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FFS, Emo is not offshot of goth. Emo is offshot of hardcore, while goth is an offshot of post-punk. — Unsigned, by: / talk / contribs

@ On talk pages, please sign your comments using four tildes (~~~~) or by clicking on the sign button: SigButt.png on the toolbar above the edit panel. You can also indent successive talk page comments using one more colon (:) for each line. Thank you. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 12:39, 22 March 2018 (UTC)


Sorry to be that guy but I fail to see what a particular, if interesting fashion aesthetic has anything to do with RationalWiki's original mission of debunking pseudoscience or even its current mission of promoting whatever bullshit the social justice machine churns out. The article basically just says that "goth" is a loosely defined term related to clothing and appearance and goes on to list various goths whom it dismisses as not real goths. --Let Them Eat Cake (talk) 15:08, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

I can't believe what I just read. I came here expecting to be upset and having to correct people, but this article is actually rather good. Thank you. Though could you post a photo of a dedicated look, rather than simply a lazy one? I always love to wear the very flamboyant makeup and clothing, and it would be wonderful to see such flamboyance represented here. I've noticed A LOT of improvement to this article. It used to trouble me, though I hadn't mustered the courage to proceed with making any changes. Tonight I was feeling defensive about my lifestyle, and it pleases me to see this article with all of its improvements. My goodness, I'm thrilled! (talk) 08:22, 3 January 2019 (UTC)

Gothic vs. Goth[edit]

I don't like the goth label for myself as much as I prefer Gothic. Goth seems to be primarily related to a certain music genre (post punk/goth) and fans of this genre. Gothic is everything else, such as way of thinking and expressing oneself, for example, which most often influences the goth music genre as well. Therefore, many, if not most goths, are Gothic. Of course the goth genre is appealing for a lot of Gothic folks, but it shouldn't be considered a requirement for all Gothic folks to like it. Yet, to be goth, the music is the defining element. There is a big difference between Gothic and goth, yet also a considerable amount of overlap.

As to why I personally dislike the goth label for myself, it's not because I don't like goth music. I actually do listen to it, but I don't feel like my way of being and living (Gothic) should be conflated with a music genre and subculture. The music isn't my reason or inspiration for being Gothic, I don't swoon over rock bands (even though listening to music can be relaxing from time to time), I'm not interested in club life in the least, and I really don't care to be mistaken for someone with those sorts of interests, as though that's what being Gothic means. Though I am what you would call flamboyantly Gothic in appearance and otherwise, and I am very passionate regarding my way of being (who I am and the expression thereof). I love being me and am always willing to defend myself, though I mean no disrespect to anyone. Bumpy Toad (talk) 04:16, 15 October 2019 (UTC)