Information icon.svg

Nominations for the RationalMedia Foundation 2019 board of trustees election are now open!

Information icon.svg

RationalWiki has reached 7,000 articles!


From RationalWiki
Jump to: navigation, search

The See also section is better than the article. I think I wrote this, so screw it, I'm gonna delete it to honor the template. ħumanUser talk:Human 01:14, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

I expanded the history of Mexico a bit. Key events were missed by the original author.

Could use some section headers... ħumanUser talk:Human 04:44, 25 June 2011 (UTC)
Thanks! ħumanUser talk:Human 03:51, 28 June 2011 (UTC)
The grammar and spelling are horrendous. Already fixed that in the last two sections. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 17:59, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

Woo and Woomeisters[edit]

Would it be appropriate to put a new topic for woo and woo-promoters like Maria Sabina, one of the founders of the modern New Age/Spiritualist movement? You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 18:03, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

Why not? Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 18:34, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Yeah, I'll add the Oaxaca to this place. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 21:02, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

The link to Wikivoyage[edit]

What is there to say against it? Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 21:06, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

What do you mean? There was a double link. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 21:08, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Huh? Well there must have been dirt on my glasses. Glad we had a talk about that, though ;-) Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 21:11, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Yeah. It was exactly the same sentence and link at the top and bottom of the list, an accident from a coupla weeks ago when I was reformatting the list and deleting the "Dangerous States" and "Mild Travel Warnings" list. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 21:15, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Okay. I might have reverted you there by accident. For that I apologize. Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 21:17, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Nah, it's fine. Forgive and forget. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 21:20, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Great. Let's drink a tequila (the good one, not the cheap crap they sell in Europe) to that. Or a good rum, I am not picky ;-) Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 21:23, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
(hands mezcal) Oh boy, you sure about that? You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 21:26, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Given that my first day in Mexico, DF ended with a nightly drive through the city in an overloaded car with a drunk driver (well that was only the beginning of the fun part, the end involved vomiting into a toilet), I am not ;-) But let's see what you got there ;-) Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 21:29, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Ouch. But okay, just FYI, the stuff is stronger than tequila, and we there call it the Nectar of the Gods (or chocolate) because Aztec emperors and priests used to drink the stuff for ceremonies. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 21:37, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────Weren't Aztec emperors and gods often the same thing? Or am I remembering my visit to Teotihuacan (hope I did not misspell that) wrong? Also, I think I've had Mezcal before, but it wasn't the thing that got me... ;-) Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 21:55, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

  • They had total power and were worshipped as such, but they weren't considered gods, per sé. For example, Emperor Moctezuma/Montezuma believed Hernan Cortes to be the god Quezacoatl (you're not alone in the spellings, buddy) and showered him and his crew with lavish gifts.
  • No. You spell Teotihuacan perfectly. The hard names are worse. See the District of Tlacolula, State of Quintana Roo, Aztec Emperor Cuauthemoc (dammit, that's the worst name), Huitzlipotchi, Quezalcoatl, the list goes on and on...
  • Ahh. Well, if you visited the Federal District and the nearby Teotihuacan, then you definitely had mezcal at some point.
  • Your confusion between gods/emperors is understandable. Since it's a pre-Hispanic city, which was already abandoned and ruined by the time the Aztecs started to build Tenochtitlan and found the city, there must have been information about past rulers (?). And pretty common, is that emperors had this annoying habit of calling themselves son of a one god or the other.

You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 22:10, 24 October 2015 (UTC)

Ah I seem to have mixed up the words priest and god there... What surprised me a lot about Mexico was how totally different different parts of it are from each other... There is hardly a thing (apart from people speaking Spanish) that Yucatan has in common with the DF in my perception... But the same is true even for smaller Latin American countries... In fact in some Central American countries someone from the East would have considerable trouble even understanding someone from the West... And they are only five hundred kilometers or so apart... Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 22:31, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
That is very true for the whole country. My parents were born in a tiny rural town 45 minutes away from the capital of Oaxaca, the nearest major city. This little town, San Juan Guelavia.. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 22:36, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
What a sprawling metropolis! ;-) But it does indeed have a street named after Benito Juarez (picture and quote of whom I have already seen in a hotel in Managua, of all places) Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 22:39, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
Well it does make sense. Benito was born in Oaxaca and is the only indigenous president in the history of Mexico. If you see the flag for the state of Oaxaca, you can see his most famous quote - "El respecto al derecho ajeno es paz." circling the seal. He also fought for the rights of indigenous people all over the country as an outspoken early activist, he having been born a poor Zapoteco native. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 23:44, 24 October 2015 (UTC)
I knew his background, but I didn't know he was born in Oaxaca (btw, what's with all the "x" being pronounced all over the place? There is Pemex which is pronounced differently from Mexico... wtf?). And his quote is of course spot on (and also the thing I saw in Managua)... So after Juarez no indigenous Mexican ever got to be President? Was there ever one who at least got close? Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 16:00, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
Mexico, originally deriving from Mexica, as the natives called it, was originally pronounced Me-shi-ca, or Meshico. In native languages, such as the endangered Nahuatl, the x sound is pronounced with a sh. When the Spaniards came over and conquered Mexico, they couldn't pronounce words the same way as the natives. The Spanish language is completely devoid of that sound, where sh is a strong ch sound. When they couldn't pronounce Mexico as Me-shi-co, they decided to pronounce it with a rough ji sound. So, from then on, the x was pronounced with a rough j consonant, replacing the sh version. and changing Me-shi-co to Me-ji-co. While English has no ji/jo/ja/je sounds as pronounced in Spanish, the x is instead pronounced in English as a Mek-si-co. As for Juarez, yeah, no other indigenou person ever made it into the Presidency. Vicente Fox, Felipe Calderon, Enrique Peňa Nieto, all of them without an ounce of brown, as I'd say. I'd say, though, that some indigenous might have been close in winning primaries, I doubt any have even been candidates since. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 16:16, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
Yeah I know how Mexico is pronounced in Spanish ;-) (spent long enough learning the language) but Pemex (which if I am not mistaken is short for Petroleo de Mexico) is pronounced with an English "x" sound... What's up with that? Also as for Nahuatl being endangered... Aren't there still more thaen one Million people who speak it as a first language? And if I recall correctly some museums even have signage in Nahuatl (and Maya languages in Yucatan)... So maybe it is not as alive and kicking as it used to be, but a government who wishes to "save" it could easily do it imho... Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 16:25, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
Huh. I remember a few years back there was some furor over the language, since so few spoke it. I only know a few words from that language. You mean to tell me the tamales were spiked?! Say hi! Look here! 19:28, 25 October 2015 (UTC)
Well according to Wikipedia at least one variety of it is spoken by more thaen a million people. But in the grand scheme of things no state has more thaen 10% of the population speak it... And the thing that is most important for languages are their demographics... Irish Gaelic for instance seems to have turned the corner as more and more urban middle class people speak it. Unless I am much mistaken many - though not all - indigenous American languages are mostly spoken by poor rural people. Guaraní of course being the most notable exception as it is the de facto second language of almost all Paraguayans regardless of class or ethnicity... Avengerofthe BoN (talk) 19:38, 25 October 2015 (UTC)