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Talk:Alt-right glossary

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Globalist[edit]

I's my impression that only fascists use the word "globalist" these days. Am I wrong about that? If not, it warrants a more detailed entry. The link to Globalization would not suffice since it's a distinctly different topic. 2A02:908:3611:F5C0:7957:B5E2:2F02:C538 (talk) 04:20, 14 November 2019 (UTC)

Overlap[edit]

This seems to overlap with the manosphere glossary? I was going to add the MGTOW glossary to the manosphere glossary as well; I think both our additions belong in it, as there is obviously overlap (since none of these movements are progressive). Thoughts? Reverend Black Percy (talk) 00:46, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

That's correct; there is heavy userbase overlap. This article focuses on the political terms used. I would advise against merging. Political alt-righters rarely seem to use manosphere terms, and vice versa. FᴜᴢᴢʏCᴀᴛPᴏᴛᴀᴛᴏ, Esϙᴜɪʀᴇ (talk/stalk) 01:00, 3 December 2016 (UTC)

Add gestures?[edit]

There seem to be at least two alt-right gestures in use, one that looks like an "OK gesture", derived from Pepe, and one that signifies white power.[1] Bongolian (talk) 23:51, 29 April 2017 (UTC)

Looks like the OK gesture and white power gesture are the same thing. Though there's a some chance the OK sign is fake.[2] But given that the Pepe meme did it and alt-righters did it at the White House, it seems like it has traction. Bongolian (talk) 00:15, 30 April 2017 (UTC)
I'd say no for now -- give it a few months and see if they keep it up. 32℉uzzy; 0℃atPotato (talk/stalk) 05:03, 30 April 2017 (UTC)
OK Bongolian (talk) 06:04, 30 April 2017 (UTC)

"Special Snowflake"[edit]

Quite aside from the fact that it's ridiculous reaching, that's not even how a crematorium furnace works: ashes don't go up the main stack because they'd be no way for them to get to it from the individual furnaces. Given the other definitions that user has posted (particularly the ridiculous one for "cuck"), it's pretty obviously trolling. Nog Bogmire (talk) 00:42, 15 August 2017 (UTC)

So what should we do with it? Should we take the bogus definition out of the article entirely? (And plonk it here in the talk page for people to gawk at?) I mean, it wouldn't be the first individual term in the page to have a bloated section (though that one was particularly so), but it felt kind of like, I guess... a forum thread that's gotten way off track? I wouldn't mind if it got a trimming with the loppers. ~ 01:10, 15 August 2017 (UTC)
Well, someone's added a ref to it with a link to a Snopes article debunking it, that seems good. Nog Bogmire (talk) 01:12, 15 August 2017 (UTC)

I am the one who added that bit about the furnaces, and I would like to apologize for not doing enough research there. In my defense, however, the alt-right do make heavy use of Nazi codewords and iconography, so it only made sense to me that the phrase would have Nazi origins. Nevertheless, I still fucked up, and I'm sorry. NotYourAverageBoN (talk) 01:26, 17 August 2017 (UTC)

"Brownshirt"[edit]

So, upon reading the "Brownshirt" entry, this was my immediate response. "Wow, Godwin's law is so prevalent nowadays that even Nazis are comparing their enemies to Nazis." I just want to know if it would be appropriate to point this out in the main article as well. Please let me know. NotYourAverageBoN (talk) 17:16, 20 August 2017 (UTC)

Unnecessary additions[edit]

@everyone: Chill. This debate is merely about "which types of terms should be included in our glossary". No anger necessary here. Fuzzy "Cat" Potato, Jr. (talk/stalk) 17:25, 17 September 2017 (UTC)

My earlier discussion was unproductive, but I still think we should have some criteria for terms included on the glossary, as well as a resolution for whether to include the disputed terms (outrage, pandering, rational, useful idiot). Ideally, someone other than Nog Bogmire or myself could offer their two cents. CowHouse (talk) 03:24, 18 September 2017 (UTC)

SMOC[edit]

Does anyone in the alt-right actually say "SMOC"? CowHouse (talk) 15:41, 2 November 2017 (UTC)

Top quote[edit]

Is it legit? I mean, obviously he probably said that, but is that what it's about? —Kazitor, pending 21:32, 19 December 2017 (UTC)

It seems appropriate. I mean... it directly addresses a language obsessed with hate and seeming tough. ikanreed 🐐Bleat at me 22:37, 19 December 2017 (UTC)

Fashwave[edit]

Fashwave is a subgenre of synthwave, not of vaporwave. Very easily distinguished genres. Also, you're all monstrously stupid. — Unsigned, by: 204.186.70.175 / talk / contribs 02:44, 9 January 2018 (UTC)

OK hand sign[edit]

To my understanding, the OK hand sign is not an alt-right symbol, but rather an attempt at a ploy to make the alt-right movement appear bigger than it actually is, given the prevaisiveness that symbol has in everyday culture. (so they can say whenever someone is making it "look, he/she is one of us!", as a kind of intimidation tactic).

Here it is listed as a verbatim alt-right symbol, i think that's not a good idea, as it means RW basically falling for the ploy... 87.123.204.100 (talk) 06:34, 29 January 2018 (UTC)

As of January 2018, Snopes was calling the gesture ambiguous as to trolling or real.[3] Bongolian (talk) 07:14, 29 January 2018 (UTC)
I use the OK hand symbol all the time and I'm definitely not alt-right, and I know lots of people who are the same. I don't think it should really be here, even if supporters of the alt-right do use it. $₽ℛ₶₲₲₶₦₳ (₮₳£Q) (₡¤₦₮ℛ₶฿$) @ 13:03, 29 January 2018 (UTC)
@Spriggina I don't think that if we include a term in the glossary it is meant to suggest that people who use it are necessarily alt-right (e.g. "based" was used by rapper Lil B,Wikipedia's W.svg "deep state" is used by Glenn Greenwald, "mainstream media" is used by The Young Turks, etc.). However, as I've said before, I do think we need some criteria for terms included in the glossary. My suggestion would be:
  1. Terms largely unknown to those unfamiliar with the alt-right (e.g. Cultural Marxism)
  2. Deliberately coded language (euphemisms, dog whistles, in-jokes) (e.g. 1488)
  3. Commonly used terms with altered meanings in an alt-right context, usually having been appropriated by the alt-right (e.g. based)
  4. Terms that would indicate the speaker is likely part of the alt-right, or at the very least raises red flags (e.g. cuck).
CowHouse (talk) 15:14, 29 January 2018 (UTC)
Yes, that could be added to the introductory text. But why not also trolling attempts such as the OK sign? Bongolian (talk) 18:45, 29 January 2018 (UTC)
@Bongolian The OK sign would fall under the third point. CowHouse (talk) 03:43, 30 January 2018 (UTC)
OK! Bongolian (talk) 04:39, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

B-button emoji[edit]

From what I've heard, this emoji is used by the alt-right as anti-black code, particularly on Discord. It later mostly shed its racist origins. Should we add it? 202.142.129.178 (talk) 03:31, 13 February 2018 (UTC)

Doubtful. If ever it was used by the alt-right, it is no longer in active use. It seems to often be used by black people now. — Unsigned, by: Norman44 / talk / contribs

Is "free thinker" an alt-right term?[edit]

Is "free thinker" an alt-right term?—€h33s3βurg3rF@€3 Spinning-Burger.gif (talkstalk) 21:46, 28 April 2018 (UTC)

It was not originally (see Freethought), but they could have co-opted it. Do you have a citation? Bongolian (talk) 22:08, 28 April 2018 (UTC)
Alex Jones has used it. Also, I remember my alt-right dad using it.—€h33s3βurg3rF@€3 Spinning-Burger.gif (talkstalk) 03:14, 29 April 2018 (UTC)

MAGA[edit]

Early this morning an Alt-right troll vandalized the wiki and after I intervened insulted me and vandalized my userpage. The point of me bringing this up is that in several of their edit summaries they used the word "MAGA" in a similar manner to the way many people use the abbreviation "lol", and I neither know its exact meaning in Alt-right slang, nor does our glossary cover it. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 21:16, 12 May 2018 (UTC)

MAGA = Make America Great Again€h33s3βurg3rF@€3 Spinning-Burger.gif (talkstalk) 21:25, 12 May 2018 (UTC)
It was Trump's campaign slogan, which overlaps with but is not exclusive to alt-righters. If the alt-right has changed its meaning somehow, then perhaps it could be added. Bongolian (talk) 01:18, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
@Bongolian It's highly unlikely they changed the meaning of "Make America Great Again", it's already the sort of mindlessly shallow drivel these types of idealogs lap up with reckless abandon. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 01:22, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
It's been used as a dog whistle by Trump & his supporters, e.g. see US Rep. Mike Kelly supporting racial discrimination while using MAGA. Bongolian (talk) 01:32, 13 May 2018 (UTC)
For our case, the troll used it as an attempt to be an edgelord.—€h33s3βurg3rF@€3 Spinning-Burger.gif (talkstalk) 01:36, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
@CheeseburgerFace So that's what an "edgelord" is like? That means that they're as idiotic as I expected, if not more so. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 01:46, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
An edgelord is person who spouts offensive things for attention and not because they believe in what they say.—€h33s3βurg3rF@€3 Spinning-Burger.gif (talkstalk) 01:48, 14 May 2018 (UTC)
I read the article, they sound like standard troll fare to me. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 01:59, 14 May 2018 (UTC)

Adding a MAGA entry[edit]

@CheeseburgerFace & @Jaydogg1994: If the MAGA entry is to be kept, then something else needs to be added, either a special meaning or a reference as to its commonality among the alt-right. I think that the average joe will see this and not get it. Bongolian (talk) 03:31, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Beat you to it.€h33s3βurg3rF@€3 Spinning-Burger.gif (talkstalk) 03:33, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
OK! Bongolian (talk) 03:36, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
Since you two are here would you mind helping me out with something? ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 03:38, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
OK, what's up? Bongolian (talk) 03:39, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
I made a post here (bottom of the page) and would like some input. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 03:43, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

Totalitarian languages.[edit]

https://www.persee.fr/doc/rfsp_0035-2950_1976_num_26_3_393674_t1_0600_0000_001

That book explains this whole thing.--190.174.1.138 (talk) 19:36, 14 July 2018 (UTC)

Red pill's MRA origins[edit]

Hey all, just wanted to suggest that the red pill entry mention its origins in MRA and GG circles. Yet more proof (as if any were needed) that GG and MRA were immediate predecessors of the alt-right. 175.34.250.86 (talk) 08:26, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

How do you know that it wasn't the other way around? Alt-right origins go back further than GG and MRA. Bongolian (talk) 15:55, 9 October 2018 (UTC)

Proud Boys[edit]

A few questions about the definition of the Proud Boys:

  • Are they really less overtly racist? They seem to do a whole lot of racist stuff, not to mention actively using the OK sign to mean "white power."
  • Is "Western values" just a dog-whistle for "being white?" "Western culture" is often used by the alt-right as a code word for white/European culture.
  • Maybe discuss the fact that it's a bunch of grown-ass men in a gang about not masturbating (but jerking each other off is OK if nobody sees it)? — Unsigned, by: Norman44 / talk / contribs

Day of the Rope[edit]

What's the deal, @RoninMacbeth? This reference confirms that it is a term used by white nationalists.[4] Why do you think it isn't? Bongolian (talk) 21:19, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

Oh, sorry. Didn't realize it didn't get restored. I just tried to revert the edit about white genocide. My mistake. RoninMacbeth (talk) 21:24, 5 December 2018 (UTC)

Please add the number “13%”[edit]

The number “13%” is a popular and common Alt-Right dog whistle, and is short for “Despite being 13% of the population, blacks commit 52% of crime.” They sometimes also say “Despite being 13%” but most of the time they only say the number “13%”, which is enough to pass under “normies” radar. If you see it in any online forum, you know there’s Nazis creeping in it.

Done. Palaeonictis Fossil beds 12:43, 17 February 2019 (UTC)
Also 56%. Radiant Orb (talk) 21:00, 19 February 2019 (UTC)

Too much scope creep?[edit]

This has become a very long list, and no doubt will pick up even more trending words and phrases in the months and years to come. In my view this article should be restricted to terms that are either exclusive to the alt-right, or have a different or additional meaning when used by the alt-right. Terms such as "oppression olympics" that are used by the alt-light, the realist left, libertarians, paleocons, and by the so-called "intellectual dark web" (Jordan Peterson, Quillette), should be moved to separate page(s), which should be referenced in the See Also. I volunteer to kick this off since I identify as realist left and am a Quillette reader.--Greenrd (talk) 01:09, 23 March 2019 (UTC)

Done, or mostly done. There were a couple of terms that I wasn't sure about the usage of, so I left them here.--Greenrd (talk) 12:08, 13 April 2019 (UTC)

Wrong apu?[edit]

sorry for editing before taking it to the talk thread the first time but i think the apu mentioned in the article refers not to the simpsons apu but rather to the old name of the crudely drawn edit of pepe the frog that would later on become the frenworld frog

https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/apu-apustaja https://knowyourmeme.com/memes/sites/frenworld https://meemi.info/w/Apu_apustaja — Unsigned, by: 91.139.146.180 / talk

You appear to be correct. CogitoNotStirred (via telepathy) (talk) 20:02, 16 July 2019 (UTC)

Cozy[edit]

Anyone know what "cozy" means? I've seen it quite a bit in Nazi Twitter account descriptions. I would guess that the user only wants fellow-Nazis to follow, but I'm not positive. Bongolian (talk) 03:02, 3 September 2019 (UTC)

@Bongolian I believe it's meant ironically in the same way you'll sometimes see them use "wholesome," i.e. very much not so. Click at your own risk: groypersgathering.blogspot.com CogitoNotStirred (via telepathy) (talk) 03:41, 3 September 2019 (UTC)
There's no real proof that these internet users are actual Nazis. They could just be internet trolls/comedians looking to get a rise out of people for kicks. — Unsigned, by: Danglol / talk / contribs
"Only words count. Everything else is bluff." (Eugène Ionesco) CogitoNotStirred (via telepathy) (talk) 17:12, 9 September 2019 (UTC)

1290 — Edit of Expulsion[edit]

Is it really worth mentioning the Edict of Expulsion at all? It's true that Vanguard News Network got all excited when Katzir made his goofy blog post (striking me as odd, because I doubt VNN's people read Hebrew), but that doesn't mean '1290' significant to the alt-right.

This is a minor point and hardly worth discussing. However, 13 years ago, there was a quite a fuss. A dozen newspapers/blogs/fish'n'chip wrappers stated that Ori Katzir, an 'Israeli historian', had suggested that the Edict of Expulsion was never rescinded. His argument was that only a monarch could overturn a royal decree; Cromwell was a dictator, not a monarch, and therefore was acting ultra vires. (How a dictator can't have absolute power is beyond me.) Anyway, after a bit of digging, I found the original post by Ori Katzir -- here -- and it turns out that he's a tour guide. Granted, he has a master's degree in History; granted, he's an Israeli; however, he's not a historian and his blog is just a blog. The discussion on the matter of Cromwell's authority is a bit like the discussion on how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, in my opinion at least.

Finally, if we're going to mention 1290, shouldn't we mention 1492 and the Alhambra Decree? I don't care if we mention 1290 or not, but if we do, surely we should mention 1492 as well. What are your thoughts? — Unsigned, by: WalterFunkKnight / talk / contribs

The only reason to have 1290 in the glossary is if the alt-right is using it. If someone has a reference for its actual usage, it would be worth keeping. Bongolian (talk) 17:00, 3 September 2019 (UTC)

Boogaloo[edit]

"Boogaloo" is another term that I've seen a lot of but I'm not sure of. It looks like it could be a code word for race war. Bongolian (talk) 18:10, 3 September 2019 (UTC)

Confirmed and added. Bongolian (talk) 20:16, 4 September 2019 (UTC)
I was under the impression that "Boogaloo," in general usage, describes a dubious low-quality sequel of something. The origin of this is Breakin' 2: Electric Boogaloo. From the memes that I've seen, "The Boogaloo" is referring to a second American Civil War. The memes that where I typically see it are referring to a civil war provoked by widespread gun confiscation, hence ridiculous scenarios about murdering ATF agents ("alphabet bois"). The alt-right then use this framework to promote a race war. POGtastic (talk) 20:09, 1 November 2019 (UTC)

109 Countries[edit]

I don't know how long it's been around, but by this point 109 has definitely become part of the glossary. For those who are unfamiliar: 109 refers to the number of countries that have expelled Jews in history. Whether or not that number is accurate is irrelevant; the term is to imply that Jews are responsible/deserving of having been kicked out of so many places (and thus implying it should happen again and/or implying Jews should stop complaining about it). — Unsigned, by: 109.67.54.194 / talk

The point of this glossary.[edit]

@Bongolian I have been wondering how useful this glossary is. Are we compiling a dictionary so that Alt-right novices can understand the esoteric texts of Alt-rightism? My problem is, I am guessing that most of the people who might sympathize with the alt-right don't understand half of these terms. What about, as a tool for bright young Nazi hunters? the previous topic above, citing the number 109 as an alt-right term, is signed "Unsigned, by: 109.67.54.194 / t". Somehow I am suspicious someone is pulling my leg.Ariel31459 (talk) 22:49, 6 November 2019 (UTC)

@Ariel31459 Well, usefulness isn't a point of missionality per se, but the glossary could be used for people who want to report Nazis on social media or for reporters who want to gain an understanding of their subject. As a tool for budding Nazis, it probably suck ass due to its ideological slant against Nazism. Bongolian (talk) 22:58, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
Point 3 of our mission statement. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 23:06, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
Even though I have decided that the suggestion to add the number 109 to this avalanche of a glossary is not entirely serious, it is a good example of a bad idea: a google search comes up with more than 3 billion citations of highway designations, bus routes, places of business, etc. associated with the number 109. Then there are real entries in the glossary that also have no useful purpose that I can discover such as The Last Stand:
" "The Last Stand" is a song by the Swedish metal band Sabaton,Wikipedia's W.svg the titular last stand being of 189 Swiss Guardsmen during the Sack of Rome in 1527....
What does the last stand have to do with the alt-right? Not a damn thing, really." At least it's honest Ariel31459 (talk) 23:27, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
Keep reading on that one. In addition, it's a glossary of the jargon of an active group, of course it'll be large. Add to that said group is fond of dog-whistles and euphemisms and it's not surprising that the glossary has gotten as large as it has. ☭Comrade GC☭Ministry of Praise 23:42, 6 November 2019 (UTC)
All right, but is music appropriate for a glossary because a song is played on a few videos? It's nice to know that the song is a good one. Among the more that 3.5 billion google citations for "The Last Stand" are several contemporary movies, General Custer meets new people, the Alamo, an RPG zombie game, and a cavalcade of others. Where will I find the time?Ariel31459 (talk) 00:11, 7 November 2019 (UTC)
You have to search on Youtube and read the comments on such entries as this one, this one, this one, etc. To be fair, a lot of the "Deus Vult" entries are extremely low view count (but there's one in the 30ks); the main entry has less of the toxic faith-bashing. However even in the official video comment section, there is still an amusing confusing between "power metal band that uses historic Christian European events" and "Christian metal band". Slayer isn't a "Nazi band" just because they sang about Josef Mengele. And of course the Youtube comment section of the "Deus Vult" idiots proves xkcd right again by confusing the Sack of Rome that the song is clearly about, with the Crusades, which is where the "deus vult" phrase came from. The date range isn't even in the same ballpark. I don't know about notability, but, put it this way, there are *lots* of "nationalists" misinterpreting Sabaton on noted alt-right platform Bitchute. You won't find the same if you search for, say, Drake. Soundwave106 (talk) 02:31, 7 November 2019 (UTC)