RationalWiki talk:Annotated Qur'an/Sad
Quran 38:70[edit]
Is there a specific reason to throw those who suffer from mental illness under the bus here or no? — Oxyaena Harass 11:42, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
- No Oxy because there is a difference between someone who sits in a cave and thinks God is speaking to him and then creates a violent religious movement out of it, and the average person who is suffering from mental illness. Your characterisation of religious commentary and "throwing people suffering from mental illness under the bus" is fucking ridiculous. ShabiDOO 13:14, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
- It's ableist rhetoric through and through, you don't need to resort to ableist rhetoric to point out the sheer ludicrous nature of something. You're better than that. At least, I would hope so. — Oxyaena Harass 15:56, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
- Your overzealous take on this is noted Oxy. ShabiDOO 18:00, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
- Okay, tell me. How is explicitly stating that mental illness is a defect not ableist rhetoric? — Oxyaena Harass 00:56, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Did I say it was a defect? I said it was an issue. Are you trying to tell me that mental illness is NOT an issue among those who suffer it? Next thing you're going to tell me...referring to full paralysis as a disability is somehow bigoted. ShabiDOO 05:07, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Why bring it up? Have you ever heard of the social model of disability? Maybe try doing some reading before spouting off on subjects you're woefully inadequate in dealing with, like, say, political philosophy. Are you a psychiatrist? Maybe you should realize that trying to diagnose historical figures is generally considered bad form by the actual psychiatric community. — Oxyaena Harass 05:12, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Are you a psychiatrist? ShabiDOO 05:25, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Why bring it up? Have you ever heard of the social model of disability? Maybe try doing some reading before spouting off on subjects you're woefully inadequate in dealing with, like, say, political philosophy. Are you a psychiatrist? Maybe you should realize that trying to diagnose historical figures is generally considered bad form by the actual psychiatric community. — Oxyaena Harass 05:12, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Did I say it was a defect? I said it was an issue. Are you trying to tell me that mental illness is NOT an issue among those who suffer it? Next thing you're going to tell me...referring to full paralysis as a disability is somehow bigoted. ShabiDOO 05:07, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Okay, tell me. How is explicitly stating that mental illness is a defect not ableist rhetoric? — Oxyaena Harass 00:56, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Your overzealous take on this is noted Oxy. ShabiDOO 18:00, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
- It's ableist rhetoric through and through, you don't need to resort to ableist rhetoric to point out the sheer ludicrous nature of something. You're better than that. At least, I would hope so. — Oxyaena Harass 15:56, 13 July 2021 (UTC)
Yeah so, I also just feel like I should maybe chime in and say I’m not exactly too happy with the ableism here either. I mean, seeing as we have no real way of knowing whether historical/religious figures actually were mentally ill or not (unless they were diagnosed as such). Also, I’m kinda getting the implication that bad religious shit is inherently related to/caused by mental illness, which is not a great thing to imply for a few reasons (the main two being that it casts unwarranted aspersions on mentally ill people, and that it minimises the actual responsibility of the figure in question for their actions/beliefs). Even if this wasn’t intended, it still comes across, to me at least, as uncomfortable at best. It’s also just sort of gratuitous, in that it doesn’t really add much to the commentary I reckon. Like I don’t see how modifying/removing it would really detract from the rest, especially given the kinda gross implications. Even if you think I’m misinterpreting it here, then I’d argue that means it should at least be edited to make the actual point clearer. Anyway yeah, hope that’s okay 🖤 ASELAនិយាយ 🖤 05:33, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
- Oxy you can also learn a thing or two from Asela, who through reason and sound argument (something Oxy you seem unable to do) has convinced me to reword the phrase. You'll also note that it doesn't cost me anything to change my position (someone I don't think I've ever seen you do Oxy). Thanks Asela I'll reword the text. ShabiDOO 05:44, 14 July 2021 (UTC)
Thank you, Shabi[edit]
I appreciate the rewrite and I'm sorry for being a dick. — Oxyaena Harass 09:57, 14 July 2021 (UTC)