User talk:ParkerPeter/Not real communism

Topic

I'll first go over the problems with the draft, Maduro and Chavez were socdems, not communists, and North Korea isn't communist either. Communism is defined as a classless, stateless society where everyone has equal access to resources and there is equality of opportunity, unlike what you find under capitalism. None of the so-called socialist states of the past century have even approached that, and this shit draft page doesn't even cover this very basic level of nuance, it consists of nothing more than a fucking strawman. — Oxyaena ^Harass 08:28, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

@Oxyaena I think that you believe that the current draft says that Venezuela and North Korea are undoubtedly communist countries, but that's not what it says. What it says is that "that's not real communism!" is a common response to people pointing at certain countries as examples of failure of communism. (Note that the draft itself is not saying those countries are communist.) This is a situation I heard very often when people are discussing communism: one side praises communism; the other sides claims certain countries are example of communism failure; the first side replies they are not examples. I was planning to add a section arguing that indeed almost no country actually implemented pure communism, giving a couple of examples of countries which are commonly pointed as communist. Since you seem informed you could help me doing so.--ParkerPeter (talk) 21:09, 9 December 2019 (UTC)

I don't see the need for this article, things here are a lot more complex than "it's not real communism" which is a strawman. Hell the entirety of the left communist movement see the USSR as being simple state capitalism, not socialism. — Oxyaena ^Harass 06:38, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

As I mentioned, I heard this kind of conversation many times (almost in any debate on communism at some points "that's not real commuism" is said) so I am actually surprised that this topic wasn't already on RW.--ParkerPeter (talk) 07:20, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

It depends on who's saying it and what their perspective is, not all communists are tankies or even Marxists for that matter. — Oxyaena ^Harass 07:41, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

oxy you are prone to make the not real communism argument yourself, dont expect it to agree with your concept of communism. EK (talk) 14:45, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

This will likely not ever become an article, but I thought I'd be nice and preserve it for the user.—Hamburguesa con queso con un cara  (talk • stalk) 14:49, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

@ParkerPeter Given the phrasing, the article implies that the examples listed are/were communist. This is false, at least to a certain degree. Venezuela under Chavez and now Maduro is poorly implemented socialism/social democracy with a slight authoritarian flavor, and while North Korea was communist for a time their current system, Juche, could be more accurately described as hereditary theocratic fascism with the bureaucratic trappings of Soviet style communism. ☭Comrade GC☭^{Ministry of Praise} 15:02, 10 December 2019 (UTC)

@GrammarCommie How would you rephrase the article so that it does not implies that the examples listed are/were communist?--ParkerPeter (talk) 17:46, 11 December 2019 (UTC)

@ParkerPeter Given that's most of the content of the article, I would think if I rewrote it there would be nothing left. Unless you have other examples??? ☭Comrade GC☭^{Ministry of Praise} 20:20, 11 December 2019 (UTC)