Forum:RW's logo

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Hello everyone! I worked some time at the Russian section of RW, after this I decided to start a separate Russian project (now is unavailable, but usually it is) with similar goals. I want to discuss possibility of using this logo in the separate project. Is anybody against?

I support. Тy^Talk. 16:27, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

The only way that the logo could be used is if it was part of a Foundation project. Which is something we have talked about, are you no longer interested in spear-heading a ru.rationalwiki.org project? Tmtoulouse (talk) 16:29, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

I gather that ru.rationalwiki.org is still on the cards. The gun may have been jumped with respect to the wiki-site address. ^{d hominem} 16:32, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Tmtoulouse, I am interested to develop ru.rationalwiki.org project, but at separate web-domain and with some freedom of activity. I assure you that my activity is agreed with the goals of RW very much. So I want that my work will be completely legitimate without any doubts of this from other editors of RW. Of course, it is possible that they may not completely understand what I am actually doing, but I cannot explain for everyone what I am doing: my work can to turn into unending explanations. Of course, I can talk about the Russian section with a few users, which are know, what is Russian RW if there are some questions. But not with all users.

Probably, creation a separate domain can solve all this problems. After creation of this domain I can return to RW. The logo I'll delete from new site at a few minutes.--Bertran (talk) 17:03, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Of course, I don't want to make a work that probably will need its remake. So, now I am stopping my contribution to any of both projects until response about ru.rationalwiki.org.--Bertran (talk) 21:01, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

I'd just like to point out that Google translates "Documenting the full range of crank ideas" in Russian as "Review of the full spectrum of ideas of science freaks." Blue (pester) 21:05, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

I know. Points 1-4 at [1] are not translation from English because they are corrections. You can also see, that point 3 is new and some points from English version were combined. These are not the same points, but similar. Literary translation from English you can find at РациоВики.--Bertran (talk) 21:14, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Bertran, I know you got frustrated with people questioning the need for your Russian language translation project here on RW. I supported you, although you seem thin skinned for someone trying to work on a collaborative project. I don't support you going and starting a competing website that trades on the RationalWiki Foundation's trade name and intellectual property. You're certainly free to start any site you wish and use appropriately licensed RW material according to the license. However, that will not include using the RationalWiki Foundation's trade name or any similar name, the RW logo, and certain other RW Foundation intellectual property. I think you should continue your project here on the RW site itself in order to avoid inevitably problematic uses of the RationalWiki Foundation's trade name and intellectual property. What do you think? User:Nutty Roux/sigtalk 21:59, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

As I understand, Russian users who try to work at collaborate project, just haven't enough time to make regular contributions. I think that one of the main problems with Russian section is uncertain legitimate status: Russian articles are among English articles, so, it is hard to understand what they are doing here.

The best solution for me could be creation of separate domain ru.rationalwiki.org. See, for example, CreationWiki's Russian section. If there are a lot of problems with this, I will develop a separate project, which will be friendly to RW.--Bertran (talk) 22:24, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Are you willing to spear-head and administer an ru.rw? Tmtoulouse (talk) 22:33, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm all for a Russian RationalWiki, but I agree that, if there is to be one, it should be incorporated under, not independent from, the RationalWiki Foundation in order to use our name and image. How we would incorporate something like such a project, however, would be open to discussion. AnarchoGoon ^{Swatting Assflys is how I earn my living} 22:58, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

I am also all for a Russian RationalWiki (I'm the one who started the "no English but machine translated from Spanish in the English-Only Movement article" meme, but as also noted, unless it's controlled by the RationalWiki Foundation, then it shouldn't be allowed to trade on our name and logo. I feel that Bertran has at least two options ahead of him (these two being the most apparent) break off and not use our name or logo, or remain at rationalwiki.org, if we could get a ru.rationalwiki.org then all the better, but if he wants to keep our name and logo, he would need to stay fully a part of RationalWiki, and he can't really do that as an independent server that is not owned and controlled by the Foundation. --Eira ^{OMTG! _{The Goat be Praised.}} 23:45, 25 March 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I am.--Bertran (talk) 07:15, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

To ÑR. Ok, I see that point 2 at the new site and at РациоВики completely coincide. I think, that this is the best translation into Russian. If you want to discuss it, please, write to Talk:РациоВики.--Bertran (talk) 15:05, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Bertran, I don't read Russian so I don't see exactly what you're referring to. I do see you're no longer using the logo, which is good. I thought you were going to continue working on the Russian translations here on RW? We'll figure something sensible out as far as making space for you goes. Come on back. User:Nutty Roux/sigtalk 15:09, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Yes, I will return after creation a separate domain ru.rw.org (or rw.org/ru etc.). And I'll delete all the content at the new site.--Bertran (talk) 15:39, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

OK, some asshole blocked me for 3 months, but anyway. No. The RW logo cannot be used on any site that is not owned or approved by the RationalWiki Board. Approval requires a request to the Board to consider it at one of their copious meetings, and Trent's personal approval, since he owns the logo. Now, using it on ru.RationalWiki.org, a subspace of this operation, would be acceptable, but as I understand it, such a space requires a new installation of mediawiki, hence our "special" language pages in the mainspace. If a contributor is frustrated by that mode, they can fork the project, of course - but they aren't welcome to our copyrighted logo for their fork. If Trent is willing and able to help build a ru.RW.org subspace, by all means, use the logo presented for it. ħuman 04:52, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

, except for the first sentence. ListenerX^TalkerX 04:57, 26 March 2011 (UTC)

Decision

So, what is the final decision of RW? It is planned a separate domain for Russian section or it is not? Both of the variants are Ok (though second variant implies me to develop the new site), just I think that I must to know and to go on.--Bertran (talk) 08:59, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

I'm afraid that it seems to be dependent on a meeting of the RW foundation. We are trying to arrange a meeting which is convenient for all the members. As we are in differing time zones it is proving difficult to set up.--Bob^{Spring is sprung!} 13:39, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

Pretty much what Bob said. We will make our decision within the next couple weeks and get back to you. Gooniepunk2010 ^{Oi! Oi! Oi!} 13:54, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

Ok. Thank you for responses.--Bertran (talk) 14:29, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

So, until considering of this, I'll continue my work. I'll add few tens of translations of responses from Mark Isaak's Index to creationist claims.--Bertran (talk) 17:45, 29 March 2011 (UTC)

Good luck either way. The separate server sounds good, so long as it's possible for the foundation to ensure that the site is well maintained. I.e someone can pull the plug if you, through no fault of your own, are no-longer able to maintain it. Concernedresident ^{omg!!! ponies!!!} 22:27, 2 April 2011 (UTC)

I did not take into account that separate domain requires a separate server. If so, then it will be a very responsible decision for the foundation.--Bertran (talk) 09:13, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

As I understand, actually, the new server is not required for a new domain.--Bertran (talk) 18:06, 3 April 2011 (UTC)

A separate installation of Media Wiki would be needed. When you're talking about commercial hosting, "separate server" is a more blurred concept. ^{d hominem} 18:08, 3 April 2011 (UTC)