over the aforementioned inflammatory comment (edit war is at 03:05, 03:08).
 * 03:08 2friedeggs blocks GC with talkpage access disabled (this is the first instance of user rights being abused).
 * 03:20 GC unblocks himself, blocks 2friedeggs and strips him of rights (alongside two alts of 2friedeggs).
 * 03:22 2friedeggs files an ATIM case against GC, citing privilege abuse. This slaps back and forth until this coop case is opened.
 * 03:23 2friedeggs reports to GC that he's been posted on ATIM with a new inflammatory comment.
 * 03:49 LGM replies to the resolution thread again. GC responds again telling LGM to not interact with him anymore.
 * 05:01 LGM gives GC a 9 hour block (talkpage access enabled)
 * 05:07 LGM tells GC that he's in the coop.
 * 05:11 LGM unblocks GC.
 * 05:58 GC blocks himself.
 * 16:46 GC unblocks himself to respond to the coop.

I've omitted the details of the ATIM case, you can observe the last revision of that here.

These are the facts of the current coop.

Now for some opinions of mine:

First, while I prior softly threw up boomeranging 2friedeggs' sysop abuse for gross incompetence, I think this should be acted upon even further. 2friedeggs is blatantly incapable of acting with any responsibility whatsoever and I frankly think that he should be permanently banned for excessive inflammatory behavior (he has a history of this, see archive 53, archive 55 and archive 57, plus he has an outstanding interaction ban with Plutocow for similar inflammatory/straight up annoying behavior when it comes to disagreements with others).

Secondly there is the matter of GC. It's... not exactly a secret that GC responds poorly to people badgering him or when he gets aggravated (which happens easily) and because he's a prolific editor, he attracts a lot of people that badger him. We've slapped GC on the wrist before for crossing the lines into what he's said and as far as I can currently assume, the self-exile was a decision made to prevent this from getting out of hand. That being said, having a lot of cases made against you is not necessarily grounds in and of itself for removal from the site. While frustrating the entire site on a regular basis is a good way to get shorttracked into a ban, GC largely doesn't do this; it's invariably editors who themselves have issues. That isn't to say GC is entirely clean, but for this case, I cannot in good conscience recommend punishing GC. Outside of the timeline, it should be noted that GCs original LANCB was triggered over a conflict with 2friedeggs.

Thirdly, we need to address neiltyson1fan and like... actually do it properly. He really almost warrants his own section for how much he's climbed on the chair to accuse GC of being a bad faith actor. For some history; neiltyson1fan originally ragequit the site because of attempted ownership of the Incel page, which he kept whitewashed to promote a wiki which he has a COI with for several years. You can read this pretty much entirely on the first archive for that page. There's a lot of other problems with neiltyson1fan as well, such as attempting ownership of the MMT page (which he got so annoyed with that he copy-pasted the entire page into his userspace), and mind you that this is all over a mere disagreement on page content. He eventually completely ragequit the site after GC crossed a line when it came to being aggravated (which got handled appropriately at the time by on-site staff and led to some words about GC not posting about self-harm in the bar anymore).

I will also note that, and this is frankly far more disgusting (although I had forgotten about this), neiltyson1fan's disagreements with me being a "bad moderator" come from the fact that he tried to go sysop shopping off-site to get GC banned during that event where he (neiltyson1fan) ragequit (or in his phrasing: "make friends"), part of which involved sending me and some other users some frankly really creepy messages in retrospect (amongst other things telling me that "i want to connect with you on a personal level", when I told him that I was a mod and was doing my duties as a mod). I'd not follow up too much on this at the time as I had IRL issues that largely prevented me from interacting with the site.

Because of all this, as well as his current inflammatory behavior in the coup, I am recommending an indefinite ban for neiltyson1fan as well for editor harassment, inability to resolve arguments peacefully and attempting to badger other editors into making bad decisions.

I would like to remind anyone who made it this far that the previous mod fiat is in effect and slapfighting will all be thrown together under a general collapse. -- Techpriest (talk) 17:32, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * You got the events a little wrong there, he could've unblocked himself to do something else too but he decided to actually permablock me, not temp block me. Everything you labeles as an "inflammatory comment" is still both untrue and hypocritical. Why you chose to do this is beyond me. Everything else I can understand after a day of thinking about it.... except the indef block? Did I shoot your dog or something? Insult your mother? Holy crap. Take it easy.--2friedeggs (talk) 17:42, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * No, I just got genuinely extremely annoyed needing to spit through all these logs to piece this bloody case together. As for you; now that I'm both slightly calmer (and since neiltyson1fan is in fact significantly more escalating in being a shithead right now, it helps me not conflate the escalation you two are engaging in). Don't think a perma is quite as needed anymore, do still think you could do with some time off from the wiki and I still don't think you are fit for sysop rights. -- Techpriest (talk) 18:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Regardless of your personal opinion on my situation can we just do an ATIM or coop on Neilty too so the GC-related alts stop?--2friedeggs (talk) 18:06, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Also, We were both cooped together becuase we both ATIM'd eachother at the same time. I don't think you understand how fast everything happened.--2friedeggs (talk) 18:11, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Coop is for general conflict resolution; we'll soon have votes open up and then we can finish this one up. -- Techpriest (talk) 18:18, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Nice to see the elephant in the room being brought up in the spotlight. HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:37, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I just want to retire in peace without being defamed. 17:38, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Trust me, after the last 20 minutes you just might get that regardless of what happens to me.--2friedeggs (talk) 18:14, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm talking about Neilty even though a lot of people agree that you really need a long break. HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:39, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * When GC mentioned a lot of those accounts are Neil it really started to get me to think.--2friedeggs (talk) 17:43, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * An indef ban for abusing sysop powers seems a bit too much. Let's see how a sysoprevoke goes. HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:47, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I agree with Hendrick-we should be content with sysoprevoking eggs for now. I would certainly be okay with Neil being blocked though.
 * Also, I would like to praise Techpriest for her excellent analysis of this case, even if we disagree on solutions.-Flandres (talk) 18:17, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Pretty gross that you said you had no grudge and then write paragraphs trying to get me indeffed for pointing out RW corruption. I have edited on many many pages, the vast majority of edits accepted. And conceded on half of the pages you reference. The question of the coop is whether techpriest's buddy GC has abused either interaction or his sysop position, and he has.   if you're going to be nasty, i'll mention I came across an account called 'techpriest' on Kiwifarms while randomly browsing.  Don't know if it's you, but there should be nobody in a moderator position who uses kiwifarms.  So far the majority of people commenting have issues with GC's behaviour, which this coop is about Neiltyson1fan (talk) 17:47, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Ahem. HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:49, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Kiwifarms was created as a place to abuse an autistic person, so I would question the morality of a mod making morality argument to try to indef me Neiltyson1fan (talk) 17:51, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Meet the Techpriests of the Adeptus Mechanicus. It's not exactly an uncommon username, Warhammer 40k is fairly popular. I don't have a Kiwifarms account. Bragging about your edit count in mainspace is not exactly something that's helped users who disrupt the community in the past stay on the site. And no, I want you indeffed for a combination of attempted page ownership with content that you have in part a conflict of interest on, being a creep, attempted inflammation of discussions and attempting to sysop shop. These are all facts I have linked proof of or are on full display in this case. -- Techpriest (talk) 17:54, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Seems you abuse not only coops but also the no insult rule Neiltyson1fan (talk) 18:07, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Holy crap the wealth of information this timeline leaves out
[https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=RationalWiki_talk:All_things_in_moderation&oldid=2467595 GC and I ATIM's eachother at the same time essentially and LGM merged it. LGM blocked both of us so he could coop us then unblocked us for the coop] My "inflammatory comment" was telling GC he needs a break if he can't find a reason to contribute. When LGM told GC to take it easy he asked LGM to never contact him again. I do suspect some bias due to GC's status on the wiki which I accepted long ago but this is particularly egregious. I don't care about GC anymore since I realized he's likely on edge because of Neilty harassing him for months now. Personally I feel caught up in that now. But if you're going to find a reason to ban me do it right and without omitting things please. I don't remember what started my spat with GC weeks ago and I don't even want to remember.--2friedeggs (talk) 18:22, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Small thing, LGM is a woman. Anyway, I mostly looked into this from the perspective of what actually occured as an inciting incident, hence why I've left some things out. I sorta assumed that was the reason why GC got a short block; LGM usually doesn't block people out of mere anger. I don't really think there's a reason to ban you anymore, sysoprevoke is still something I'd recommend. I consider the comment inflammatory because it's basically telling a person who left the site in an attempt to not get angry at you that he can better stay away. The second part is the "never change" stuff; it just comes across as pointlessly aggressive. -- Techpriest (talk) 18:32, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * My bad, I didn't know she was. Anyways I read the folder. Nice to hear I don't have the mental capacity to use the mop. After having more information and talking to people I started to feel a little more sympathetic to GC. At first I thought he was mad at a legion of editors out to get him (I knew I was angering him I just didn't know why he assumed I was out to get him and why he was getting so mad until the recent events). Turns out it was me arguing with him while an Incel was making accounts to harass him. The never change comment was meant to express resignation but I could see how it comes across that way in hindsight.


 * He's still got a spicy tongue--2friedeggs (talk) 18:44, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Neilty was those harassment accounts? I... well this is embarrassing, I had no idea who they were. 18:50, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm 95 percent sure it's him because of the IPs on my talk page sucking up to me after you blocked yourself, you bringing Neil on my talk page up in ATIM, Hendrick bringing something up on Discord and the fact they got worse after my first talk with him a few weeks ago. But hey, I just want it out in the air It's probably him. Just take a look at the way he talks to you in the DMs I and Hendrick posted. I don't have any concrete evidence but I really started to think about it after you brought up Neil and I's Discord yesterday in ATIM and I misinterpreted your message to mean the BoNs--2friedeggs (talk) 18:55, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I did mean the BoNs. Most of this is news to me. I actually had no idea he was this horrible. 18:59, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I assumed you mean the IP that wanted to add me on Discord but after you left other BoNs appeared it was surreal to watch. Former is him, very likely latter is him--2friedeggs (talk) 19:17, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * wait, Neilty was behind those alts? I thought he was actually calm. I’m very disappointed. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 18:57, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * My apologies for that, I was on break from work and the first thought that went through my head was "jesus fuck, you are ALL fucking children". Doesn't make for the nicest conversations, but yeah. I would like to note that I do think you can still improve. -- Techpriest (talk) 21:35, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Someone propose the vote categories before this gets larger

 * Sysoprevoke for 2friedeggs
 * Sysoprevoke for GrammarCommie
 * Sysoprevoke for Neiltyson1fan
 * Interaction ban between 2friedeggs and GrammarCommie
 * 3.14 week ban for Neiltyson1fan
 * 3.14 month ban for Neiltyson1fan
 * Permaban for Neiltyson1fan

Feel free to add more. HendrickTheGross (talk) 18:36, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * As a reminder, the actual vote should not start until 24 hours after the first posting. Bongolian (talk) 18:41, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Broadest suggestion would put that at 03:09, 6 July 2022 (UTC). (for anyone curious why I do this; there's a widget you can enable that converts these timestamps to an indicator on how far away they are and converts it to your preferred timezone). -- Techpriest (talk) 18:53, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

I'm not behind the alts
I asked GeeJay to ask the server admin to check who the alts are, they also started way before I was active here. Altho the attempt to ban me one person is doing even tho I did nothing wrong is strange. like I literally did nothing wrong lol. Ah well so is life Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Alts or not you might wanna turn off that script and see the entire coop friend--2friedeggs (talk) 19:07, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm good but if they're now accusing me of using alts just point out I asked geejay to ask the server admin who that was from, it's on geejays page. Geejay and I aren't really on horrible terms anymore Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:10, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Oh no lol you have no idea do you people are not happy with you--2friedeggs (talk) 19:14, 5 July 2022 (UTC)


 * We do not have checkuser here and any attempt to get around that will result in a permanent ban.
 * Do not do this. The "server admin" cannot and will not respond to this.
 * —cosmikdebris talk stalk 19:10, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * it aint me -shrug- my conscious is clear Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:11, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * The only times I use IPs are the IPs listed on my talk page, which is just a regular home ipv6 subnet. and they didn't engage in abuse or whatever so Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:18, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I think if the discord crowd just ends up banning everyone harshest on corruption to avoid having to talk about GC, GC will continue to be an issue for RW, and my presence or not has no impact on that. They're really dying on their own hill there if they 'win' it Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:19, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Also if they ban me because they don't like me, which was essentially techpriests argument, that sets a bad precedent for RW, just in terms of coops. Although I'm not particularly attached to this place and would respect whatever decision.  Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:25, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * There is no bad precedent, just a huge, huge mess and damaged relations between users that might take a long, long time to clean up so pat yourself on the back for that one.--2friedeggs (talk) 19:27, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Well if they do go on random and unprecedented bans, someone finish up this article i made pretty pls, if anyone finds it interesting Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:30, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * This one https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Draft:Serotonin_Hypothesis Serotonin hypothesis Neiltyson1fan (talk) 19:31, 5 July 2022 (UTC)


 * Here, https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/User_talk:GeeJayK GeeJay agrees with me that the alts are not me and claims to know who it is, so rather than allowing techpriest to use me as a scapegoat for GCs abuse of moderatorship, (because I did nothing wrong lol) one could just look at the nginx logs and use those to deal with the spammer, not special:checkuser as it doesn't exist as someone pointed out Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:07, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Surprising if true oops either way getting some rest--2friedeggs (talk) 20:20, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yea get some rest, you didn't do anything wrong. The matter in this discussion, way exceeds you or I: example https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:Chicken_coop/Archive129#Sysoprevoke, however much they wish to kick the can down the road Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:27, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Very good editors have also tried to permaban GC before in coop for his abusive behaviour everyone is well familiar with, (also I don't see you or I in those coops), and as usual the Discord crowd bailed him out in this link as well. https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/RationalWiki:Chicken_coop/Archive129#Permaban Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:32, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * (EC) To be 100% fair, I don't think there's enough evidence that these socks are Neiltyson1fan, just like there was no evidence that I was user "Me" over a year ago. I also don't see these screenshots as a doxxing attempt. Furthermore, permaban for a relatively veteran user than was never cooped before is a bit of an overkill to me. GeeJayK (talk) 20:37, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * They aren't mine, I don't have the time or interest in that. I don't even pay for a VPN, if RW is serious about spam and not lying to scapegoat for longterm mod issues, they need to ask a server admin to check the nginx logs everytime the spammer comes here, or (as they have full legal authority to do), get a server admin who will Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:40, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * There are some VPNS that are (restricted but) free. HendrickTheGross (talk) 20:42, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Great, I am not the spammer. That RW has no interest in figuring it out or dealing with the issue, is evidence of structural issues that looking for scapegoats will not solve Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:43, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Go through the nginx logs, look for patterns in ISP or VPN behaviour for the times they inflame drama, etc. Don't make up stuff, as I take false accusations very seriously Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:47, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Where? HendrickTheGross (talk) 20:48, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

This Coop is about an interaction ban and interactions btw 2 people, and possible sysop revoke if sysop abuse occurred
2fried and GC, I was only notified of todays coop today

The response, as in previous coops, is to try to scapegoat, blame and falsely insinuate to kick a can down the road, that can being GC's patently abusive behaviour at RW, which now... at least 4 people have attested to, many using the word "abuse" or variations thereof. These are all in GC's edit history in RW, should anyone actually hold people to account Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:54, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

Earlier quote "Yeah, I support it. The issue with GC is really one with toxic masculinity, honestly...constantly yelling and jeering at everyone he does not like, then going into horrible detail about self-harm in order to scare people into silence. Quite abusive behavior."

- User:AprilIsTrying

The above is all over the logs and no one here has any good evidence of anyone here doing anything close to what GC does with both sysop and regular interactions. Using sysop to desysop people without going to ATIM, which is breaking one of the only rules of sysop there is to break. It makes editing this place not fun Should RW Discord crowd choose not to Sanction GC yet again in a coop, they will be actively covering for abusive behaviour from GC and letting it go on. If they see "oh it's all about neilty or 2fried", check the coops involving GC. I am not in those nor is 2fried. (i've actually never been in a coop) But GC is, in many, and just because he mods the Discord support, doesn't mean corruption should continue Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:56, 5 July 2022 (UTC)

The RW discord moderatorship should also be dissolved in favor of mature people who can lead the wiki Neiltyson1fan (talk) 20:59, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * This is not about Discord. Tangential arguments or evidence about what happened on Discord are irrelevant here. Bongolian (talk) 21:12, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If GC mods the support discord and gets off the hook every time from people in that discord, of course it's relevant. I'm just an editor with my own wikis, it doesn't matter what happens to me on RW, what matters is how corruption occurs at RW.  Neiltyson1fan (talk) 21:20, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I should be clear that none of this actually addresses the reasons why I think you should be indefinietly banned and you've so far never actually engaged with that part. -- Techpriest (talk) 21:24, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Letting GC keep sysop would in fact be covering for an abuser, as well as deleting related comments. As the subject of the coop is about GCs abuse of moderatorship (and direct abuse of other people) and you keep trying to deflect and keep voting him to stay in power. So that's why I would rather not talk to you.Neiltyson1fan (talk) 21:33, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Fun fact about your whole persecution complex, but uh 2friedeggs will likely be fine outside of a sysoprevoke (which he may not even end up getting). He's admitted that his behavior was past the mark of acceptability and that it may have launched a shitstorm he did not intent and is actually receptive to improving his behavior. You meanwhile have basically from the start been crowing on and on about how corrupt the site is. Like, c'mon man, look at what you're doing here in this section. You're citing a situation that GC literally apologized for doing (which was handled prior) as proof that he should be banned. Hell, the entire reason you LANCBed the site initially was because you couldn't sollicit meatpuppets off-site for the specific incident AprilIsTrying referred to and I shat on your attempts to be a creep to me. Feel free to take as much offense as you think is warranted, but this entire thing comes more across as you being a rancorous asshole who can't let go of shit that ATIM resolved months ago. -- Techpriest (talk) 21:48, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Your moderatorship issues (sysops abusing and/or discouraging active editors) will continue beyond trying or actually banning myself. And that is the topic of the coop you are still not addressing.  Gross. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 22:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * What's with this Discord stuff? Is there a server I'm not aware of, because people hardly use the support chat or the saloon one. 01:08, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Neiltyson1fan accused me of conspiring in DMs, then in the support chat, then it was the fact that I'm staff in the support chat, now it's that people are defending me at all, even in the most minor way. Frankly, I'm shocked at this level of obsession from someone I barely care about. 01:48, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Techpriest has diligently summarised everything well
This summary makes sense and his proposal for dealing with GC, eggs and neilty are sensible. Much of the rest here is predictable noise (especially the serial commentators and the dubious defence so far). Awaiting the voting. Shabi DOO  21:39, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * How polite of you. You were able to give your opinion involving me without telling me to screw off this time but I know it colors your post here.--2friedeggs (talk) 06:54, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * For the record, Andrew & leftymario & Aprilstrying are correct about what the issue is, not techpriest. techpriest is proposing further extreme misuse of moderatorship as GC has already been politely told to stop abusing other people many times Neiltyson1fan (talk) 21:41, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * "Welcome to RW Discord, where we excuse abusers and make up things about active editors" --Discord "support" group fans Neiltyson1fan (talk) 21:42, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If everyone who currently has an issue with GC left RW entirely, you'll still have the exact same issues RE mods abusing power, as when you all came in here. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 21:46, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Deal with your Discord issues on Discord. We've already had this discussion before. Not all mods or Sysops are on Discord. Bongolian (talk) 21:49, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm not in the RW Discord. leftymario & Aprilstrying & myself have stated we've received direct abuse from GC, and for some on here with the mods watching. What is your solution?  Ban half the complaintees and give GC a little talk and not address he mods the support Discord, that a repeated abuser mods the discord and has sysop?   Neiltyson1fan (talk) 21:51, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * The support chat is not an official chatroom as has been made abundantly clear several goddamn times by now. The sole reason it even became relevant is because you went screeching straight out of the gate that it's a cabal that defends GC at all costs. (Which uh, no, it's really not. The current coop case hasn't even shown up there as a discussion point, not that it matters.) -- Techpriest (talk) 22:04, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * No sane wiki would keep an abuser in moderatorship positon for a support chat or in sysop. That is what the coop is about.  Banning me does not solve that issue and the issue will keep getting coops from other people is my guess (it already has multiple  times without me, including  this time),  scapegoating https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scapegoating Neiltyson1fan (talk) 22:07, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Your big proof of this is USHistoryAnalyzer, a conservapedia kiddo, but sure, go off. -- Techpriest (talk) 22:13, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Um...Neilty, I never said I received direct abuse from GC? I just said I read some of his previous messages and expressed my concern about it, since it was an example of toxic masculinity. I am aware he apologized.--A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 22:16, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'm glad you ackowledge he's abused people. Anyone just needs to go through the edit history of techpriest and GC to know the former is a wikilawyer who does not actually do anything that great for the wiki, and the latter an abuser   For now, I will scramble my password as moderatorship has shown they do not want to abide by RWs commitment to not indeffing users who were in good standing before interjecting in a coop.  I will return in a few years after this coalition inevitably falls due to harbouring at least one abuser of editors.  And until then not touch the wiki, just the other wikis I edit Neiltyson1fan (talk) 22:20, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * ...UShistoryanalyzer got banned for excessively annoying the rest of the site with rote shite as well as broadly unhelpful and disruptive trolling. The coop case you linked wasn't even the one he got banned in. Did you like... even read the archive you linked before. USha is an editor who is kind of a poster child for "bad faith editor" to the point where he's been casually cited as a shorthand for one in other cases where we have right wing trolls. -- Techpriest (talk) 22:30, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * IIRC he was also on payroll--2friedeggs (talk) 06:54, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Hey Neiltyson1fan, try another tactic than being combative. You're not being particularly persuasive. 01:54, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * To be fair he's being less combative than GC--2friedeggs (talk) 14:52, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Can we vote so I can retire for good?
Please? 22:50, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yes, please, let us get to the point already. Enough rambling.--<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 22:56, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Per policy, vote can’t begin for 24 hours, which is still 243 minutes away. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 23:06, 5 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Used to be 48 hours lol. 01:02, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If Andrew5 says no, then we should start the vote. 01:55, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I mean, Neil already made a fool of himself, so… HendrickTheGross (talk) 02:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

It's been more than 24 hours. Someone can start the vote now. Bongolian (talk) 04:05, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I had a nice little vacation, enjoyed some BBQ, got hired for a new job, things are going pretty good over here. Time to check back in with Rationwiki... WHAT THE HELL  05:04, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Vote
Because the week is expiring, the vote was set up a 04:37 July 6, so can be closed anytime after 04:37 July 13. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 03:25, 13 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Put an end to this nonsense already. 71.208.x.x (talk) 05:02, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) The cabal that punishes least punishes best. We can't do nothing, but an Iban is the obvious minimum.  05:09, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 05:42, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 1) --<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 06:30, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) Bongolian (talk) 06:39, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) Even the two affected users have said they would be content with it.-Flandres (talk) 06:46, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) LongStylus (talk) 06:52, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) Don't mind.--2friedeggs (talk) 06:57, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 6) just... an obvious improvement. -- Techpriest (talk) 07:21, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 7) Bob"Life is short and (insert adjective)" 08:24, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 8) BumblingBuffoon (talk) 09:41, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 9) No brainer Shabi  DOO  10:20, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 10) For the same reason as with Plutocow; this shit is draining, is actually stressful for people and needs to stop. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:36, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 11) Please. 12:58, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 12) Of course. Spud (talk) 13:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 13) No brainer. —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 14) Terminate it. HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:38, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 15) Vomitorium (talk) 21:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 16) Kauri0.o (talk) 23:13, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 17) As a minimum. Still catching up on the rest. ℕoir LeSable (talk) 15:22, 9 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Shoud have been done some time ago Shabi DOO  10:20, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) I thought about it, and I realized an editor with 2 active ibans also shouldn’t be a sysop. He clearly can’t get along with other editors. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:40, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) Per above. Spud (talk) 13:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) --<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 14:16, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 6) Doesn't seem like this user should be given tools either. 15:02, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 7) Bongolian (talk) 16:17, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 8) User needs to learn how to de-escalate conflicts better before I trust them with the tools. They can get them back later down the line if improvement is shown. -- Techpriest (talk) 16:19, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 9) Let's see if this shall work over a ban. HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:38, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 10) <font color="#00abcb">𝒮𝑒𝓇𝑒𝓃𝑒   talk  17:37, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 11) LongStylus (talk) 19:05, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 12) Remarkable as it may seem, Andrew makes a good point.-Flandres (talk) 19:11, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 13) A troubled history that keeps growing. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 19:37, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 14) Has too often shown a lack of restraint. Vomitorium (talk) 21:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 22:05, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 1) Kauri0.o (talk) 23:12, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Goat

 * 1) I want to find a reason to avoid this but I can't seem to find it...  16:21, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) Beyond my scope of knowledge, I only knew about this guy a few weeks ago.  I'm not so sure what any of his issues are with me, but I've never been mean towards him and wish him the best, that's the truth Neiltyson1fan (talk) 17:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I'll give you an explanation since we seemed to be getting along. I believe you pulled a fast one on me and this whole issue and vote could have been avoided if you left me be during my first spat with GC. Your creepy DMs to Techpriest left a sour taste in my mouth, and I doubt GC is making those alts himself to fuel a persecution complex. From everyone's replies to you every single little thing you have told me has more to the story.--2friedeggs (talk) 17:10, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Tired of just giving GC a slap on the hand Shabi  DOO  10:20, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) Not the first time GC has abused sysop powers. GC has permablocked me and wheel warred over it on January 8, and plenty of other times is way too over aggressive. GC has been given warnings they can’t continue like this and yet refuses to change their ways. At some point, they’re are consequences for your actions. This is the final straw. GC needs to be sysoprevoked. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:38, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) --<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 14:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) Aggressively abused them in spite of multiple warnings esp being told off multiple times for edit warring, has no intent to contribute to mainspace, can still undo edits. General mental state doesn't inspire much confidence that he can go longer with sysop tools despite multiple chances and years for improvement. 15:00, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) Instigator--2friedeggs (talk) 15:05, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * >_> Ok buddy. No asked you to stick your nose into a mostly civil talkpage discussion. But sure, I "instigated". 15:41, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * "Stick your nose" bro...---2friedeggs (talk) 16:58, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 1) Let's see how this shall work. HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:45, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) Like I said earlier I agree with leftymario on this, altho I guess he took a different angle or something, not sure.  Neiltyson1fan (talk) 17:01, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) <font color="#00abcb">𝒮𝑒𝓇𝑒𝓃𝑒   talk  17:37, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) He's LANCB, so this is a given? BumblingBuffoon (talk) 19:38, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) I will miss the popcorn. Kauri0.o (talk) 23:12, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

Nay

 * 1) Overkill. 11:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) Feels a tad overkill. Instead, I support a final warning; if GC fucks with the sysop bit of someone again, he can be in sysoprevoke. -- Techpriest (talk) 16:18, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Hasnt GC gotten enough final warnings? Andrew5 mobile (talk) 22:21, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * We haven't ever given one as far as I'm aware. -- Techpriest (talk) 21:27, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Honestly it's amazing to see how he had so many close calls he was warned for and yet never formally given a final warning, to the point where, to me, it sounds like he's un-sysoprevokable (as in, he can do whatever and no one will desysop him), and we should try to change that. This exchange back on February 12 was a complete abuse of sysop power, as was this incident on July 8. GC's lack of temperment is damning in other ways, as seen in this edit which led to a whole ATIM, in which GC was spared from a pi week block by one vote (RationalWiki talk:All things in moderation/Archive54) and there has always been this theme of too much leniency being extended. It's probably time we stop with that. In RationalWiki:Chicken coop/Archive129, GC would've had a penalty vote had USHA not been whiny as usual. Now, given the vote is 10-6, it looks like it's going to pass (I assume sysoprevoke only needs 50%+1?) Andrew5 (talk) 21:48, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 1) Bongolian (talk) 16:19, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) Ariel31459 (talk) 22:05, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) Bro seriously needs to cut it out with the random de-sysopping though.  22:06, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Goat

 * I lean yea because it seems like it's often "next time", but I don't want to swing this outcome, since some of the cast yea votes seem to be continuations of conflicts, not resolutions. Vomitorium (talk) 21:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * GC repeatedly fucks around with sysop, and never stops when asked. We always say “last chance” but they never get one. In March, they desyssoped and blocked Plutocow just to fix a reply on Pluto’s talk page. That’s egregious. GC lacks temperament to be a sysop here, and is very uncivil. GrammarCommie is unwilling to compromise and as such, should not be a sysop here. GrammarCommie has also pledged to LANCB and has since violated it. There isn’t a reason why GC should be a sysop anymore. Plenty of people have been sysoprevoked for less, and honestly, we don’t need vandal/spam catchers who are incredibly hostile when we have Plutocow and Cosmikdebris who do just as good of a job without making this a toxic hellhold. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 16:08, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Makes you wonder how much of what Neil said is correct about GC getting covered--2friedeggs (talk) 16:30, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2friedeggs, please stop ruining my cause. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 18:49, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Why did you call Neil "Incredibly Toxic" but not GC lol--2friedeggs (talk) 11:22, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If I'm being "covered", this would be the first I've heard of it. Seriously, knock off the conspiracy shit. 18:21, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I spent awhile pondering why you got away with so much toxicity, vitrol and mop abuse compared to others including myself. I don't mean that in a sense that there's a cabal I mean people just feel more inclined to cover you when you're active on site, part of the old guard and have a stellar history of site contributions, spam squashing among other things.--2friedeggs (talk) 00:15, 8 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Minimum required Shabi  DOO  10:21, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) --<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 14:17, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) The guy can't even use the preview button for god's sake. 15:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) -Flandres (talk) 19:13, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 6) Vomitorium (talk) 21:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 7) Ok then. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 22:26, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Nay
i’m pretty sure the editor already doesn’t have sysop so…don’t see the purpose. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:38, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Actually.. 13:06, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Sounds like this voat belongs in goat. 15:36, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Goat

 * 1) I can't imagine how fun it'd have been to deal with Neil coops had they had sysop to begin with. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 19:39, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Caused too much trouble, highly inappropriate behavior in Discord dms, but will support shorter blocks. 05:43, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) I am slightly perturbed by them--<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 06:30, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) At least.-Flandres (talk) 06:47, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) Hate-boner for GC, maker of GC Alts, DMs show GC abuse. GC says he barely cares but pretty sure this guy is why he's so on edge as a whole.--2friedeggs (talk) 07:00, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) Only if nothing longer manages to pass. -- Techpriest (talk) 07:27, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 6) Have been avoiding the rest of the coop since I don't want to run foul of my iban, but this guy seems the kind of person who uses the wiki primarily to advance personal grudges, which is not the kind of person who should be allowed on the wiki. We should send them the message that their behavior is unacceptable, at least. Plutocow (talk) 07:28, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 7) Would prefer a perma. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 09:39, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 8) No brainer Shabi  DOO  10:20, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 9) Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:35, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 10) —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 11) Seems for the best.  22:08, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Only if nothing longer manages to pass. -- Techpriest (talk) 07:28, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) Would prefer perma from what I've seen over the last month. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 09:37, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) What he did was severe. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:35, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) Just in case...-Flandres (talk) 19:14, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 6) Seems for the best. 22:09, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Aye

 * 1) Hes a creep, he's engaged in editor harassment, he attempted to doxx a member he has beef with (something which is explicitly against the CS), he is incapable of letting go of arguments, he's obsessive with pages and other users and he thinks that everyone who doesn't like him is a cabal. He already self-exiled once before and the only difference between back then and his current return is how much more obviously spiteful he's become (...Raven also did that for anyone missing that parallel). For all of those reasons, I strongly recommend a permanent for neiltyson1fan. -- Techpriest (talk) 07:26, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * What is the evidence for attempted doxxing? Bongolian (talk) 07:30, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * See discord screenshots above posted by 2friedeggs; he tried to get GCs age from 2friedeggs, seemingly to try to insinuate that he's underage. The ones posted by Hendrick also make it rather clear that he wanted to use this coop case to get GC banned from the site, which is attempting to game the mob (see the warning up above about not doing that). -- Techpriest (talk) 10:14, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * A rationalwiki corporate board members statment here, https://archive.ph/4K8vd makes techpriests statement with respect to content on computer screenshots a lie. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:47, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * The board isn't the ultimate arbiter of truth for this site. That's neither their job, nor the point. GJK disagrees with me, that's fine. -- Techpriest (talk) 20:01, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 1) Tries to claim the victim whenever called out for something, generally strange behaviour when it comes to personal info, persists when told to stop asking for personal info by multiple users. Takes Kiwifarms more seriously than a toilet should be. I don't think the future is going to bring many good things from Neil, on this wiki at least. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 09:36, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 2) No brainer Shabi  DOO  10:20, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 3) Obviously just here to be a dick. Spud (talk) 13:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 4) --<font color="55CDFC">A <font color="Pink">p <font color="EBECF0">r <font color="Pink">i <font color="55CDFC">l Chat? 14:16, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 5) I'm very tired of seeing walls of text consisting of nothing but whining and drama. —cosmikdebris talk stalk 14:59, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 6) Nah I'm not opposed at all either to this. 15:04, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 7) Even bigger instigator--2friedeggs (talk) 15:08, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 8) Bongolian (talk) 16:20, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 9) Failed to convince people about random discord drama, but proceeded to build a "personal" relationship in a weird manner. Ouch. HendrickTheGross (talk) 16:45, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 10) See ya. Plutocow (talk) 17:11, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 11) LongStylus (talk) 18:57, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 12) As I said the last time Neil was at the center of a bunch of wikidrama, there is no reason to think Neil will change his behavior. He usually blames any controversy he causes on an imaginary conspiracy of editors who hate him, tries to redirect the conversation toward other users when his problems are being discussed, and largely defines his presence here with a vendetta he obsessively pursues. We've dealt with these types before.-Flandres (talk) 19:26, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 13) Incredibly toxic. Vomitorium (talk) 21:03, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 14) I will miss the popcorn. Also, I'm certain he was behind some BON's. Same editing style; format, language, non-contributions taking ten edits per paragraph... Kauri0.o (talk) 23:11, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 15) The legal threat below has been enough for me. Neil is unable to listen or cooperate, and is trying to hold a witchhunt against GC. He's unable to let anything go, and lacks maturity. The attempted doxxing is also grounds for an indef ban on it's own, as shown in a recent ATIM case. Honestly, Neil should've done what he did last time there was a GC ATIM case which was only comment once, though he then made around a dozen typo fixes, which is annoying and got him temporarily vandal binned . Andrew5 (talk) 20:05, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * 16) Not totally convinced it was a true doxxing attempt but I feel uncomfortable enough with those exchanges to vote for yeeting this user. 02:30, 12 July 2022 (UTC)

Nay
Total dick, but I'd need to see a more prolonged problem before I'd vote to perma. Maybe could get his act together. 22:11, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If you check the guy's talk page, a year ago, he tried to get a user permablocked over a typo. 15:07, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * This one? HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:56, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yeah. The paragraph after paragraph of complete ranting and baseless bad faith assumptions is quite a read. 19:24, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I think Neilty is currently unable to control their temper, but i abstained because he might change in a few years. Not gonna matter though. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 19:28, 7 July 2022 (UTC)


 * 1) The actions of this person do not hold a candle to the shenanigans pulled off by Oxyaena and Dyksliver. The shit those two were getting away with was for a while causing me to seriously think they were of direct relation to Trent Toulouse, or that they had some kind of serious blackmail materials on someone of importance at the site. Unless I am missing something here, this proposed permaban is ridiculous. 71.208.x.x (talk) 14:06, 8 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Excuse me, who is Dyksliver? Is it the same as ? (User:Arthur on Uncyclopedia.) Also, I will say we permabanned other users for far less: USHA and Unclescrooge were banned for just trolling and transphobia, Wyzzard for uploading just one super bad image, and LTEC was also permabanned for one single dox threat plus transphobia. Here we have more then a threat, but an actual doxxing attempt, as well as refusing to budge. I wasn't around when GR was permabanned, but this seems similar from what I heard and saw. Andrew5 (talk) 21:19, 10 July 2022 (UTC)
 * WHOAAAA. Hang on, he made a doxxing attempt? If someone can show me the goods, that changes everything for me, and I’ll have to change my vote. 01:50, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
 * per the logs linked here he seemed to have been fishing around for my personal information. 13:13, 11 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Here is some of the attempted doxxing. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 17:52, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

Goat

 * I hate voting for permaban, but what he did was egregious, so abstain. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 12:35, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Made up my mind. Andrew5 (talk) 20:05, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Isn't it wonderful that this guy tried to join a coop I made originally to stop GC and 2friedeggs from yelling at each other only for the eggs to be on his face? 15:10, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Isn't it wonderful when you realize a fast one was pulled on you just and then a day later you're about to lose your mop?--2friedeggs (talk) 15:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Well you were told off multiple times for your interactions with people. You probably shouldn't have been too surprised for poking people too much. Anyhow I was talkin about Neiltysonfan1 or whatever. 15:17, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Yeah maybe I should just let people have the last word more often. Unfortunately the people voting yes have obviously not seen the past incidents and the attitude I generally have to deal with. Pluto's probably the incident I regret most. Everything else was a complete farce.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:29, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Well you can get your tools back. I've contributed to wikis for years without sysop tools due to having some attitude issues back in my teen years. Unfortunately they don't have benefit of witnessing past behavior but you can still move forward. 15:37, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * It's not really the fact I'm losing sysop tools that bothers me and I was going to figure out how to appeal it anyways if I could. It's that almost every issue in the past escalated over small edit disputes because I was accused of edit warring before I accused the other person. It's really funny how that works isn't it? I make an edit, other person keeps trying to revert it, I get accused of edit warring. People here can be hypocrites sometimes. Guarantee you that's how I get blocked next from how I've seen on this site the last 6 months.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:43, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * To prevent an edit war, just remember the 3RR: If you try to make an edit 3 times or more and someone reverts it the first 2 times, don't try to put it back in the third time. Instead, I'd suggest taking to the talkpage at that point. -- Techpriest (talk) 16:15, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Life works in mysterious ways. -- Techpriest (talk) 16:14, 6 July 2022 (UTC)

Neil's defense

 * Yea I mean here's the thing, I was asked to comment on this coop, and was in good standing before. I feel if people wanted to do this they should have done before that, but they didn't, so I can only assume a large part of this was not particularly mature.  Emotions aren't the best thing to go on always as far as moderation.  But in general I appreciate this wiki and I think the administrators should choose who they want on it.  Therefore I will respect any decision.  Wikis can be contentious, so it makes perfect sense that some people get banned.  I appreciated my 5 years on RationalWiki and I wish the few people the best, including leftymario, bongo, geejay, bongolian who first gave me mop (i think?), and many others.   However, given I am not the subject of this coop I wish this wiki the best in sorting out it's issues.  As far as the accusations, I think that GeeJay analysis halfway through the page are correct.  I also think the ban was made for no reason, but like I said that's standard wiki stuff.  Best of luck everyone and no hard feelings, but I'll be leaving regardless of decisions.  Keep up the good work, I've always liked RationalWiki and it was an inspiration to start Tome and various other wikis Neiltyson1fan (talk) 16:56, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Wait wut? OK then. Good luck on your journeys I guess. HendrickTheGross (talk) 17:00, 6 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Perchance, Neil, you shouldn't have spuriously accused others of misbehaving offsite while you were engaging in inappropriate behavior offsite. Just a thought. 12:10, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I do not know what you are referring to. If you are referring to the accusations techpriest makes against the comments contained in a Discord screenshot by multiple Disord users, a RationalWiki corporate board member already stated everyone who made that accusation, along with techpriest is lying https://archive.ph/4K8vd   Techpriest and yourself are known Rationalwiki bullies, with Techpriest having bullied Duce, for example, once before.  Your direct abuses of others on this site are well documented on archive sites, I took that liberty yesterday.  I am doing RW a favor by not linking them as they contain graphic material from you, but anyone can see them by visiting archive.org and archive.is and browsing the RationalWiki archives Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:15, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * That's not how lying works. That another peer doesn't view evidence given as being wrong does not mean that it discounts every other peer who disagrees with them, that's how a jury typically works. Gee's disagreement is no evidence that Techpriest is a liar, you're talking nonsense. BumblingBuffoon (talk) 17:35, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * All of that aside, as an owner of wikis, I already stated I perfectly understand site staff wanting to ban anyone for any reason or not reason at all. As websites are not public utitlies. They are not.  So I do not mind them banning myself or anyone else for any reason.  As this is literally just a wiki, and a wiki with good content from many individuals over years, that hopefully is properly maintained. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:21, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If you acknowledge that you are not wanted here, what is with the arguing still continuing? HendrickTheGross (talk) 14:32, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * It is fact that a current Rationwiki corporate board member said this, https://archive.ph/4K8vd and so it is not true that the actual legal staff as a whole agrees with techpriest or even that I should be gone. I said I am fine leaving because if those same administrators leave it to the will of the RW users, then I respect that, and I anticipate that to happen as the users do not care about RW bullying, and that is the reason the wiki has the problem it has. This is an issue RW has to work out on it's own.  I think it can.  You all can do it. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 14:35, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * What bullying you are getting exactly what you want look at the vote above--2friedeggs (talk) 14:51, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * And are you gonna take another 10 edits to write a short reply? 14:56, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I have no issue with leftygreen, who mostly shares my opinion on what I cam here for, this comment is not directed at leftymario. I will repeat it is fact that a current Rationwiki corporate board member said this, https://archive.ph/4K8vd, and I am not interested in any more goading.  Any further instances of illegal behaviour towards me will be dealt with legally and appropriately to individual users, as sites in general have safe harbour.  I am not linking all my opinions.  That is all. Neiltyson1fan (talk) 15:01, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Gonna sue everyone individually lol ok Karen get out of here already as for LGM 10 edits doesn't do my attention span justice sometimes I just got more to say than I thought I did.--2friedeggs (talk) 15:12, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * That's true, everyone takes sometimes more edits than one to one comment but Neiltysonfan1 's case is... Well... 15:23, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Just wanted to say that while I don't support the ban, I don't think is the way to go either. IMO there's no need to post that screencap more than once, for instance. GeeJayK (talk) 15:37, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * He's been bludgeoning since the discord DMs were released. HendrickTheGross (talk) 15:43, 7 July 2022 (UTC)


 * Isnt there a way to prevent him from spamming, though? Andrew5 mobile (talk) 15:57, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * There is. It's called the vandal bin. Also, I like how he isn't actually addressing the issue and instead pivoting like mad in order to try to pretend he has the high ground. The dude implies he wanted to doxx me, tried engage mod corruption, and engaged in an attempt to push me off the site over personal grudges on his part. He's a fucking certifiable in his behavior and fucking morally bankrupt. 17:52, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Probably assumed shying away blushing would be a very bad look for him, especially if he did want to actually pursue legal action or if he ran other wikis.--2friedeggs (talk) 20:18, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * (would it be bad faith to bring up that I threw him in the vandal bin for spamming before and that ATIM at the time elected to remove it?) -- Techpriest (talk) 19:58, 7 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Also, I'd just like to note that making legal threats against editors is an actual fast-track to an indefinite ban. As in, it's something that warrants bypassing the regular voting process. (Not doing it rn since it'll probably end up being unnecessary, but yeah...) -- Techpriest (talk) 20:01, 7 July 2022 (UTC)

But the question remains, did Neil actually make a legal threat? To me it seems that the Any further instances of illegal behaviour towards me will be dealt with legally and appropriately to individual users, as sites in general have safe harbour. leans into legal threat territory, but I wouldn't jump to the fact that it is conclusively. Andrew5 (talk) 15:23, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * If it looks like a duck and smells like a duck... —cosmikdebris talk stalk 17:33, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * In general, indicating that you're gonna "follow-up behavior with legal complaints" is the suggestion that if the discussion continues, you're gonna bring out the lawyers. So yes, that would count as a legal threat. -- Techpriest (talk) 21:26, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I personally think he meant "legal" as in "RationalWiki rules" and not literal courts and whatnot. He's just trying to sound pretentious. 21:44, 9 July 2022 (UTC)
 * Given the seriousness of such a threat though, and given shit's happened before, I can understand being overly cautious about such things. ℕoir LeSable (talk) 04:30, 13 July 2022 (UTC)
 * I agree with Noir. If someone articulated something even vaguely resembling a legal threat, they should be banned. Now this vote is 17-1 to ban and the week is up, so when someone closes the coop; the first coop in half a year at that, then this legal threat discussion will become moot. Andrew5 mobile (talk) 11:14, 13 July 2022 (UTC)