Talk:Orson Scott Card

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Oh how I hate when people I enjoy[edit]

turn out to be sorta conservative, religious types. I mean, i get he's no Ann Coulter, but still...How can any rational person be against gay marriage?--Pink mowse.pngGodotTue pour toujours, et tu veux vivre aussi. 00:56, 23 October 2011 (UTC)

I don't understand how anyone with enough grey cells to open their eyes can like this guy's stuff. Read Ender's Game (& I think one other) years ago and thought it was the most infantile crap. Enid Blyton in space. Scream!! (talk) 01:00, 23 October 2011 (UTC)
Same-sex marriage opponents often state that allowing gay couples to marry would be "destroying the family," etc., but I haven't encountered anyone except Card who advocates what Sharron Angle called a "Second Amendment solution" to the same-sex marriage issue. To my knowledge, Ann Coulter has yet to suggest violently overthrowing the government over same-sex marriage, and thus I daresay Card scores higher in the unbelievably irrational opinions department. Shtrominer (talk) 00:45, 25 November 2011 (UTC)
Ender's Game is a bit overrated, but he has written a few good books (the Alvin stuff). Of course, don't go expecting "hard sf". By the way, someone should make a mention of that Hamlet thing he did recently that's been getting a bit of attention. Woodgod (talk) 14:48, 2 December 2011 (UTC)
I feel that Ender was a stand-in for that sad nerd who thinks that he gets bullied for being smarter than everyone else, and a lot of the people who like Ender's Game are sad nerds themselves; I know I was that nerd when I was 13! — Unsigned, by: / talk / contribs

──────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────── Back to WfG's original comment: same happened to me with Neal Asher. Space Opera stuff but quite enjoyable in an escapist sort of way & he turns out to be a right wing wanker. Scream!! (talk) 10:34, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

There is a lot of critical discussion amongst artsy types about whether you can truly separate the "art" from the "artist". It's in fact nothing particularly new. Take Richard Wagner for example, who was a noted anti-semite and as such well respected within Nazi Germany - yet his music counts Stephen Fry and Gustav Mahler amongst fans, despite both being culturally and religiously Jewish respectively. And today it's still popular among people who don't agree with any of Wagner's personal racist views. So, the question is, can you, personally (although in a generic sense, not speaking to anyone in particular), separate the art from the artist and accept Card's writing despite some of his views? Particularly if those views don't readily transfer to the page in a preachy way? It's a genuinely interesting choice you have to make, and I suppose there's no one right answer. Scarlet A.pnggnostic 10:39, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
John Scalzi did a pretty good piece on this subject. To be fair, there are talented writers who are much, much worse people than Card (William Mayne springs to mind) Balaam (talk) 12:13, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
I would suspect it depends on what you like in their works, and why, and frankly, how much. If you find deep connection with an artist, and he happens to also be racist, that does not mean he didn't connect with you on his view of love, or her view of pain, or a painting about suffering, or a price of music about loyalty. Those things are theirs irrespective of how they feel about money, god, or gays. On the otherhand, if it was the intellectual ideas you liked, and you then find they are born again christians or Scientologists where you say "wait, how can anyone with an intellect think that, since it's very anti intellectual" then it's probably more challenging. There are a host of religious people who I find compelling in their writing or paintings. But I think I have a harder time when someone who either has not thought about it, or has thought about it and thinks God runs around answering prayers about football games but not ending suffering of innocent children in Cambodia - when such a person is trying to write about language or literary criticism, or other soft academic work I can't fathom agreeing with them.Pink mowse.pngGodot Malaka 18:24, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
Cough. Also nowhere near as bad as Lovecraft, but worth a cough as well. Oh, and cough, cough! I wonder which authors I read aren't wingnuts sometimes. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 18:31, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
I imagine that one of the biggest factors might be if you feel comfortable financially rewarding someone for their work. Wagner is dead, so isn't getting a dime from when you go to see The Ring Cycle. Or perhaps you disagree with a Hollywood director so become a littler "looser" with what you will and will not get from The Pirate Bay instead of the cinema. Because in terms of paying for the art, that is directly going to the artist, and it's not like the art itself is cashing the cheque at the end of the day. So you can't separate the two as willingly there. "I feel I should pay for this fine book, but can't stand the idea of the money eventually worming its way to the douchebag author". Scarlet A.pngtheist 18:47, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
I suppose the flip side to that is "I am paying for the book, I am compensating the author only for services offered and these services don't involve me asking their opinion on gay marriage". YMMV. Scarlet A.pngtheist 18:50, 5 December 2011 (UTC)
I found out awhile ago that Card is a Mormon and that he vehemently opposes homosexuality even with this though I still like the book Ender's Game and one of his most recent books called The Lost Gate.
Hey, so the original version of Ender's Game used the n-word in a "It's okay to say it if I'm 'just joking'" setting. I'm not part of your active community, so I didn't edit the page. But if you're covering his bigotry, it might be relevant to mention that.
Though in context that's characters using racial slurs in a particular way. How much that's Card's own voice is one for students of literary criticism to whine about for hours on end. Unless you think the mere presence of "nigger" out of any and all contexts brands someone an unforgivable racist. Scarlet A.pngnarchistModerator 10:21, 27 September 2012 (UTC)

On fan-fiction[edit]

A bit vehement in his opinions of it - he's firmly against fan fiction and threatens to sue people who publish it (even on the internet). Yet pretty hypocritcal in that he calls JK Rowling an evil witch for doing just that. He is quite a prat. Scarlet A.pngd hominem 21:54, 28 May 2012 (UTC)


He's been hired by DC comics to write superman: not appreciated Scream!! (talk) 22:28, 11 February 2013 (UTC)

I heard they eventually decided not to take him because of his absolutely toxic views? — Unsigned, by: / talk / contribs

New outburst of crazy[edit]

I like the "Oh this is just an experiment in fictional thinking" thing at the end, like he's trying to cast blame away from his insanity. — Unsigned, by: / talk / contribs

I was wondering where the insanity was (he' just repeating points already done to death - and much more eloquently, in fact - by Nassim Taleb and Nate Silver) until I hit "So today we have a president whose faith in the good will of Muslim..." then I figured we're hitting the downhill slope. And yes, that downhill ride doesn't disappoint. Scarlet A.pngpostate 13:26, 4 June 2013 (UTC)
That is some crazy crazy. I'm trying to find an actual statement he makes that one could wager on, but there's nothing concrete except for Michelle is the next president. Does anyone know if Card is willing to make massive prediction bets? I'd like to be rich. Hipocrite (talk) 13:36, 4 June 2013 (UTC)
It's hard to imagine how American press coverage would be different if Obama were a Hitler- or Stalin-style dictator -- man what. --Pere Ubu (talk) 18:11, 13 October 2014 (UTC)

Ender's Game[edit]

Can we all just see the irony in the fact that he is homophobic and wants gay people to be arrested. But he also wrote Ender's Game, a book about how intelligent life can misunderstand each other and that genocide is wrong?Doublethink (talk) 20:46, 4 December 2018 (UTC)