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I'm not sure I see populism as espousing those things. Examples? Amin7b5 04:29, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
- First of that is the view of the two-axis politics groups such as the Nolan Chart. Rann is a good example, he is all for government hospitals, schools, shopping hour regulations etc. things that increase government expenditure and hence taxation and also require government intervention into the economy, all tradition left-wing economic issues issues. He on the other hand has opposes gay marriage, euthanasia, constantly passes policing laws that give more power to the police to confiscate property before a trial, general search warrents, and also jail people without trial for drink driving. He also passes laws that interfere with sentencing of criminals, all very-conservative social policy. He does both these thing because they popular with the pundits, ignoring the fact they are both shitty ideas. - π 04:38, 19 May 2009 (UTC)
Macron and Teddy Roosevelt
What makes Macron a populist at all? I don't recall that he used the anti-elitist rhetoric typical of populists, so I really wonder why he's on the list at all.
I agree that Teddy Roosevelt was a populist, but a centrist? I mean, if we evaluate him on the political spectrum of his time (rather than anachronistically fitting into current political categories), wouldn't his populism peg him as a sort of liberal imperialist/interventionist (fairly leftward on economic issues for his day with trust busting etc. and an interventionist and imperialist abroad, kind of like the British Whigs)? Or perhaps this combination is precisely why he's being put forth as a centrist? ScepticWombat (talk) 06:01, 3 September 2017 (UTC)
- Macron founded his own political party, which is usually a sign of being a populist. He also rails against the French equivalent of the "post-war-consensus" like Thatcher did in Britain, albeit a bit more moderately. And his party is a lot of cult of personality. And if you look at the election of 1912, Roosevelt was surely not the most left-wing option in that election. Evil Zionist (talk) 01:08, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
- Founding your own party and/or having a cult of personality is not what makes a populist. Populism is the use of a rhetorical stance in which you present yourself as the champion of the (common) people against some sort of elite that is thought to be/presented as running roughshod over "the people". Sure, Macron has presented himself as one who can break with "the post-war consensus" (apparently not realising that he's about 30 years late...), but which elite is he actually seeking to challenge and when has he presented himself as "the people's champion" against such a (real or imagined) elite?
- As for Roosevelt, sure he wasn't the most left wing option available, but just like the presence of communists doesn't make a classic social democrat into a centrist, neither does the presence of Eugene V. Debs mean that Roosevelt can automatically be labelled a centrist. ScepticWombat (talk) 14:25, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
- Well was Roosevelt to the left of Wilson? Or Wilson to the left of Roosevelt? I think on domestic issues they were broadly similar while on foreign issues Roosevelt was definitely more hawkish. And Macron left the Socialist Party to smear it. I know too little French to analyze his rhetoric, but he certainly has some stripes of the populist. More than those of the technocrat at any rate... Evil Zionist (talk) 20:58, 4 September 2017 (UTC)
- This entire conversation on Macron verges on parody. "France needs a new king" Macron? "Jovian Presidency" Macron? "My thoughts are too complex for journalism" Macron? The Macron classed by his article on this very wiki alongside arch-technocrat "radical centrists" Clinton and Blair? The Macron who won an election only because of a runoff against the fringe Le Pen that couldn't have happened without massive scandal for Fillon and Hamon's backstabbing of Melancheon? The Macron whose first acts in office were to anger left, right, and center by simultaneously crushing labor unions, reaffirming support for refugee programs, and instituting permanent martial law? THAT Macron is "populist"? Seeing his name in the list was good for some laughs, but I think that's enough. 18.104.22.168 (talk) 00:28, 5 July 2018 (UTC)