Talk:Boy Scouts of America/Archive1

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How do we set it up so that other terms lead to this article in the search box? I was mainly thinking boy scouts of america in lower-case, Boy Scouts (also in lower-case), BSA, Eagle Scout, and Venturing. ENorman 15:27, 24 March 2009 (EDT)

use redirect. There is a link on the edit bar below the edit window, but basically #REDIRECT [[new name here]].--En attendant Godot_{"To-morrow, when I wake, or think I do, what shall I say of to-day?"} 15:30, 24 March 2009 (EDT)

The atheist, agnostic bit...

OK, I'll bite on the homosexuality part because that was beaten to death by the media, but where is this info that atheists and agnostics aren't allowed in? I am an Eagle Scout and my troop had a few atheists, agnostics, and non-denominationals (I believe in Christ but I don't believe in religion types) in it. They just didn't participate in the benediction at the end (which never made sense for me, because it was an interfaith thing at best, I was raised Presbyterian, but there were more Methodists and Catholics outnumbered Protestants by at least 2-1, but the benediction was as generic as a Wesleyan prayer).

As I am typing this, however, I could see how some fundy loon Christian Evangelical scoutmaster or head of council could go on an Inquisitional rampage toeing the line that "a Scout is reverent" REQUIRES Scouts to be religious. I just haven't heard of it, that's all.

I guess I have just always viewed the "reverent" part of the Scout Law as a placeholder word at best, (i.e., if you believe in a faith, do your best to follow that faith, if you DON'T believe in one, just try to be respectful of those who do).

The Foxhole Atheist 15:32, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

It's plain as fucking day. http://www.bsalegal.org/duty-to-god-cases-224.asp

In case there is any confusion: "Scouting does not accept atheists and agnostics as members or adult volunteer leaders...the Boy Scouts of America will not employ atheists, agnostics, known or avowed homosexuals, or others as professional Scouters." ^{— Unsigned, by: Neveruse513 / talk / contribs} 15:53, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Holy flipping fuck! Someone hijacked my organization! Granted, the last time I was active was 15 years ago, but this is the first time I've EVER been aware of these requirements and standards. I am seriously pissed off and broken hearted... The Foxhole Atheist 16:52, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Hehe, which part of "do my duty to God and my Country" did you mumble as you drifted/worked your way through the system? It was quite a while back, but maybe less than 15 years ago, that an atheist parent sued on behalf of their atheist son, and lost. As I recall, this cost the BSA the funding they were getting from the United Way. ħuman 19:11, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Well, to be honest, I mumbled none of it. As I've said before, I became an atheist through my experiences in Iraq. That being said, I meant the "God" part when I said it. The thing that was the shocker for me was the religious requirements that have been appended to the different ranks. When I was a Webelo, for instance, I earned the Presbyterian Award as an optional thing, not as a full on requirement for advancement. I never had to "lead grace" to attain First Class. And so on.

What causes more befuddlement for me is, by mandating that religious views are incorporated at all levels, aren't they sowing seeds for more isolation as opposed to more diversity, even among religious groups? For instance, imagine a Christian Evangelical learning that their son has to "endure" a Jewish prayer before meals. Doesn't this obviously cause people who belong to a large organization like Scouting to "clique" off into their own isolated groups so that their particular faith is not challenged by another? It's just baffling...

Some of my best memories are things that happened during my scouting years (And NO, none of them involved molestation, homosexuality or pedophilia, thank you very much) and NONE of them have religion as the source of that happiness. It saddens me that the organization I was so proud of being in that I would put up with the jokes and derision at school for has taken such a hard line stance against the very principles that it brought me up on (i.e., tolerance, mercy, justice, etc.). The Foxhole Atheist 19:37, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

I wonder what the Boy Scouts' policy would be on admitting pagans. They would probably not disagree politically with an old soldiers' religion like the cult of Mithras or Sol Invictus. UPDATE: They have a little problem with Wiccans, at least those who do not break their oath to obey the Scout Law. ListenerX^TalkerX 20:06, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Well, that answers that. That was EXACTLY what I was talking about. Why do I feel such shame? The Foxhole Atheist 02:18, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Be as proud as I am of the time you spent in BSA, what you learned, and your accomplishments. That they fucked up big time when it was time to grow and change isn't our fault. That's where I learned to set fire to anything, sleep in a poncho in the rain and stay dry, run full speed through the woods int he dark, and numerous other "self-reliance" type things. ħuman 02:25, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Well, thanks for your words. It's just that I have a son now, and I was thinking about the experiences I would like him to have as he comes of age. I keep thinking of how cool it would be to connect with him on a level like being able to help him achieve Eagle rank and standing by as his Mom pinned it on his chest. Father fantasies, I know. I won't force anything, just make suggestions and lend support to his decisions. Who knows... He won't be old enough for Scouting for another 10 years. Maybe things will have chaned by then, or I can find a Troop for him where they won't require religious indoctrination like mine didn't. I guess there's always Campfire USA. The Foxhole Atheist 03:50, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Chances are that troops affiliated with the more "gentle" churches (like Congregational) or not even churches at all, pretty much run on a "don't ask, don't tell" thing, in other words, they ignore it. Of course, he'll still have to mumble the Oath a few times to make Tenderfoot, and maybe teach it to other young impressionable minds (but he'll also get to explain what "reverent" means in the most open-minded way?), but if it's a good troop with good adult leadership, national BSA will be none the wiser (sadly). ħuman 04:59, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

There are some semi-"underground" groups within Scouting that have taken to . . . bending some of the admissions rules. Or just creating their own versions of Scouting, independent of the main group. Try looking here for more details. I plan to do the same thing if I ever have a kid, of either gender. Researcher (talk) 08:08, 29 December 2009 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure it's a don't ask don't tell situation. I'm an atheist but as long as you don't go around yelling god is dead your fine. I'm first class tenderfoot by the way.Doublethink (talk) 21:30, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Eagle Scouts on RW

I'm curious, how many of us are Eagle scouts? I'm one, and there are several above. Tyrannis (talk) 15:42, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Despite the amount of time I devoted to the org, I only got to First Class. Researcher (talk) 15:58, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

I was in the Boy Scouts, but dropped out relatively early, because our Scout Master, while a nice guy, was really just running a Young Outdoorsmans' Club and not a Boy Scout Troop. In retrospect, I wish I had taken up the offer of a friend of my parents to join the troop he ran, and he was a highly decorated Scoutmaster. MDB (talk) 16:21, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

I got to Life + a few extra merit badges, but couldn't have made Eagle due to not being a citizen (a requirement for citizenship in the nation badge). Also my troop was falling apart by the time I was 15/16 or so. ħuman 16:27, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

I was really involved during Cub Scouts/Webelos, and earned the Arrow of Light award. I only made it to Tenderfoot in Boy Scouts because all we learned was tying knots. I did earn a merit badge for coin collecting. Aboriginal Noise ^{Theist, barely hanging by a nail} 16:54, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

Arrow of Light in Cub Scouts, then Eagle in Boy Scouts. I was very Scoutey, earning the Catholic Ad Altari Dei medal, the Paul Bunyan Award for felling and sectioning a tree, the 50 Mile Afoot-and-Afloat badge, and so on. Senior Patrol Leader and then Instructor for my troop. Merit badge counselor in summer camps. High-adventure summer camp one year. It makes me incredibly sad I couldn't send my son - should I ever have one - to the Scouts. But not as long as they have their policies on atheists and homosexuals in place.--^talk 20:24, 9 February 2010 (UTC)

I recieved my Eagle Scout September 11, 2007. During that time i got 23 merit badges, was in the Order of the Arrow, and was the Patrol Leader for the troop. In all honesty, i found the BSA to be an excellent organization, during which time i learned a great deal about leadership, survival skills, and organization. Despite that i found the indian woo to be down right grating (esspecially since the dining hall at our summer camp was built on an indian burial ground) and the religious crap to be boring and over bearing. despite that, several of the adult troop leaders were aware that i was an atheist and simply advised me to be low key about it and not discuss it. for my recommendation from a religious leader i got my shaolin kung fu teacher to right it for me, on the basis that shaolin is a branch of budhism (that was slightly stretching it, but whatever) and on my board of review when asked about my religious beliefs i simply stated that i believe "religion is a personal matter that should only be discussed with ones most intimate of relationships" which the troop leaders figured out was my way of saying "none of your damn buisness" any way, i have found my eagle scout to be useful, both with the skills i learned and a nifty little addition to my resume, but i still detest the hypocracy and discrimination within it--BenB (talk) 16:02, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

Currently Star and an Arrowman. I might try to see if my district will accept Pastafarianism as a religion, because otherwise I'm agnostic.fortunately, I'm in a fairly secular troop. --TheGreenWarrior (talk) 05:36, 28 September 2015 (UTC)