RationalWiki talk:All things in moderation/Archive29

Request to get sysop back
I think I've improved substantially, and I think that my conduct during the latest dispute with Raven, including making peace and being civil with him, shows favor on my record. I hereby request to have sysop back, even if only to not feel left out considering how most active users have sysop. — Oxyaena Harass  10:33, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
 * That doesn't look like a sufficient reason to be granted sysop. Why should you be given it? Kiko4564 (talk) 15:34, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy, as recently as August 20, you called GR a "miserable piece of shit." (RationalWiki:Chicken coop/Archive108) Is it so hard for you to not resort to name calling? Bongolian (talk) 16:51, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
 * I made peace with Raven after that, and I have been relatively civil since then. and  can attest to that. — Oxyaena  Harass  20:26, 30 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Leaving Raven to his own devices ain't making peace in my book. 00:54, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Not this shit again. There was a vote on this only a month ago and you lost. AceModerator 03:02, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Don't you remember ranting and raving about how everyone were dicks and making a big flounce on Discord because you lost a vote? AceModerator 03:03, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Several people have changed their minds since then, and Ace, do you really need to be so unapproachable, for want of a better word? It's like every time you hear my name you instantly become hostile. — Oxyaena Harass  11:53, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I’m not being hostile. AceModerator 05:42, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I endorse Oxy getting sysop back. Oxy’s behavior has improved quite a bit, and I think the sanction has gone on long enough. 21:10, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I personally see her behavior as having stayed largely the same, and I can't help but mistrust her thirst for status. Also trying to put us through this process every. single.  month.  Does not speak to her maturity--Hastur! (talk)  21:11, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I genuinely think it’s less about power and more about feeling put out that everyone has sysop and she doesn’t. There’s a reason the user rights request page exists. 21:14, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * That's exactly it. — Oxyaena Harass  21:38, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy has definitely improved but I don't think the community is ready yet to give it back. I think a few more weeks without any serious conflicts and the community will agree to it. BTW Oxy, asking people every week to get it back will make some people vote against it. I'd recommend waiting four weeks or so. Shabi  DOO  21:39, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy last time you also said people had changed their minds and there needed to be a vote. You didn't get your way and had a huge fucking meltdown. That's why I do not endorse you getting your rights back - when things don't go your way you blame everyone else, quit multiple times, get really fucking abusive and the cycle restarts. AceModerator 21:56, 1 September 2020 (UTC)

My stance is known. Ronins sanctions and the assumption that she doesn't melt down again during a second vote, as per the last time this was brought up. 22:11, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Given the nature and seriousness of Oxyaena's misconduct as a sysop, I will continue opposing these requests until she admits what she did and we can talk about it with her losing her cool. Nutty Roux (talk) 22:46, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxyaena, I'd really recommend that you don't ask again until January at the earliest. Until then, keep your nose clean and walk away from trouble if you can. Spud (talk) 06:58, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I agree with Spud. Oxy, you voted for the change in community standards (RationalWiki talk:Community Standards/Archive21), which included civil discussion. Yet, you did not act civilly with regard to the GR dispute. Being uncivil can cause needless escalations and grief for people not initially involved. It's great that you are now at peace with GR, but not being a source of escalation in the first place shows greater maturity. Bongolian (talk) 07:18, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

Vote on Dysk
Since y'all need to vote on this, here goes. A couple of days ago, I got pissed at a few unnamed users here on this wiki, and decided to use the Tech powerz I had to suppress (a form of deletion) the Chicken Coop. Obviously this was a somewhat inappropriate way to act under the circumstances, thankfully around an hour later this page was restored by LGM, and normal business resumed. Now for deciding on the sanction I get for this, I have arranged a vote below. 21:20, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Remove tech, and sysoprevoke

 * 1) I don't think Dysk should get tech rights considering the impulsive actions. Sysop rights are more negotiable but I'm not opposed restoring rights at the sysop level sooner than tech. What's making me hesitate was that Dysk did not use a delete action properly (sysops can delete pages; if Dysk used tech powers to delete and suppress the Chicken Coop, I doubt Dysk can refrain from using basic delete tools under heavy pressure), and Dysk also engaged in disruptive blocking of one user despite repeated requests to stop. (RationalWiki:Blocking_policy states "overuse of minute-plus blocks, or blocks against sysops in the middle of editing, are never appreciated by the blockee"). Heck, I'm not opposed to omitting sysoprevoke compared to just Dysk simply not having any sysop rights. Dysk has to do more than just promise this won't happen again, though; I'd like to see them live out maybe a week or more without the rights which is long enough to feel consequences of impulsive actions, which is to hopefully have them thinking twice before acting on impulse, even if it's not long enough to drastically change habits. This length span also should be long enough before elections so Dysk can participate in them as needed. Permaban is way too harsh and not appropriate given the action, while disruptive, is not destructive enough for this. A warning, on the other hand, implies Dysk can follow through the warning, which I don't think really addresses the behavior as Dysk had opportunities to accept being told that their actions are inappropriate and they didn't react accordingly. 21:55, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) Cosign LGM. 22:02, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * 3) Regrettable, but I think necessary. --RWRW (talk) 22:39, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * 4) I'd like to echo all the sentiments above. Spud (talk) 23:34, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * 5) I don't take pleasure in voting this and I only do so under the stipulation that this is super temporary and that it is returned at the first sign of conciliation. Shabi  DOO  00:01, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * in this vote, temporary sysoprevoke is the warning and do nothing section, because dysk has been in sysoprevoke for a while already based on LGM doing it unilaterally. You are voting for a permanent sanction even if your words are different. 20:13, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) Flandres (talk) 00:54, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) With Shabi. Sysop can be returned upon request anytime from my perspective from let's say... the first day of October onwards. On request only, I don't think anyone should be required to monitor it. As far as tech goes, I feel he kinda blew his chance at it for a longer while. 22:19, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 3) Concur. —cosmikdebris talk stalk 16:07, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 4) Scream!! (talk) 22:22, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

Warning and do nothing

 * 1) A single mark on an otherwise spotless record. This is a good faith user and ought to be treated as such--Hastur! (talk)  22:32, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * In the spirit of ambiguity, since Dysk is already in sysoprevoke, are you voting to leave them there?
 * He should definitely be taken out of sysoprevoke as he was put there unilaterally and he never abused his sysop rights--Hastur! (talk) 16:49, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm gonna assume this action is remove sysoprevoke. 19:00, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) I see little reason to question his trustworthiness overall given his longish record of being helpful, despite this easily correctable lapse in judgment. Lest I get personally attacked by Oxyaena for some perceived hypocrisy here, as she is wont to do, I'll just remind people that her record of rights abuses as a sysop involved pervasive lying, which should disqualify her from ever being a sysop unless and until she comes clean and discusses what she did without swearing at people she hates for calling her out. Nutty Roux (talk) 22:43, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) Since it's apparently the first offence of note from Dysk, I'm willing to believe a temporary insanity plead. Slap him with a trout and be done with it.Coigreach (talk) 07:49, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 3) So the user brings himself to the coop for review. He says he did wrong and we can assume that he does not intend re-offend. The purpose of any kind of "punishment" should be to ensure it is less likely that the offense will be repeated. I don't think it will be repeated so no action is necessary.  Obviously if it is repeated then that would change. Bob"Life is short and (insert adjective)" 12:12, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 4) Time served already in sysoprevoke should be sufficient punishment, given that D has a long history of good service, and knows he was in the wrong, and was a first time offense. Bongolian (talk) 17:10, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 5) Dysk wasn't trying to wreck anything as I pointed out when it happened, there were multiple far more damaging things that could have been done instead of deleting a page, undone in ten seconds easily, and his first post after it happened was to admit it was a mistake and explain it. 20:09, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 6) — Oxyaena  Harass  21:16, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 7) AceModerator 22:25, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 8) Thanks for the show of support guys. I promise not to fuck-up again. 16:21, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 9) Another leftwing fascist coup thwarted. nobsBlack Guns Matter 03:43, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * D fucking cooped himself, you fucking ignorant arsehole! Spud (talk) 04:52, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Why is that so many users on RW have an issue with profanity? Is it to reflect on how rational (or not) this site is? LTMay Dataclarifier be well! 04:59, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It's Spud, he doesn't treat people respectfully. Just ignore (I am a lefty, to be clear, and he doesn't treat me properly either). 05:02, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Your fucking Conservapedia friend Rob Smith just used the word "shot" a couple of fucking minutes ago. Why don't you gibe him a fucking hard rime for being a rude boy? Spud (talk)
 * Is your reply meant to reflect on my point about profanity usage? LTMay Dataclarifier be well! 05:41, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * . Yes. "Gibe" was a typo for "give" and "shot" was a typo for "shit". There's your answer. So fuck off and tell Rob Smith not to use rude words. Spud (talk) 06:13, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) GR here. Dysk is innocent of all charges. Ravenism (talk) 20:10, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Invalid, this account does not meet RationalWiki:Eligible users. Account is less than three months old and has less than 75 edits. 20:28, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Fixed that. 20:30, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You didn't. The log says created at September 2nd I'm afraid. 20:33, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * What does the old account say? GR (talk) 20:34, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * RationalWiki:RationalMedia Foundation/Voter registration suggests that GR is eligible to vote. If necessary GR could vote by proxy using his old account anyway. 20:39, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Those are for the RMF, not for policy or penalty votes. And if he wants to vote, he can use his Eligible account. It is not on our end that he according to what I know of it scrambled the password and changed the email to bollocks. But if he can sign in with his original account (his second account isn't Eligible either), he can vote, sure. Not on this one, this one isn't valid. 20:44, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * because you insist I reached out to the original account and it voted by proxy. 21:09, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * He can't proxy vote that way. Vote still invalid and I've struck this one entirely. Cut the bullshit as well as what is now honestly really blatant meatpuppetry. 21:13, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * no rule against it. 21:18, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

Goat

 * 1) Baa.  21:21, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) Is "remove tech and sysoprevoke" = "remove tech and remove sysoprevoke" or "remove tech and implement sysoprevoke"?  21:49, 31 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Just clarify the proposition. If anyone disagrees, they can crossout their names.Ariel31459 (talk) 02:34, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I added a comma. That should do it if you mean both remove tech and put in sysoprevoke.Ariel31459 (talk) 02:37, 1 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) So having just accused others of off-wiki canvassing at the Community Standards, Ravenism is created and Ze unblocks herself and they both vote the same way in a poll to defend Dysk? Interesting --RWRW (talk) 20:17, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * If canvassing isn't allowed, why is LGM, Crow, etc. allowed to do it? Ravenism (talk) 20:18, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I just looked through the conversation in question (the rat-workshop channel on RatCord). I see LGM, Crow and others discussing current events on the wiki. I didn't see any vote canvassing, no encouraging people to vote either in any way.
 * I would ask you why you are here? You supposedly left this wiki, scrambled your password and created a new wiki. But here you are (again), causing drama (again) presumably because your ban vote isn't likely to go through.--RWRW (talk) 20:25, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It may have had smth to do with the attempt to get rid of dysk and other rule mischief, just a thought. 20:28, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * May I recommend looking at the actual substance of this vote. We don't want to get rid of Dysk. In fact, most people supporting removing his tech right and sysoprevoke are saying that he can get sysop back fairly quickly. 20:30, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You have the tenacity to vote for permanent sysoprevoke and claim to not want to get rid of dysk. Ok. 20:32, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Don't forget what Crow called me. A " " (not even punished, but promoted to tech!). GR (talk) 20:33, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

It doesn't say permanent. Are you sure it's permanent?
 * Yes I'm sure and no option for temporary was proposed. 21:14, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It's not permanent, it's just a "place into sysoprevoke right now", but if you look at the actual fucking description of these votes, you'll quickly realize that most people are at least willing to place him out of sysoprevoke and back into sysop pretty quickly. Jesus... 21:16, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * if its not permanent, how long is it for and where does it say that. 21:20, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Check the actual votes. Also, check our policies surrounding sysoprevoke itself. It can be overturned at any point the mob thinks it should be overturned, and the mob seems to overwhelmingly agree that he can get them back fairly easily. Finally, I find there to be some dry amusement in that you say that there is an attempt to get rid of Dysk but um... the person who made this vote is Dysk. So uh, unless you want to argue that the person who wants to "get rid of Dysk" is Dysk, then something here doesn't really add up. 21:24, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * The overwhelming support for letting me off the hook, so to speak, gives me some faith this wiki ain't completely fucked yet. Did I attempt to get rid of myself? Yeah I think I did in a subconscious way self-sabotage myself... oh well. 16:19, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Not sure I'd call it an "overwhelming" show of support, at this moment the vote is 8 votes to remove tech, 9 votes to keep tech (one of which is your own vote). But yes, I can't see it swinging the other way so it does look like you tech rights will end up getting restored. --RWRW (talk) 16:49, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I didn't expect any votes in favour of a lesser sanction. Furthermore, I expected at least someone to vote for a ban. The favourable response is welcome, yet unexpected. 17:00, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

I would like to remind everyone that by suppressing the entire coop, it is entirely possible that RW has been opened up to possible legal issues. Please reference the suppression logs, where notably DG suppressed a case that was "potentially libelous", yet it had to be restored when unsuppressing the coop, as well as seemingly another supression by Oxy over something else before and a few minor other suppressions. Just pointing this one out. 17:03, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Assuming I get tech back at this point. I can simply check and resupress the relevant revisions. After all, I am a board member. This ain't going to take me long to fix. 17:06, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Simple fix: Give Dysk tech so that he can clean it up. This isn't rocket science. 17:32, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

I think this a good as reason as any to continue with normal business and let peeps fix what they broke. 13:48, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Tedious tasks ahead, I guess. 15:18, 5 September 2020 (UTC)

What the fuck is happening
LGM resigns as mod and Raven, who lancbed his way out of a coop, is back, and gets sysoprevoke removed and his tools restored. Y'all give Raven the benefit of the doubt numerous fucking times, and yet give me none, when it's been shown time and time again I`m nowhere near as bad as Raven. Seriously, what the hell? Someone just can't LANCB their way out of a coop and expect everything to be okay, not after how they treated us. LGM's gone, GC's gone, and I`m seriously considering leaving. Ugh, this wiki makes me sick. — Oxyaena Harass  20:42, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Didn't you say you would stop attacking me? GR (talk) 20:43, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I`m quite frankly disgusted at what is happening, Raven. Even you must acknowledge that part of the blame lies on your behalf. This shit would be funny if it were fictional, but it's really not. What has RW become? The circus? — Oxyaena Harass  20:45, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * https://rationalwiki.org/w/index.php?title=RationalWiki_talk:All_things_in_moderation&diff=2220488&oldid=2220486 GR (talk) 20:46, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * And here we have 14 to 12 votes for you to be permabanned, which you weaseled your way out of via pulling a coop.
 * Here's some diffs to remind you of your past:, , , , and let's not forget when you insulted Flandres for being fair to you, and comparing me to Putin. — Oxyaena Harass  20:51, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * In fact, let's just link to LGM's detailed, and comprehensive essay on this subject at your coop case, which, you, again, weaseled your way out of via LANCB. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  20:53, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * If you behave like this after a supposed détente, I won't vote to give you a sysop back. Not deserved. 20:58, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I`m not blameless, but this shit wouldn't fly if it were me in question. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  21:00, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Raven, I don't want you angry, I want you gone. Just go away, this site isn't the right site for you anyways. It'll be a lot easier on everyone if you go away quietly, none of this needs to happen. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  21:02, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Are you trying to get rid of me? I got a lot of butthurt when I said this. 21:10, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Forget I said anything, it's not worth rehashing. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  21:15, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

I won't forget it. Next time you ask for sysop I will oppose it (because of this). 21:24, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I mean, you admitted to starting drama on purpose on the Discord, so.... — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  21:37, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Since you quickly undid your promise to no longer attack me, I will no longer just accept your proposals of armistice, considering this recent breach of civility. Make your words worth anything. I will no longer entertain this subject. 22:18, 2 September 2020 (UTC)

Proxy votes
Hello, everyone. I hate to bother people but Godless Raven was locked out of his account again (he apparently uses randomly generated passwords that he stores on his browser. When he deletes the stored password and removes his email information from his account, this makes it impossible for him to log back in). He desires to edit from this account. Now, the question is, does this account have franchise? Personally, I say yes. So long as he is only voting with a single account I don't see the issue. The spirit of the law is clearly being followed, Godless Raven meets the minimum edit count and account age requirements to be a voter in policy/penalty discussions.--Hastur! (talk) 21:39, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I mean sure. I don’t see why not. 22:24, 2 September 2020 (UTC)
 * He just said he doesn't even want to be here, wants to leave and just wants his sysop so he can delete stuff before going away forever. Why does he need to vote then? Shabi  DOO  07:16, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * The vote is needed because he fake-LANCBed before. If he was actually leaving, then why is GR still in the Saloon? Bongolian (talk) 07:40, 3 September 2020 (UTC)
 * What's the problem here? 18:39, 3 September 2020 (UTC)

So Dysk got all his rights back
And I`m still here languishing in sysoprevoke while Raven, a user who has worse conduct than me, is still a ninja and sysop even after he pulled a lancb to weasel his way out of a permaban. Great. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  15:43, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Temporary sysoprevoke in your case I believe, you could make a vote on removing it now, or at a later point in time. 15:48, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I object. She told me she wanted to make peace and later attacked me yet again.   15:51, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm not a mod, my comment is about the procedure of the request, the substance of the request would be decided at the vote. 15:57, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I never attacked you, Raven, my comment was about LGM. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:00, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Also Raven you jumped into a conversation that you wasn't mentioned in to try wind up Oxy, so don't act like too much of a victim. --RWRW (talk) 16:02, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I commented about a talk page section about how Oxy didn't mind Stalin at the time there. Even Bongolian agreed with me. What's the problem here? 16:09, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * The thing about Stalin was irrelevant is the problem, you had no reason to jump in on that convo other than to wind me up. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:11, 5 September 2020 (UTC)

Vote to remove Oxy's sysoprevoke
Several people have flagged their support to restore sysop for me, and I have improved on such things. If Raven gets to keep sysop even after all he's done, why is he held to a different set of standards than me?

Aye

 * 1) Let's get this rolling.  16:37, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * To avoid confusion - I'm favour of removing sysoprevoke and giving back sysop, but not giving back tech rights at this time. --RWRW (talk) 16:54, 5 September 2020 (UTC)

Aye, with 3 months probation

 * 1) ok but subject to the topic ban from far left politics (currently passing on the coop) and 3 months probation like ronin suggested before which should include not being toxic to other users and not banning suspected trolls unilaterally.  18:45, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) Still think probation is a good idea. RoninMacbeth (talk) 18:59, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Sure, I’ll sign this too. 19:35, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I thought probation was implied though. 19:35, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Can you address this, then? What sort of probation do you expect from someone who hasn't changed by any measure as late as August 20th?  19:38, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) I'll sign this too in case to simple aye doesn't surpass nays. The topic ban is sensible in any case, so I voted for it in the coop as well. This is going to be my main and only option now as per Bongolians request for clarity. Coigreach (talk) 00:41, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) Fair enough. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  04:09, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 3) Also makes sense to vote for this. Spud (talk) 05:19, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * And I'll say again, when you have a hunch about someone being a sockpuppet of a banned user, do nothing until they either do something bad, admit they are the banned user or give themselves away beyond any shred of reasonable doubt. Spud (talk) 11:58, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) Given Ronins sanctions are on the table here, and those are what I said under Aye, going with this.  09:48, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) seems like a resonable middle ground. Vorarchivist (talk) 19:24, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 3) --RWRW (talk) 21:08, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 4) Flandres (talk) 21:24, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 5) I'm with this as long as the probation is strict: over the three months if there is an unpleasant edit war, insult fest or meltdown and the tools are lost.  Shabi  DOO  02:22, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 6) Okay —  python coder   (talk &#124; contribs) 14:05, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 7) UGH fine I’ll move my vote back. UUUUGGGHHHH. 13:47, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Nay

 * 1) Has not changed her behavior. See: "You miserable piece of shit"  16:55, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Must we remind you how you pulled a fake LANCB to get out of a permaban? Note how I haven't been uncivil towards anyone since August 20th. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:57, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * GR: Son, you got a lot to learn about politics. You just had 15 people vote to ban your ass. You're in no position to lead the Nay opposition. That's no way to build a coalition. What are you, the Lone Ranger? nobsBlack Guns Matter 17:01, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * For once Nobs has an actual point. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:03, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Firstly, you are a malignant transphobic bigot, so I don't really give a shit what you have to say. Secondly, 16 users voted against my ban. You pretend like there are only haters here. 17:05, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * The vote was settled by one vote, clearly you are at the very least a divisive figure. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:07, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * One vote? Shit, don't tell me that. I may have to go back to the coop and reconsider. nobsBlack Guns Matter 17:10, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oh, please do. I never asked you to vote to not ban me, chud. 17:17, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * could you two stop the dogfighting and needlessly inflammatory language. 17:19, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Sorry, next time I'll use your vocabulary. 17:21, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:23, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1) Sincere benchmark: Make it through to the new year (Jan. 1st, 2021) without any further requests for sysop, LANCBs, or particularly stupid slapfights or drama, and I'll vote in your favour for sysop. That - for me - would demonstrate a sufficient improvement in your judgment & impulse control. Not bothered about brief outbursts of anger or unparliamentary language, but three month clock restarts if there's any of the more serious / obnoxious stuff above. I also refer you back to my earlier recommendation re. fossils. Helena Bonham Carter (talk) 17:44, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 2) This user has not demonstrated the necessary maturity to be given back her tools. The unsettling desperation to get them back (this is a monthly thing, now- and she's constantly whining about it) reinforces the notion that she isn't fit to have them--Hastur! (talk)  17:47, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 3) AGAIN! has Oxy not learned to keep her head down yet?
 * 4) Every time there is someone who has rights restored, Oxy seems to think that it is unfair that she has not had her rights restored as well. However, not every case is the same. I don't think it's unreasonable for all editors to strive towards acting in a civil manner towards their fellow-editors. Oxy has consistently been uncivil, as recently as late August. Being uncivil is not insignificant, it can lead to needless hostilities, coop cases, and wasted time for otherwise uninvolved parties. Bongolian (talk) 19:30, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 5) Not this shit again. AceModerator 20:35, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 6) Not yet. —cosmikdebris talk stalk 20:59, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 7) Nutty Roux (talk) 17:56, 6 September 2020 (UTC)

Withdrawn votes

 * Flandres (talk) 18:12, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * OK, I'll vote for this. Although due to her gloating about being an unelected mod, I don't think she should be a tech ever again. And Oxyaena, I also sometimes have hunches about new users being sockpuppets of banned ones. I do nothing until they either do something bad, admit they are that banned user or give themselves away beyond any shred of reasonable doubt. I strongly suggest you do the same. Spud (talk) 00:48, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * With the understanding that if she ever uses the mop abusively again, I won't be voting to restore it. I don't think a 3 month parole is necessary, a permanent parole is implied by my vote at least. Redacted in favour of probation option. Coigreach (talk) 20:16, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * All right. I approve of that. Spud (talk) 02:13, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I also would clarify that while generally I'd expect Oxy to continue maintaining her current level of civility, I won't hold occasional retorts towards Raven parole breaking behavior considering what a gigantic dick he has been recently. Still, try to ignore him when possible. Coigreach (talk) 20:20, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * "Don't be a nuisance unless it is to Raven. Then it's okay." Well at least you said the quiet part out loud. This is shameful. 20:45, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You're being more than a nuisance yourself and you reap what you sow. That said, at least I did advice her to try and ignore your abuse. I'm clearly not expecting you to be able to ignore any perceived slight. Coigreach (talk) 20:54, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Also, the word "retort" implies response. So if you go out of your way to abuse her, I won't judge her for responding unkindly. However, if she personally initiates a fight with you, I won't be as understanding. Coigreach (talk) 21:11, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * We recently saw fit to give Dysk back his rights, same leniency should be given to Oxy (with the caveat that both user's actions will be monitored. --RWRW (talk) 16:48, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Voting for second proposal instead. --RWRW (talk) 21:08, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  15:59, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * No more need for it at this point. If Oxy abuses tools, which I doubt she will, we can easily reimpose the sanction. 16:52, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I have definitely learned my lesson. Being ostracized and placed into sysoprevoke for months will do that for you. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:00, 5 September 2020 (UTC)

Goat
The fuck? lol. 05:50, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I request your input on our monthly "should we let oxy get sysop tools" (I think it should just be dismissed and archived, honestly). 16:01, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * How about you abide by the results of the Coop and leave, why do you get held to one set of standards and I don't? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:02, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Also why do you not ping RWRW? Do you want to make it even more apparent you're mod shopping? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:03, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * (ec) ngl after the recent thread last week on this subject I don't think this will work and it should be archived because of that but if you want to go thru with it anyway then there should be some point to wait until October or November at least before doing it again. 16:15, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * So far as I'm aware, Raven is not accused of abusing sysop tools, is he? You, on the other hand, have a demonstrated record of block abuses involving both truly heavy-handed bans and a kind of persistent, self-dealing dishonesty that should disqualify you from ever being a sysop until you come clean about it. Are you ready to talk about Howe much you've lied to people here? Nutty Roux (talk) 16:12, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You're hardly an unbiased source, and my block record did improve prior to me being sysoprevoked. How am I dishonest again? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:14, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I showed that your block record was crummy up to the end. Do you really want to force me to have to go through all your bans to catalog obviously dishonest examples of you using "Morris" and "ban evasion" as ways to get rid of people you didn't like, rather than admit you didn't have checkuser and therefore had no basis for claiming a huge number of accounts were Morris without their admission (which did occasionally happen)? It seems childish to contest the point and its obvious consequences. I don't have a lot of time to spend on this, but when I do, I promise the stakes won't just be whether you get sysop back. Nutty Roux (talk) 16:26, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You realize there's such a thing as a behavioral pattern, right? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:27, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy, as I and several users have pointed out, you should wait some time before you ask for this again. Shabi  DOO  16:38, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I`m tired of Nutty character assassinating me when he wasn't even here for the vast majority of the period we're talking about. He doesn't get any of the context. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:41, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Your lack of character is on you. Let's hear about your expertise at pattern recognition. How about you start by identifying a few of the criteria you used to claim I'm Morris on several occasions.
 * You mean asides from being a BoN insulting an established user here seemingly out of nowhere with no previous edit record? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:47, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Many of the issues brought up against me date to when I was an inexperienced sysop and tech, in late 2018 and early 19, I barely edited before then. They're simply not fair. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  16:50, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I don't even know what to do with you sometimes. You don't even know what's true or not. Your first "Morris" ban was May 2019. Only 13%, or 25 out of 179, of your "ban evasion" bans occurred before April 2019. How does that fit your the narrative that you're unfairly oppressed because ... people are judging you too harshly for not knowing what you were doing early on? Nutty Roux (talk) 17:08, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I only started being seriously harassed after April 2019. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:10, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You throw around accusations of harassment so readily I doubt you've experience it at any level of severity--Hastur! (talk) 17:50, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * If you think that's so, then obviously you haven't been paying as much attention as you should. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  18:31, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I have and not only do I think he didn't harass you remotely as badly as you say, but you needlessly provoked him and got off on the power imbalance. Nutty Roux (talk) 19:25, 5 September 2020 (UTC)
 * All harassment is serious, and how did I needlessly provoke him? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  02:05, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Furthermore, you're a privileged cishet white male lawyer, don't lecture me about things you couldn't've possibly experienced. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  05:35, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * So because Nutty is a white, heterosexual male his input is somehow lessened? Are you being a jackass on purpose or can't you help it? AceModerator 07:11, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * "The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers". - William Shakespeare's Henry VI, Part 2, Act IV, Scene 2 (William Shakespeare was a white male)


 * Most of RationalWiki's editors are white males. Deal with it. It's not going to change.


 * If you feel very strongly about this issue, launch the wiki "NonWhiteMaleWki.com".Rintintin (talk) 10:24, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Shut the fuck up Morris. 10:26, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * A wiki that excludes white males. Madness! Pure, unadulterated madness!Rintintin (talk) 10:42, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm ashamed of you. 12:24, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * We have no way of verifying the personal details of any user. It is no more than a vulgar pretense to imply otherwise. No person represents all people they regard to be in their own category. Ariel31459 (talk) 15:52, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Rintintin, your trolling is getting dull and flat now. You must be terribly terribly bored, lonely and sad inside. Shabi  DOO  16:25, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * that would go without saying if they are who i suspect they are. AMassiveGay (talk) 16:31, 6 September 2020 (UTC)

Note
Even if Oxy "wins" this vote all it does is remove the sysoprevoke. It doesn't automatically give her sysop. I would suggest that she have to undergo some probationary period before being demoted to Sysop. Scream!! (talk) 22:47, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * That'll be hard to enforce, I'm afraid--Hastur! (talk) 04:50, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Not necessarily. So let's say we decide to remove her from sysoprevole today but she isn't made a sysop again until 1 October at the earliest. And that. of course, is conditional on how she behaves over the next 3 weeks. Then once she's made a sysop, she's still under probation for 3 months after that, meaning a mod could take it away from her again without a Coop case. Spud (talk) 05:40, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Are the mods agreeing to enforce this?--Hastur! (talk) 05:45, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'll certainly enforce it, if the other mods agree to it. I'll leave a message in the Saloon Bar saying please don't make Oxy a sysop ahain before 1 October. If I see that Oxyaena has been made a sysop again before October 1, I'll remove it and send messages to her and whoever demoted her. So let's see what the other mods think., , , , what do you think? Spud (talk) 07:01, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm certainly not going to obstruct the majority opinion. Bongolian (talk) 07:38, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Well a lot of users also don't think Oxy is going to behave, either. It would be a good compromise. 08:58, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I`m not sure attempting to undermine a democratically held vote when there already is a compromise on the table is a good thing, Raven. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:00, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Also I thought you'd retired. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:03, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I'm sure that if Oxyaena has matured like she claims, she won't mind waiting a couple more weeks. Although given that she's still throwing stones from her glass house I'm inclined to say she hasn't matured very much at all.--Hastur! (talk)  09:05, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * The thing is, it's not necessary. I`m already gonna be subject to a lot of scrutiny. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:23, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * In response to the mod ping above, I'd say it wasn't necessary, when I voted I was under the impression that removing Oxy from sysoprevoke would result in immediate restoration of sysop. But sure, if everyone else wants to wait to 1 October then I won't get in the way. --RWRW (talk) 09:37, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I agree with and . AceModerator 21:08, 9 September 2020 (UTC)


 * I am not confident at all, considering how you told me yesterday to kill myself in private. 09:24, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * That's not what happened, and Discord stuff is off-wiki. This is irrelevant to the conversation at hand, is spiting me the only reason you unblocked yourself? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:33, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Are you denying that you said this? 09:39, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

shut the fuck raven i hope you get cancer and fucking die you're a goddamn rat [...] rot in your own piss and shit, you fucking troll
 * I very much hope Oxy didn't say that. Do you have any proof of it? --RWRW (talk) 09:37, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Fuck, Oxy, why would you say something like that???--Hastur! (talk) 09:41, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It's a subversion of the vote, even if it's a temporary one. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:38, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I would not like to be reminded of that. I think I`m gonna go, before I say something I end up regretting. I think I`m gonna be sick, that was a genuinely stressful event. Oh god, I told you to leave me alone. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:41, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Did you say that or did you not? 09:43, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Seriously? You were stressed out?  So you told somebody to get cancer, rot in their own piss and shit?--Hastur! (talk)  09:44, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Raven's been harassing me, both on and off this wiki. I finally had enough and snapped at him yesterday, the incident was resolved amongst the involved parties. You should know Em is not gonna be happy about what you just did here. This was a private convo, it should not have been leaked here, especially just to spite me. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena  <font color="Red">Harass  09:50, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Oxyaena, can you answer? Did you or did you not say those words to me? 09:52, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Didn't I literally scream at you to leave me alone? Emblyn, someone we both care about, is not gonna be happy when she finds out what you did here, leaking private convos out like that. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  09:54, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * So you won't answer. Firstly, Z posted the invite in my server, which has over 500 members. It is not a private server. Also, there were several eyewitnesses to this. You did tell me to kill myself. 09:56, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It was a public channel, Oxy. One he didn't follow you to.  You can't expect to be beyond scrutiny.  I saw the comments he made.  He said "I'm tempted to ask," and that's what set you off.  You can say that has nothing to do with RW if you want but otherwise don't try to downplay it.  And don't carry the expectation that you'll be beyond scrutiny, criticism, or feedback on RW--Hastur! (talk)  09:58, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It literally says in its about section that it's a private server. It has nothing to do with RationalWiki. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  10:18, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Just going to say that this seems like a weird policy to add. Yeah, she'll get taken out of sysoprevoke, but all this means is that someone else can demote her, at which point, yes you'd need a coop to remove it. This seems like a weird application on the sysop rules that for many wasn't included in the vote to begin with and honestly seems like an excuse to prolong the period of time that she'll stay in sysoprevoke over this. 08:17, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * It definitely does. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  08:34, 9 September 2020 (UTC)


 * I didn't tell you to kill yourself, you're lying on that front. Also, I wasn't aware it wasn't a private server, and thirdly, this is off wiki, it has no relevance on the matter at hand. I thought we agreed to keep off-wiki stuff off' the wiki, like your defense of necrophilia? It was a matter that had already been resolved. It's no business of the wiki what went on there. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass''  10:01, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Raven also once mocked someone for visiting their friend's grave, and has a history of making racist comments about third world anarchist communes. Should I bring those up too? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  10:04, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Yes, bring it up. Quote me exactly as I said it. Show us. 10:07, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 1. Raven is not on trial here. This is about you. (also I've yet to be given proof that he's mocked somebody for visiting their friend's grave.  He'll admit to defending necrophilia but adamantly denies this) 2.I'd say that this reinforces my vote that you haven't matured enough to be given back your "mop."  I'm sure we've had worse sysops in the past but I'm still disinclined to give user rights to somebody who tells people that they hope they rot in their own piss and shit--Hastur! (talk)  10:07, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Given how you were banned on Twitter, I cannot, but I have the next best thing: — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena  <font color="Red">Harass  10:12, 9 September 2020 (UTC)


 * Also you insisted on keeping your problematic off-wiki history to be made irrelevant to your wiki persona, so it's some real fucking hypocrisy for you to turn around and do the same to me. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  10:12, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Raven has a pattern of making things about himself. Also Ace is mod despite having literally desysopped everyone on the wiki ages past, so why are you okay with him being mod? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  10:12, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Oxy, Raven and Hastur are deliberately provoking you to get you to react and have a meltdown or start swearing which will sabotage your efforts to restore your rights. You'd be very wise to ignore their posts and not play this game. Not reacting is the smartest thing you can do. Also...cursing or saying vicious things (even if totally provoked and even if not on the wiki) will not help your case here. Shit-stirrers literally thrive off of overreactions. Please don't let them win. Shabi DOO  10:21, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you, Shabi, for the reminder. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  10:29, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I was there for that particular... misadventure with Ace McWicked. I was one of the first to condemn him, actually.  Do you know what Ace did after that?  He apologized.  He owned up to it.  And he continued to participate in RationalWiki.  Over time the community decided that he had re-earned its trust and he was elected moderator again.  He did not beg and whine for months to have his rights restored.  He did things the right way.  And he's proven to be a valuable member of this community overall.  Which is saying something, because believe me, Ace and I have had our disagreements--Hastur! (talk)  10:26, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I've gone and collapsed that entire thing. It's a pointless distraction that is basically dragging off-wiki drama to the wiki, and unless we want to start putting people on trial for that (in which case, we can go ahead and reopen a coop case, which again we agreed to not do that in that case, but hey, I could be proven wrong). Keep conversations on this related to Oxy's behavior on the wiki please. 10:41, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Well, there doesn't seem to be any support for what I suggested. I strongly recommend not making Oxyaena a sysop again immediately. But if somebody wants to make her one, there's nothing I can do to stop it. Spud (talk) 14:32, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Second note
Why are all the non-moderators voting on this MODERATOR's page? if the general populace are voting it should be in the Chicken Coop. Scream!! (talk) 22:53, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Because the mob rules, the mods have no special authority beyond what the mob gives them. We've always held votes here. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  07:47, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Closing the vote
Okay, so I`m pretty sure it's been 24 hours, and the vote total is 14 (including the sanctions vote) - 7, so I think we can close it now. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:32, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy, last time you wanted the vote to stay open for a week remember? Now that you are getting your way you quickly want to close it? AceModerator 22:38, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Nice try. Republicans also think folks should be able to vote twice.Ariel31459 (talk) 17:43, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Alternative maths ftw. Helena Bonham Carter (talk) 17:44, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * If this becomes the final outcome 7-7-7. I don't see any clear majority option, which I would interpret as keep the status quo. The vote should be held open longer in case a majority opinion can be formed. Bongolian (talk) 17:49, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Yeah Oxy doesn't have 14 votes. I count 10 individual voters who in some way support removing sysoprevoke, and 7 who oppose it at this point. --RWRW (talk) 17:51, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * We could strike all votes that were cast twice and (assuming no bad intent) allow those who voted twice to cast a single new vote. Bongolian (talk) 17:55, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Count the probation and aye votes as one and the same, since probation is generally assumed to be the result of me being demoted again. It was implied in the original section, and explicitly stated in the second section. Only strike one of the votes for each section. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  17:58, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I referenced keeping any eye in Oxy's actions if the vote passes, but I cast my vote before the second Aye option was introduced. Most of those who voted for that first option mentioned seemed to allude to a similar thing. --RWRW (talk) 18:27, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * 14 to 7? Do you think we're stupid?-Hastur! (talk)  18:37, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Can't you people assume any charitability? You do the same for Raven, I miscounted. Jesus Christ. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  18:53, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I would not do the same for Raven. I very clearly insisted, in a discussion YOU WERE A PART OF not to prematurely end Raven's own vote.  It's crap like this that wears out people's patience with you.  But please, start yet another conversation about alleged double standards, as you are wont to do--Hastur! (talk)  19:06, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * For fucks sake Oxy, don't try to hasten this up. Your desperation of getting your mop back immediately yesterday is starting to turn me against you again. This vote should run for at least a week like Ravens and Dysks votes did. You can do without your goddamn mop that long. Coigreach (talk) 19:09, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy, some people here are literally only voting for you to get sysoprevoked revoked to spite me and yet here you are angering your own allies? lol. 19:20, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I don't know if you're refering to me there GR, but you can fuck right off. I'm voting the way I am on principle. Just like I (eventually) did in your case. I would hate your guts even without you consistently antagonizing Oxy and trying to rile her up, because you're an asshole through and through.
 * Also, Oxy, I'm begging you. Don't grab onto this. Don't let Raven or Ace or Nutty or anyone else to bait you into becoming combative again. You're really not doing yourself any favors by aggressively challenging every unfriendly comment or vote here. Just take a fucking breather before responding. Coigreach (talk) 20:43, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Hey Coigreach, have you read the CS? Please be civil. 20:54, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Why won't you try that yourself Raven? Hugs and kisses. Coigreach (talk) 21:02, 6 September 2020 (UTC)

Cut it out. That was unnecessary. Bongolian (talk) 21:06, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Oxy wants this closed now but when she went for this last time he insisted the vote stay open for something ridiculous like 2 weeks which I narrowed down to 4 days, using the mod power to bootstrap voting policies. So I think this should stay open four days also - based on precident. AceModerator 21:13, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * ACE PLEASE STOP MISGENDERING OXY . You've been called out on in half a dozen times now. It's not cool. Use she/her/hers/herself. Shabi  DOO  22:36, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Fixed. AceModerator 22:37, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Ace, I used to think you had testicles. Thank God I'm an old fart and will be dead in a few years. Then this whole fucked up world will be yours to inherit. Good luck! nobsBlack Guns Matter 02:27, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I've got more balls than you, you fucking weasel. AceModerator 03:24, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * One of the simple pleasures of life is outliving one's enemies, John 3:16 be damned. Bongolian (talk) 03:51, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Ace will probably outlive us all. —cosmikdebris talk stalk 03:57, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * You got that fucking right. AceModerator 03:59, 7 September 2020 (UTC)

Double voting
Given that there is only one vote regarding Oxy (not separate votes for different options), I advise those who have cast votes on different options to retract one of the votes:. This is meant to clarify results when voting ends. Bongolian (talk) 21:04, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Done. Coigreach (talk) 21:15, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I consider the probation redundant since we’re all gonna be watching her actions closely for a while, so I pulled that vote. 21:58, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * No - it isn't redundant. On probation Oxy can immediately be stripped of rights if she breaks her terms of probation. Without the probation it would have to go through the fucking coop again. AceModerator 22:16, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Yeah, either way this goes, Oxyaena can't keep dragging us through votes every month. Allowing her to have sysop back without probation runs the risk of allowing her to drag us through more drama.  Similarly, should she lose, I will start a coop to put a moratorium on removing her from sysoprevoke until January 1st, 2021, so that she stop haranguing us--Hastur! (talk)  22:25, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Having a mod auto strip rights in the event she abuses them wouldn’t be controversial. 22:28, 6 September 2020 (UTC)

Voting period
As I was the mod that did this last time I'll be the mod that does it this time and formalise a comment I made above. Oxy has tried close this after 24 hours of voting however in the last instance this went to vote Oxy asked for 2 weeks. Quite obvious here that Oxy is trying to manipulate the time frames to suit her needs so as with what happened last time this vote will go for 4 days - ending on 15:59, 9 September 2020. AceModerator 22:33, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I concur. Oxy's behavior is obvious. Bongolian (talk) 23:24, 6 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I seem to recall Oxy trying to manipulate voting time in her favor once before. Voting manipulation for personal benefit is a rather authoritarian way to behave. Bongolian (talk) 19:26, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * I`m not trying to do anything, I would appreciate it if you stopped assuming bad faith on my behalf. — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  19:30, 7 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Come on, dude. You know what you're doing. Last time you called for 2 weeks (!) and now you're happy after 24 hours... tsk, tsk. You don't want us to assume bad faith while you assume we're stupid. AceModerator 01:15, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * What else can we expect from the authoritarian anarchist--Hastur! (talk) 01:20, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Maybe don't shit talk me for once, Hastur, and we wouldn't have many problems in the first place? — <font color="Purple">Oxyaena <font color="Red">Harass  01:48, 8 September 2020 (UTC)

Vote closing
Okay so this vote closes in like 5 minutes if I read Ace's time being in UTC. Rn it's 1 unilateral Aye, 12 Ayes with a probation and 8 Nays. I don't see this changing in the little time left. Just to quickly reiterate the likely result: Oxy gets her sysop back, no ifs no buts. Furthermore, the following sanctions that Ronin originally proposed will be applied on a probationary basis for 3 months if I understood it correctly (copied from archive 24):


 * 1) Oxyaena cannot give a block exceeding 3.14159 days to anyone who is not a spam account.
 * 2) Oxyaena cannot use the Vandal Bin on users with more than 30 edits.
 * 3) Oxyaena has an active obligation to deescalate a confrontation with another user, with the possible exception of when another user is clearly trying to provoke her through malicious action (e.g., intentionally misgendering her). Oxyaena must contact a moderator to resolve the situation if she feels she cannot resolve the conflict diplomatically. Note: This does not extend to talking about people who are not users; calling out shitheads IRL is what we do, and Oxy is one of our loudest callers out of shitheadery.

Suggesting this be placed on either her userpage or a talkpage for duration of probation both as a reminder to Oxy and any watching moderators/sysops that she is on probation. 15:55, 9 September 2020 (UTC)


 * I've closed the vote as 12 - 8 in favour. I'm going to go ahead and add sysop back too, and post a copy of those rules on her talk page. I'd say to anyone reading this that if they feel that Oxy has not followed these rules then they should report her to a mod, who can unilaterally restore sysoprevoke as per the probation. --RWRW (talk) 16:07, 9 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Also the Raven coop vote will close today at 18:00UTC, I believe. --RWRW (talk) 16:14, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Edit warring on Leo Gura
Just a heads up for the mods: There is an edit war involving two sysops and at least one non-autopatrolled account happening on Leo Gura. I've put an admin-only protection on this page for the next 3.6 days and advised the participants to resolve this on the talk page. —cosmikdebris talk stalk 22:50, 8 September 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the heads up. AceModerator 01:04, 9 September 2020 (UTC)