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Talk:Freemason

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Is this still "under construction" or are we allowed to add to it now? weaseLOIdWeaselly.jpg~ 09:42, 9 November 2008 (EST)

Hello! You can add anytime! The "Construction" tab is just there to let others know that it is a new article and it's being worked on so someone won't delete it! Cheers!--MAstEr oF pUPetStalk! 16:57, 9 November 2008 (EST)

{{cn}}[edit]

Just so you know, there will never be any references for the citation needed points. I made them all up. Cheers!--MAstEr oF pUPetStalk! 17:19, 9 November 2008 (EST)

Masons and Shriners[edit]

Doesn't this article conflate them in a few places? Are the two organizations the same, entangled, or independent? ħumanUser talk:Human 18:59, 30 November 2008 (EST)

As I understand it, Shriners are a sort of US subset of Freemasonry. ToastToastand marmite 19:11, 30 November 2008 (EST)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Arabic_Order_of_the_Nobles_of_the_Mystic_Shrine
An appendant body of the masons apparently. So shriners are masons, but masons aren't necessarily shriners. Couldn't be simpler :P ArmondikoVnarchist 19:13, 30 November 2008 (EST)
Thought so. ToastToastand marmite 19:18, 30 November 2008 (EST)
Thanks! ħumanUser talk:Human 20:48, 30 November 2008 :
A Master Mason is one who has completed all three degrees of Masonry and belongs to at least one Lodge of Masons.
There are two rites of passage through which a Master Mason may further his enlightenment and practice the principle tenets of Masonry: The Scottish Rite (29 more degrees = 32) and the York Rite(10 more degrees). Only Master Masons are invited to join these concordant bodies. Both York Rite and Scottish Rite continue or intensify the value and practice of charity. In the US, both Rites own and operate independent charitable foundations. Two examples: Scottish Rite Scholarship Foundation and Early Life Speech & Language Clinics
After completing all of the degrees in the Rite, a Scottish Rite Mason or a York Rite Mason may be invited to join the "Shrine";also a concordant fraternity. Shriners operate the penultimate Masonic charity, the Shriners Hospitals for Children®
Recently, the Shrine eliminated the requirement to pass through one of the Rites first and now extend an invitation to all Master Masons to join the Shrine. It still holds true that all Shriners are Masons. mm3 21:10, 31 July 2018 (UTC)

(EST)

Masonic chapess lodges[edit]

Exist in the UK. — Unsigned, by: 82.44.143.26 / talk / contribs

It's not quite as straightforward as that - from wp:Freemasonry_and_Women
The United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE), and others concordant in that regular tradition, do not formally recognize any Masonic body that accepts women. The UGLE has stated since 1998 that two English women's jurisdictions are regular in practice (The Order of Women Freemasons and The Honourable Fraternity of Ancient Freemasons), except for their inclusion of women, and has indicated that, while not formally recognized, these bodies may be regarded as part of Freemasonry, when describing Freemasonry in general.
So the Order of Women Freemasons is OK, except for the fact that they include women. Fall Down must be proud. Bob Soles (talk) 16:46, 4 February 2010 (UTC)

Slightly more liberal than the Catholic Church then. And 'others not elsewhere specified'? — Unsigned, by: 82.44.143.26 / talk / contribs

Degrees[edit]

Is it worth expanding the degrees with things such as the explanation of each degree's tracing board and working tools? Maybe also the symbolism of the apron and Willaim Schaw's influence in converting mason's lodges into freemasonry. But not the signs, tokens and worlds, obviously. --PsyGremlinParla! 13:44, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Hmm, personally I think that the article covers what is necessary to understand the group basically. You're more than welcome to add in more detail if you'd like, particularly with this Willaim Schaw since he sounds important. Stilldeciding (talk) 03:33, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Freemasons admit they're the Illuminati?[edit]

This video...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wu2bJaUO4_E

A freemasion EXPLICTLY stated they're an Illumianti member? It personally seems like it to me. — Unsigned, by: TemplarJLS / talk / contribs

It's on YouTube. It MUST be true. --PsyGremlinTal! 03:23, 15 October 2014 (UTC)

Quote-Mining[edit]

Should'd we mention Anti=masons habits of Quote-Mining?--サトセレ (talk) 13:03, 28 October 2014 (UTC)

Footage of Masonic Ceremony exposed?[edit]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tscNOz7AH0g

It's in Turkish, but the translation is in the description.

It claims to be footage of a "satanic" Freemason Ritual (like they're claiming to drink the blood of a goat and chanting satanic prayers in hebrew in the second part), but, not knowing Turkish, I have no idea if the trandslation, of both the narrative and the ceremony in the first part, found in the video description, is true.--ReptoidKiller (talk) 10:10, 1 December 2014 (UTC)

I'm not impressed. The footage is grainy at best, and since you have to rely on a translation that, as you admit, might be wrong, then I'd seriously question its credibility. Even if the translations are correct, the footage is so grainy and shoddy that there is no possible way to verify if it is correct. I could tell you right now that I am drinking goat blood and murdering smurfs, but since you cannot see me behind my computer, there's absolutely no reason you should believe me. And since I know the truth (that I am not drinking goat blood and murdering smurfs), I'd say that assuming I am wrong is correct. Reckless Noise Symphony (talk) 10:20, 1 December 2014 (UTC)
It looks to me like a simple First Degree initiation. I have no idea under what Constitution or Grand Lodge Turkey falls (I assume their own), so there might be some difference in rituals. But within the first few seconds it's clear the Lodge is open in the First Degree only, and everybody knows that the goat-blood drinking only happens from the Third Degree upwards. PsyGremlinTal! 10:46, 1 December 2014 (UTC)
I know I'm REALLY late to this, but I'm pretty sure that he was talking about the 5:56 mark where the Goat Blood drinking bit happens (By 33rd degree masons, surprise, surprise). Looks really grainy, and all we get as an indication that it's "satanic" in nature is the narrator and an extremely grainy video is a bunch of hooded people sacrificing an anmal on a pentagram altar. Looks staged to me though, like the mock-ritual the other guys do.
Anyone got the original source for this video? It's been going around so much that I kind of want it tracked down.--174.25.43.47 (talk) 02:59, 4 September 2015 (UTC)

Shriner admits states he worships Lucifer[edit]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2OXuXTkBNQ

Note: It's true, he did. Correct me if I'm wrong though, but while Freemasonry probably has luciferians in it, it's NOT a luciferian organization itself.--ReptoidKiller (talk) 16:48, 8 December 2014 (UTC)

I think they kind of leave the "personality" of the "supreme being" up to the individual to figure out for themselves, kind of similar to scientology, but orthodox "regular" freemasonry generally mandates belief in a higher power and the mystical wisdom the rituals are meant to impart seem to relate to an implicit "order of the universe" with a sometimes explicit teaching of a "Grand Architect". So it is a religion unto itself. Whether there is some "esoteric" doctrine hidden from the general initiates has been the matter of much speculation, but it is easy to say freemasonry is in fact a fundamentally religious institution. Because of the similarity to scientology, in that one can be an "athiest" scientologist or a "catholic" "scientologist", I think freemasonry holds itself to be non-religious. It tolerates other "religions" in other words basically. One can be a "catholic" "freemason" or a "protestant" "freemason". But if you accept this then scientology also isn't a religion for the same reason. Other than this distinction, I'm not sure why they say they're non-religious except maybe to avoid social stigma; there seems to be no real rational reason to accept the conclusion. Freemasonry is a religion.LogicMaster777 (talk) 03:13, 20 February 2015 (UTC)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBFuEo0Jzd8 idiots

Initiation[edit]

I'd like to contribute to the initiation topic. since the European ritual differs greatly from the american or Brithish. In regular Dutch masonry for example the initiation happens in formal clothing.

The initiation is the point of reference for each degree Mason. They share the same experience in a different time, but in the 'same' place. This way symbols used and experiences from other masons can be lived through easily. One example, the blindfold symbolizes the initiate walking/'traveling' in darkness. Some people see it as a symbol for bad times in life, other people see it as aa low point in their spiritual life.

Jaldabaoth (talk) 09:22, 22 October 2015 (UTC)

Christopher Knight and Robert Lomas.[edit]

Have just read The Second Messiah - 'a universal theory of Masonry' bringing in the Templars, Jesus' brother James and the Egyptians as part of the Masonic history and the English Masons suppressed the true history of Masonry (they also wrote The Hiram Key): should there be some mention on the page (or 'Authors of fanciful theories involving the Freemasons')?

I spotted a few errors of the 'check in ordinary encyclopedia' level so 'make of that what you will.' As with other such theories - various research has been done, some parts are true, but the connections of the whole are flawed or even wrong. 86.191.125.144 (talk) 13:54, 15 February 2017 (UTC)

Masonic social life[edit]

Given how much time 'the Freemasons' will, if the conspiracy theorists are believed, have to devote to organising the world to suit their interests it is a wonder that they have any opportunity to dress up for their ceremonies and have general socialising/networking (which, one would expect, will be part of the reasons for people electing to join them). 86.146.99.29 (talk) 09:48, 2 August 2017 (UTC)

Napoleon[edit]

Is there any proof that Napoleon was a Mason like the article says?

M2nd1 (talk) 02:09, 7 July 2019 (UTC)

John Cleese quote[edit]

Note the reference to 'colour TVs' (ie it was still an emerging 'accessible technology'). Anna Livia (talk) 17:01, 13 August 2019 (UTC)