Conservapedia talk:Greatest achievements of human history

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Should we subsection base on location/era? [[User:K61824|]][[User_talk:K61824|]] 23:47, 9 July 2012 (UTC)

Great teenagers

Obviously the conceit is nonsense but there are many examples of amazing teenagers such as Mozart.

Not a CP obsessive, but I had to look...

The CP list never mentioned Joseph Smith's vision at fourteen (although curiously Bernadette is)... Alexander the Great, several great achievements before twenty... or King Tut who died at nineteen. And in line with American bias, it mentions American sportsmen only.

Actually one of the most impressive must be the invention of braille at fifteen. That I agree with.-Albannach (talk) 15:01, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Joseph Smith: displaying the signs of being either profoundly mentally ill or a total charlatan at such a young age isn't really an "accomplishment" in any meaningful sense of the word. King Tut: got on the throne the way these things usually happened, by somebody else dying. Reigned for 9 years, had advisors who probably did most of the heavy lifting. You probably never would have heard of him except for the fact his grave wasn't pilfered in the same manner as those of most of his contemporaries. Did he doubt/Or did he try? 15:13, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Just saw this in Special: Recent Changes... I think the point is not to run down the accomplishments of teenagers, but to explain that Andrew Schlafly makes unsubstantiated claims, can't back them up, and (given this was made during the "Point and laugh at the closet-case" era) show evidence completely contradicting his unsubstantiated claim. Obviously, the burden of proof is on Schlafly, but he never proved it.--TheLateGatsby (The end of the dock ) 15:32, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

In fact, there's no evidence any of Schlafly's charges have done great things. We could just as easily start an essay declaring that Andrew Schlafly hampers the achievements of teenagers. --TheLateGatsby (The end of the dock ) 15:55, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Just because Schafly makes a ridiculous claim doesn't mean that teenagers should be completely written off. In fact, I'm tempted to compile my own list. Mozart and Schubert were incredible teenagers, but their best stuff was later. I mentioned JS from CP not RW's perspective.

King Tut did institute some major reforms including moving the capital of Egypt.

I find it interesting just who Schafly doesn't list. I'm sure you could find some examples he wouldn't like too... Rosa Parks seems to have been preceded by a fifteen year old for example.-Albannach (talk) 16:01, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

She was, but the African-American leadership decided that a middle-aged seamstress would be a better face for the movement than a sassy teenager who got pregnant soon after her protest. Did he doubt/Or did he try? 16:17, 12 April 2013 (UTC)

Wikipedia

This essay should mention Wikipedia. --82.136.210.153 (talk) 20:20, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

Magna Carta

The Magna Carta is mentioned on the list. Although its precise authorship is unrecorded, there's no evidence of any teenage contributors before its signing in 1215. Major figures in its creation were: wp:Stephen Langton, Archbishop of Canterbury, born around 1150; wp:Robert Fitzwalter, elected leader of the barons, whose dob is unknown but his father was born in the 1120s and he was an adult when his father died in 1198, so clearly not a teen 17 years later; and King John born 1166. Annquin (talk) 17:23, 24 March 2016 (UTC)

Bias

Almost all of the thinkers listed here are male and predominantly Western. In philosophy overwhelmingly all of the authors listed are centuries old and predominantly of one specific ideological tradition (Enlightenment era liberalism whose main tenets have been called into question time and time again, especially with the notion of terra nullius and the homestead principle of property that was used to justify colonialism in the Americas and the seizure of the commons and economic displacement of the peasantry). All of the social movements, save for the Indian independence movement, are also predominantly Western-oriented. Where is mention made of the spirit of revolution that led to the overthrow of feudal authority in China? Where is the Russian Revolution, which for good and ill had a long-lasting impact on the development and course of human history? (Many of the gains made in labor reforms were allowed at least in part to prevent a repeat of the Russian Revolution here in the West.) Where are the thinkers of the Islamic Golden Age? Where are the inventions and innovations of the Muslim world, all of which had an outstanding impact on human history? Where are the anti-colonial struggles of the 50s and 60s? The list goes on and on. I had to put in Karl Marx, who love him or hate him is widely regarded as one of the founders of sociology and whose work is still extremely influential in academia. I had to add Rosalind Franklin, the female scientist whose work was critical to the understanding of the molecular structure of DNA. Carthage (talk) 05:46, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

I am not impressed by this mish-mash. Not only does it suffer greatly from cultural bias, but also by its leaning towards great man theory. Bongolian (talk) 06:40, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Is there a process to nominate essays for deletion? Asking for a friend. Carthage (talk) 06:41, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

I can't recall any essays being deleted for foolishness, only rarely for highly-offensive essay. Bongolian (talk) 06:46, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Essays seems to be a dumping ground for shit that can't make it into mainspace. That's not necessarily a guarantee for quality or lack thereof, but I do think we should consider a process to trim the fat from essayspace. This site has improved in quality, at least in mainspace, maybe it's time to do the same for essayspace? Carthage (talk) 06:48, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

The intro says it’s catering to stuff Schlafly himself would appreciate. My problem with the essay is more that it’s refuting a theory than literally everyone knows is stupid. We don’t need this effort. Chef Moosolini’s Ristorante Italiano^{Make a Reservation} 08:50, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Should we do a general purge of Conservapedia-related shit? I don't see how this is even that relevant to the history of RationalWiki. Carthage (talk) 08:58, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

A lot of it is fun to have around, but this essay just seems pointless. It’s not funny or entertaining. It’s just a listicle. Chef Moosolini’s Ristorante Italiano^{Make a Reservation} 09:10, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Yeah. Would anyone here be opposed to me deleting it? Or should something like this go to AfD? Cause precedent and all that. Carthage (talk) 09:16, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

I’d recommend an AfD, but I’m also not gonna stop ya from just doing it. Chef Moosolini’s Ristorante Italiano^{Make a Reservation} 09:18, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Let's have an AfD so everyone can say how shit it is and how we need to get rid of more CP crap. Spud (talk) 09:20, 20 September 2023 (UTC)

Actual young persons

Should there be some mention of Greta Thunberg, and, possibly Daisy Ashford (wrote The Young Visiters at a very young age).

A number of sports persons and eg chess players have been very young. Anna Livia (talk) 10:25, 20 September 2023 (UTC)