Talk:Ustaše

Mission?

OK, so it's a well written article - although I have no idea as to how accurate it is - but, really, is it on mission? Does it do anything to enhance RW? I don't think so. Innocent Bystander (talk) 11:42, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

3. Explorations of authoritarianism and fundamentalism. Secret Squirrel (talk) 14:34, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

In defense of OP, a large number of our articles have nothing to do with debunking-- Token Conservative ^{Feminist Thought Police} 15:20, 13 September 2013 (UTC)

Oh, it's accurate. Trust me; these guys actually existed. My idea was to document authoritarianism, fundamentalism, fanatical racism and one of the most egregious episodes of genocide in Europe during the Holocaust. What, do I need to rephrase it? Serocco (talk) 02:56, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

I think it falls under point 3. The real problem w/ it is that it's a lengthy article with zero citations. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 03:00, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

I'll need some help with citations, 'cause I'm new here. How do I cite things here? Serocco (talk) 03:01, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

See here. Nebuchadnezzar (talk) 03:14, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

Thanks. I'll need help with citations, of course, but it's a start. Serocco (talk) 03:39, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

There was a small debate Here about the value of history articles. I think this horrible lot count as on-mission because of their influence on Croat politics and the Bosnian war. So, keep. Sophie^Wilder 07:09, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

PS - eighty years on and WWII still casts its shadow :(

So it's settled; we'll keep these assholes, but we'll need some citations. Also, more than just Bosnia; Slobodan Milosevic ran on the racist vote to become the Serbian President, and we all know how that turned out for Yugoslavia after that. No thanks to the Ustase here for fucking about. Serocco (talk) 08:24, 14 September 2013 (UTC)

I think it could be on mission only as it relates to Holocaust denial or other forms of historical revisionism. In that regard, only the parts about their role in the Holocaust would be useful. –Aleksandr(a) Ehrenstein, Jewish Bolshevik 01:55, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

We've already decided to keep the entry. Serocco (talk) 04:46, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Comment

https://www.reddit.com/r/communism/comments/432vqq/commentary_on_role_of_the_catholic_church_in_the/ Herr FüzzyCätPötätö (talk/stalk) 18:35, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Jasenovac victim figure

So this edit (apparently from a Serb nationalist, judging by his one other edit) tries to argue about the number of victims at Jasenovac (which might be lacking a few diacritics). Do we have a good citation for any given figure? Or should we just report on the range of estimations and direct the reader to scholarly works on the issue? another Jewish conspiracy by (((Laurogeita Hamabost))) (talk) 16:39, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

1 edit and they are serb nationalist? AMassiveGay (talk) 17:15, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

Two edits that both hit into the same direction and nothing else. But regardless of that, they may indeed be right on the victim figure. So where are the refs? another Jewish conspiracy by (((Lavurogeita Hamabost))) (talk) 17:16, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

2 edits? A true patriot then. Where are the refs for the original claim? AMassiveGay (talk) 17:37, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

The article lacks sources overall and Jasenovac is a contentious issue, which is why I started this debate. Look, if you have a problem with my preventive block of a very likely Southern Slavic nationalist, you can coop me for it for all I care, but I thought it unlikely there'd come any good out of this BoN and I wanted to nip the Yugoslav wars in the bud before they take over RW. another Jewish conspiracy by (((Laurogeita Hamabost))) (talk) 17:45, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

they made 2 edits, neither particularly egregious, and you blocked them and accused them of being a serbian nationalist. On 2 edits. AMassiveGay (talk) 17:50, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

Can we please discuss the Jasenovac victim figure and the lack of sources instead of my blocking or not? Every sysop can unblock that person, besides it was a nine hour block, not the end of the world. another Jewish conspiracy by (((Laurogeita Hamabost))) (talk) 17:51, 15 August 2016 (UTC)

There seems to be a lack of a clear consensus (and an even greater lack of material online), so the article should mention the range of estimates. The WP article Jasenovac concentration camp expresses the uncertainties quite thoroughly. The higher claims seem to come from Serbs, which doesn't automatically invalidate them (Mihailo Marković said 700,000[1]), while the Croat Jozo Tomasevich has produced much lower figures. The Yugoslavs had reasons to suppress research after the war in the interests of harmony, and it's going to be hard to be exact (compare the considerable uncertainties about death figures under Stalin). Annquin (talk) 11:18, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

In case I was unclear, I don't like Croatian nationalists either and would probably have reacted in a similar way if the edits had indicated Croat nationalism. At any rate, the article should reflect what you just said. Good work! another Jewish conspiracy by (((Laurogeita Hamabost))) (talk) 16:13, 16 August 2016 (UTC)

DebateAltRight thinks we should mention the Muslim involvement

The OP trying to justify not adding it in themselves is great. FuzzyCatPotato of the Uncivilized Wedgies (talk/stalk) 03:11, 22 July 2017 (UTC)