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Talk:Anti-vaccination movement

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Take this form. Should I improve it?[edit]

The link is here. Answer honestly. — Unsigned, by: 88.115.126.5 / talk / contribs

If you want my honest opinion, the age cohorts are screwy (non-standard) and it doesn't allow respondents to give details of positive symptoms they might think vaccines produce. — Dysk (contribs) 12:54, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

Question[edit]

To what extent does the anti-vaccination movement show the success of vaccination? If 'people in general' have never knowingly encountered 'someone suffering from the effects of having had a disease which can be vaccinated against (or a relative of such who mentions it)' they might be more inclined to believe the woo/not see the point of vaccination. Anna Livia (talk) 12:51, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

I know lots of people that "suffered" a disease that can vaccinated for: myself, my sister and every child in the school I went as a kid. The result: 5 days free from school and figuring out how to entertain my boredom in bed. What's all the hyteria about? it used to be considered a mild disease before the vaccine because it is a mild disease. Then I know people that suffer from vaccine injury and they're still suffering to this day, for unlike measles, their acquired autoimmune conditions will be their sidekick for the rest of their lives. If the media covered vaccine injury like they cover "measles outbreaks" of 3 unrelated people no one would vaccinate anymore. 145.64.134.242 (talk)
Got any statistics to back those "vaccine injuries" up buddy? Also Survivorship bias. Have a read of that. ℕoir LeSable (talk) 15:49, 4 April 2019 (UTC)
Look up the "healthy patient bias" and understand why it's no wonder that treatments for the healthy (what vaccines are) inevitably appear to have excellent results. The average health of the population in the West had been constantly improving since 1900 due to numerous confounding factors. Measles mortality rates when the vaccine was introduced in the 70's had already dropped by 95% without any "miraculous" injections, but still the party line is that "vaccienës save lives". Rather, vaccines took the credit for all the radical daily life improvements (refrigeration, pasteurisation, sewage system, etc.) that had already saved the bulk of the lives long before vaccines were massively used.145.64.134.242 (talk)
Vaccines combat viral diseases, dipshit, not pathogenic ones. Such measures won't do shit for viral diseases like smallpox for instance. Get a fucking clue. Oxyaena Harass 09:15, 5 April 2019 (UTC)
To some extent it is a combination of improving the human environment (the sewage system and cholera, pasteurisation and TB, refrigeration and botulism ) and also immunisation: while some 'vaccine injury' in the past will have been otherwise recorded or will have been masked by other illnesses - and consider the recently announced success of the HPV vaccine.
Putting my original question another way - does anyone reading this talk page know anyone who had a life-changing bout of 'an infectious disease' for which there was or is a vaccine (or equivalent process for other types of transmissible disease)? Anna Livia (talk) 13:58, 5 April 2019 (UTC)

Italy[edit]

This needs updating 'The new law is still being discussed by the parliament, as of June 2017.'

There was somethingin a newspaper in the last few days I read on a train about an anti-vaxer who caught chickenpox. Anna Livia (talk) 10:18, 22 March 2019 (UTC)

@Anna Livia Instead of complaining about it, why don't you do it then? All you seem to do is comment on talk pages anyways. No offense of course, but it would be prudent of you to start providing constructive edits given you often notice articles that need updating and the like. Oxyaena Harass 09:17, 5 April 2019 (UTC)
I am mostly active elsewhere in the wikiverse and do not have the requisite RW snark style - and contributing to the talk pages can be constructive given that wikis are collaborative (and other people may know more about the subject etc).
Horses for courses - and good messengers are hard to come by as they say. Anna Livia (talk) 10:57, 5 April 2019 (UTC)

Actual issues with vaccines; Hepatitis[edit]

I'd just like to point out, but I have no idea how to properly incorporate this into the article, that there were a few notable cases of vaccines causing problems. The earliest being that case in the 1920's or so where improper storage made the vaccines deadly, which is why thiomersal was added in the first place. Ignoring things that happened before our grandparents were more than toddlers, the most notable cases involved the Hepatitis B vaccine in the late 70's and early 80's, which was a blood derived vaccine... created before HIV was known to medicine. Eventually the blood-derived vaccine was pulled from the market, although it's believed that the processing did kill off the HIV proteins. Related to this was the conspiracy theory that the Hep B vaccine was actually a ruse to infect gay men with HIV.

Less related was the cure for Shistosomiasis, aka "blood in my urine" disease caused by a parasite that has a lifecycle that requires both snails and humans for some bizarre reason (if it turns out that it's intelligent design, it's from a god that absolutely HATES humanity). In Egypt, having been so thoroughly infected that people used to think menstruation was something boys did too, a massive health campaign involving injections of a cure was launched. But Egypt, not being the wealthiest of countries, reused the needles, which resulted in Hepatitis C becoming endemic there. It wasn't exactly a vaccine, but that's mostly a technicality.

So... how to add? CoryUsar (talk) 06:50, 21 April 2019 (UTC)

I think the best way to present it would be as come kind of risk benefit demonstration. Nothing in the world is utterly risk free - not even getting out of the bath. It would be dishoent to suggest otherwise.
So how many thousands, or millions have been helped by vaccines and how many people have been harmed? My guess would be that getting out of the bath is more risky than having a shot. Hubert (talk) 16:54, 26 April 2019 (UTC)

Del Bigtree should be DIscussed here[edit]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/anti-vaxxer-del-bigtree-got-his-start-on-the-tv-show-the-doctors

https://fox40.com/2019/04/24/hundreds-converge-on-the-capitol-to-voice-their-opinions-on-vaccination-exemptions-bill/

https://www.spokanepublicradio.org/post/inland-journal-april-18-2019-vaccine-safety-pt-1-del-bigtree

https://q13fox.com/2019/02/20/hundreds-sign-up-to-speak-at-hearing-on-vaccine-exemptions/

https://www.newsweek.com/measles-outbreak-update-oregon-california-lawmakers-work-pass-vaccine-laws-1405351

As of 2018 Del Bigtree has been credited for sparking various Vaccine protests in the USA

-- Added under People, but they might deserve their own entry.--CogitoNotStirred (via telepathy) 03:31, 8 May 2019 (UTC)

Most definitely. This guy is a menace to society. Some of what he says can be interpreted as a call for violence, as the language is very over the top. --It's-a me, Lgm sigpic.png LeftyGreenMario!(Mod) 04:05, 8 May 2019 (UTC)