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email 16 Sep '10

16th September 2010


  2. Politicians, scientists, campaigners, authors join call to protest against the Pope’s state visit
  3. Protest in Edinburgh on the 16th of September
  4. Film Festival: "The Crime of Father Amaro" on 16th September - 7:30 pm
  6. Protest in Twickenham on the 17th September
  7. Nope-Pope the Party! on the 17th September
  8. March & Rally in London 18th September
  9. Protest in Birmingham on the 19th September
  10. Protest in Plymouth on the 19th September


Pope Benedict XVI arrives in Scotland today to begin his four-day tour of Britain, the first state visit by a Pontiff to the United Kingdom.

The Pope’s statements and teachings on sexuality, sexual health and well-being have been condemned by leading UK sexual health charities, fpa and the National AIDS Trust (NAT).
In an open letter, fpa and NAT state they are using the Pope’s visit to the UK – which coincides with Sexual Health Awareness Week – to highlight the damaging effects of his position on the use of modern contraception, abortion, and same-sex relationships.
An open letter from leading UK sexual health charities FPA and NAT (National AIDS Trust)

We are using the Pope’s visit to the UK to highlight the discriminatory nature of his statements and teachings on sexuality and sexual health and wellbeing.

By teaching that modern contraception is ‘intrinsically evil’, the Catholic church prevents women, including married women, from making choices about whether or not to have children, and how to plan and space their children. This leads to unwanted pregnancies, resulting in unwanted children, or abortion. Particularly in developing countries it also results in women being unable to limit the number of pregnancies during their lives, often leading to disability or premature death.

The Catholic church’s position on abortion puts women’s health and lives in danger. Evidence from across the world and throughout history has shown that preventing women from accessing safe and legal abortion does not stop abortions. Instead, women facing unplanned pregnancies take desperate actions, including seeking illegal and dangerous abortions. Approximately 70,000 women a year die as a result of unsafe abortion and hundreds of thousands of others are severely injured and disabled. The Pope’s teachings on abortion serve to perpetuate this situation. The Vatican has used its position in international bodies such as the UN to promote its position on contraception and abortion and to thwart progress recognising women’s sexual and reproductive rights; this impact is felt by women across the world, regardless of their faith.

We are extremely concerned about the Pope’s comments on the use of condoms, and particularly the assertion he made in March 2009 that the use of condoms increased the spread of HIV. When used correctly and consistently male and female condoms offer protection against all STIs, including HIV. HIV remains a life-threatening illness and can be associated with significant stigma and exclusion. The use of condoms is a crucial part of the fight against the spread of HIV and it is, at best, irresponsible to oppose this.

We oppose the discrimination expressed by the Pope about same sex relationships. In 2008, the Pope used his end of year message to senior Vatican staff to argue that the world needed protecting from homosexuality in the same way it needed protecting from climate change. As a religious leader and a head of state the Pope wields significant influence. It is unacceptable for him to use his position to incite and legitimise intolerance, prejudice and discrimination against lesbian, gay and bisexual people across the world.

2) Politicians, scientists, campaigners, authors join call to protest against the Pope’s state visit

Over 50 prominent persons, including politicians, scientists, campaigners, authors and comedians, have signed an open letter opposing the honour of a state visit being given to the Pope. Among those who have signed the letter are Professor Richard Dawkins, Stephen Fry, Stewart Lee, Philip Pullman, Ken Follett, Professor Susan Blackmore and Sir Terry Pratchett.

We, the undersigned, share the view that Pope Ratzinger should not be given the honour of a state visit to this country. We believe that the pope, as a citizen of Europe and the leader of a religion with many adherents in the UK, is of course free to enter and tour our country. However, as well as a religious leader, the pope is a head of state, and the state and organisation of which he is head has been responsible for:

  • Opposing the distribution of condoms and so increasing large families in poor countries and the spread of Aids.
  • Promoting segregated education.
  • Denying abortion to even the most vulnerable women.
  • Opposing equal rights for lesbians, gay, bisexual and transgender people.
  • Failing to address the many cases of abuse of children within its own organisation.

The state of which the pope is head has also resisted signing many major human rights treaties and has formed its own treaties (“concordats”) with many states which negatively affect the human rights of citizens of those states. In any case, we reject the masquerading of the Holy See as a state and the pope as a head of state as merely a convenient fiction to amplify the international influence of the Vatican.

Stephen Fry, Professor Richard Dawkins, Professor Susan Blackmore, Terry Pratchett, Philip Pullman, Ed Byrne, Baroness Blackstone, Ken Follett, Professor AC Grayling, Stewart Lee, Baroness Massey, Claire Rayner, Adele Anderson, John Austin MP, Lord Avebury, Sian Berry, Professor Simon Blackburn, Sir David Blatherwick, Sir Tom Blundell, Dr Helena Cronin, Dylan Evans, Hermione Eyre, Lord Foulkes, Professor Chris French, Natalie Haynes, Johann Hari, Jon Holmes, Lord Hughes, Robin Ince, Dr Michael Irwin, Professor Steve Jones, Sir Harold Kroto, Professor John Lee, Zoe Margolis, Jonathan Meades, Sir Jonathan Miller, Diane Munday, Maryam Namazie, David Nobbs, Professor Richard Norman, Lord O’Neill, Simon Price, Paul Rose, Martin Rowson, Michael Rubenstein, Joan Smith, Dr Harry Stopes-Roe, Professor Raymond Tallis, Lord Taverne, Peter Tatchell, Baroness Turner, Professor Lord Wedderburn of Charlton QC FBA, Ann Marie Waters, Professor Wolpert, Jane Wynne Willson

Published on The Guardian | Wednesday 15th September 2010 Andrew Copson, Chief Executive of the British Humanist Association and a spokesperson for the Protest the Pope Campaign, commented: ‘The policies of the Holy See, the “state” the Pope is representing during his visit to the UK, have a huge negative impact on human rights. Today’s letter raises issues, including the Holy See’s position to deny abortion to any woman, to oppose gay equality and to disrupt the distribution of condoms in AIDS prevention programmes.

‘We believe this letter reflects the views of many British people, who object to the state visit of the Pope not only on financial grounds, but have clear principled objections to extending the honour of a state visit to the head of a state which seeks to impose its religious doctrine internationally, even trying to influence our own domestic equality laws in ways that go against the principles of democracy, human rights and the rule of law.’

3) Protest in Edinburgh on the 16th of September
Thursday 16th September 11am – 2pm
Lothian Road (opposite Usher Hall, outside the Clydesdale Bank) Edinburgh, Scotland

More details in this page.

4) Film Festival: "The Crime of Father Amaro"

Thursday 16th September at 7.30pm
Conway Hall, 25 Red Lion Square, London, WC1R 4RL

As part of the Protest the Pope Campaign, the National Secular Society is presenting a short season of films which explore issues that the Catholic Church and the Government would prefer were kept under wraps during the papal visit. The authorities in this country refuse to ask difficult questions of the pope – so we will do it for them. Each of these powerful films illustrates clearly why the Pope should be made to answer for the many sins of his Church.

Today, Thursday 16th September, "The Crime of Father Amaro".

Set in Mexico in 2002, this film follows the experiences of a young, idealistic priest who is sent to a small parish to assist the ageing Father Benito. It soon becomes apparent that the Church is a hotbed of corruption and hypocrisy and the young Father Amaro (played by Gael Garcia Bernal) is sorely tested and slowly drawn in.

The Catholic Church in Mexico declared that seeing this film was a mortal sin, but that didn’t stop it becoming the country’s most popular film ever. Directed by Carlos Carrera.

The film will be preceded by a talk by David Ranan, author of Double Cross: Code of the Catholic Church – a book that exposes the corruption that has been at the heart of the Church since its very foundation.

Tickets for each film are £3. Seats are limited

Tickets for each film are 3£. Seats are limited, so advance booking is advised. Buy tickets here: or by post from NSS Film Festival, 25 Red Lion Square, London WC1R 4RL


Tell your MP what you want your representatives to ask the Pope!

As it is an official state visit, the Pope is meeting with the leaders of all three major parties – David Cameron, Nick Clegg and Harriet Harman – as well as other senior politicians. The leaders should represent the views of the British public during these events. The Protest the Pope Campaign is encouraging you to make your views known to your MP, as your elected representative, to request that they pass your message on to their respective party leaders. The Protest the Pope Campaign’s automated email system will allow you to do this quickly and easily.

The Pope will be meeting with your elected representatives during his official state visit next week. Ask your MP to make your views known.

6) Protest in Twickenham on the 17th September

The Richmond Coalition Against The State Visit will stage a peaceful protest on Friday 17th September at 9am

The Pope’s first event in London, on the 17 September, will be at St Mary’s University College in Twickenham, south west London. The pontiff will talk about his views on education, which have included his support for separate faith schools and the right of these schools to discriminate in their admissions policy and their recruitment of staff.

That’s why the Protest the Pope Campaign will lend its support to organisations and individuals in South West London who have contacted the Campaign. After a successful meeting organised by the Richmond LGBT Forum on the 12th August where spokespeople of the Campaign outlined the reasons for protesting against honouring Pope Joseph Ratzinger with a state visit, the coalition has now been formed and their protest has been authorised by the Police. Confirmed speakers:

  • Josh Kutchinsky, Central London Humanist Group
  • Derek Lennard, Gay And Lesbian Humanist Association
  • Peter Tatchell, Human Rights Campaigner
  • 4 Italian campaigners will fly to the UK on Friday to join the Protest the Pope demo in Twickenham. (Thanks to Gaydar). They will talk to the world’s press about the increase in homophobic and transphobic attacks in Italy. They will also launch Europride 2011 which will take place in Rome.

Waldegrave Road, Strawberry Hill, Twickenham. TW1 4SX
Opposite the entrance of St Mary’s University College
Aim to arrive early.

Nearest railway station: Strawberry Hill, then 11 minutes’ walk, [according to TfL], along Tower Road, then turn right into Waldegrave Gardens
Nearest tube: Richmond, then bus R68 from stop “D” towards Hampton Court, alighting at the pub “Pope’s Grotto”, then 8 minutes’ walk along Waldegrave Road
Note that the area is predicted to be gridlocked: so aim to arrive early.

The Richmond LGBT Forum are a founding member of the RICHMOND COALITION AGAINST THE STATE VISIT.

The Richmond LGBT Forum have now also launched a text campaign to gather support for our challenge to the views of the Pope and to simultaneously raise money for charities and others who support the victims of discrimination, hatred and hostility.
Text POPE to 81400 NOW!

Texts cost £1.50 plus your standard network charge.

Texts cost £1.50 plus your standard network charge. The text service will close on 1.10.10. See for full terms and conditions and for details of donations made with the proceeds.

7) Nope-Pope the Party! on the 17th September
Friday 17th September from 7pm
Conway Hall, 25 Red Lion Square, London WC1R 4RL On the night before the big march, join guest host Peter Tatchell for a for a night of comedy, music and secular revelry as we say “NOPE!” to the Pope during his visit to the UK. Great music from the Divine DJ and live bands so you can dance, drink and be “married” by Pope Steve at the Deity-free Wedding Chapel! Try your luck at the Heretical Tombola! Prizes for best fancy dress! SPECIAL GUESTS INCLUDE:

  • Supremely clever NICK DOODY – “Sick, silly, and cerebral”
  • Legendary cult superstar JONNY WOO – “Delisciously wicked”
  • Cutting-edge wheelchair-wielding LIZ CARR – “Supremely funny, twisted, and edgy”
  • Feminist bossy-boots KATE SMURTHWAITE – “Comedy that cuts through the crap”.
  • Host of London’s Next Top Tranny – RUSSELLA – “Too fabulous!”
  • Live music from The FLOTELS plus special guests.

£10 in advance – £12 on the door includes admission to late-night clubbing after-party.
Buy tickets here: Visit the Facebook Event Page for more information.
ALL PROFITS to SNAP, The Survivor’s Network of Those Abused by Priests.

8) March & Rally on the 18th September

Join the big march through London to oppose the state visit of Joseph Ratzinger to the UK! Saturday 18th September

  • Assemble at the top of Piccadilly (Hyde Park Corner) from 1.30 pm
  • March from 2.30 pm to 3.30pm through central London
  • Rally opposite Downing Street from 3.30pm to 5pm

Please put this date in your diary and make every effort to be there. Spread the news of this event as far as you can. Local groups might consider getting a coach party to come and if you’re coming from outside London and could offer a lift to someone in your area, please let us know and we’ll put you in touch.

Confirmed speakers:

  • Barbara Blaine, SNAP, the Survivor’s Network of those Abused by Priests
  • Clara Connolly, Women Against Fundamentalism
  • Andrew Copson, British Humanist Association
  • Sue Cox, sex abuse survivor
  • Professor Richard Dawkins, scientist
  • Dr Ben Goldacre, journalist
  • Johann Hari, journalist
  • Father Bernard J Lynch, an openly gay catholic priest
  • Maryam Namazie, One Law for All
  • Pragna Patel, Southall Black Sisters
  • Terry Sanderson, National Secular Society
  • Peter Tatchell, human rights campaigner

Details of the big march can be found at the Protest the Pope website.

Download the PDF file to print your own placards!!!

9) Protest in Birmingham on the 19th September

Sunday 19th September from 9am Junction of Lickey Road and Low Hill Lane Birmingham

Together with many other like-minded people, Mark Rawlinson, member of humanist and secularist groups, has given his support to the Protest the Pope campaign ( and will be travelling to London to demonstrate his opposition to the Pope and the Catholic Church’s views.

He has also organised the Birmingham protest, which will take place on Sunday 19th September on the corner of Lickey Rd and Low Hill Lane from 9am.

“The demonstration will be a peaceful protest to oppose the state visit of Joseph Ratzinger to the UK,” says Mark. “We believe that is inappropriate that the Pope be given the honour of a state visit to Britain given his harsh and intolerant views on contraception, abortion, equal rights for women and gay people, not to mention his attempts to cover up the numerous cases of child abuse within his church. Whilst we accept that he should be free to come to Britain to preach to his followers (albeit at his own expense), we feel that it is important that people are aware of just what unpleasant policies this man stands for, and that he knows that he is not welcome here in Birmingham.”

Mark plans on doing a video diary of the protests which will be posted on YouTube.

Details of the Birmingham protest can be found on the Facebook page.

Twitter: @PopeProtestBrum

10) Protest in Plymouth on the 19th September

The Plymouth Humanist Group have organised a peaceful protest in PLYMOUTH to oppose the State Visit of Ratzinger in the UK. Sunday 19th September from 5.30 pm North Cross Roundabout (top of Royal Parade) Plymouth

Read all details in their website:

08:52, 16 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast


I must admit, I was impressed with what he had to say. I sometimes find him a bit shrill (as in God Delusion), but despite his (justified) anger, I think he made some sound points. --PsyGremlinTal! 12:20, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

I haven't heard it (The autotranscribe feature leaves a lot to be desired), but I'm told he made sense. He's been getting on my nerves lately (and not so lately!). 12:26, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Ah, have no fear - Señor Dawkins provides the full transcript here. --PsyGremlinParla! 12:41, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Much thanks, Psy: off to read it now. 12:46, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Thanks for the link - he's certainly no fan of Ratzinger.--BobSpring is sprung! 12:57, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Why the revert?[edit]

Salman Rushdie. If you want, you can post your answer here and I'll check on it in several minutes. :-) (talk) 15:58, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Which particular revert? 16:08, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Oh, very kind of you to allow me to post my answer here. 16:11, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Oops, forgive me for not thinking--I've done several edits on Rushdie. Sorry about that. :-) It was Christopher Hitchens. As for the postings, I usually detest the back and forth between pages. Your's is a page of an established editor. Mine is that of a IP address of a computer used by many people. It seems more appropriate here, but I you wish otherwise, I can accommodate it.:-) (talk) 16:15, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Was it supposed to be funny? 16:18, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Yes. Hitchens started as a Trotskyite. Then he becomes a cheerleader for Bush and the Invasion of Iraq. Even Pakistani Trotskyite Tariq Ali referred to two Hitchens: his old friend who seemed to die in 911 and this new pro-Iraq War one. Since then, Hitchens, this savant, has been back-peddling a bit. The humour part was trying to reconcile his trotskyite and atheist background for his support for a born-again Christian war-monger. Btw, here are my other contributions.:-)
Humour Fail. Contribs link Fail. 16:28, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
"Contribs link fail." What do you mean? As for the first, fair enough. But what is RW policy, or consenses on humourous fake quotes as captions? (talk) 16:38, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
Why not just add a note somewhere within the article. Untrue quotes are not funny - it's called lying. The contrib link leads nowhere - just checking, you mistyped (sb:Special:Contributions/ 16:45, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast.
Sorry about the link. "Untrue quotes are not funny - it's called lying." They did it on SNL's fake news all the time. The idea is when the lie is obvious--and I doubt CH would ever say that--then it doesn't have that power to decieve--particularly and presumably those here in RW. As for mentioning it, the last post in the talk page is mine, and indicates such. (talk) 16:53, 20 September 2010 (UTC)
I have no idea what SNL's fake news is, but quotes here should be sourced and true. I have no particular axe to grind re C Hitchens - he is somewhat abrasive and too right wing for me. 16:59, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast

Saturday Night Live. Here's a 24 sec ond from Norm McDonald. :-) Okay, I checked out several articles, including Jack Chick and Scientology, and they seem to bear you out. Ron Paul is a stretch, but again, if there is a lie (in the pic), it's an obvious one. Might I presume that things are different in the fun pages? I see you reverted my Isaac Asimov edit. I saw that episode (perhaps 3 times), but not the movie. As for the Russian link, the Russians aren't as intimidated of Californian lawyers as Californians, such as in regards to posted videos of the Simpsons (note you are likely to find little on Youtube). (talk) 17:27, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Snipp wasted on me, sorry. The Russian link: if I recall you wrote that it was 18+ minutes in - not really apt for an article. 17:36, 20 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
There is no band called "Ezra." ;-) I posted "and 18:30 minutes into this 21 minute video" exactly so people wouldn't have to wait 18 1/2 minutes to get to the part. They just click and pull. (talk) 17:46, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

and degree[edit]

I searched the "symbols" and couldn't find it, thank you! ħumanUser talk:Human 07:13, 22 September 2010 (UTC)

No sweat. Just one of those things what I happen to remember like "and rarr;" (→) etc. Of course the one I always forget is "and plusmn;" (±) which I've just had to google for. 15:50, 22 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast

PTP again[edit]

Received 24 Sep '10

24th September 2010


  5. . RAISING MONEY FOR SNAP (Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests)


Before the crowds set off from Hyde Park Corner on Saturday, the police estimated that we were 12,000 strong. But the number continued to rise as protesters poured onto Piccadilly; as we marched, more protesters were waiting on the route and joined in and so did many onlookers, most of whom were supportive; and perhaps another thousand were waiting to join us opposite Downing Street. At the arrival point before the Protest the Pope rally started on Westminster the numbers were closer to 20,000.


The National Catholic Register states: “Even though the pope’s supporters clearly outnumbered his critics, this was nevertheless easily the largest public protest Benedict XVI has ever faced on one of his foreign trips, and one of the largest protests against a pope in modern history.”

Photos are available at the following link:


Sue Cox Andrew Copson Terry Sanderson Peter Tatchell Geoffrey Robertson Richard Dawkins Johann Hari Ben Goldacre Father Bernard Lynch Maryam Namazie Clara Connolly Pragna Patel


" Despite the way the BBC and other media almost totally ignored our march, preferring to fawn over Ratzinger, the London march and rally against the pope was a resounding success. The number of people who turned up was dramatically more than anybody expected (and we didn't have the advantage of bussing in loads of children from our own schools to swell the crowd). The protesters were there, in their thousands, because they wanted to be there. The atmosphere was good-humoured, many of the banners were witty, and the response to the speeches was rousing.

It is already clear that plenty of people on the march were active with movie and still cameras, and some of the results are already up on YouTube. Probably all the speeches were filmed from more than one angle, by different people, and the sound quality is surprisingly good. It occurs to me that we could cobble these together into a wonderful DVD, which would be commemorative for those on the march, and which would bring our message to a much wider circle of people. The UK branch of the Richard Dawkins Foundation for Reason and Science could put up the money to produce it and have it professionally edited, and we’d sell it at a low price in order to maximise the circulation of our message of disgust at the way Ratzinger was invited by the British government and feted as though he were the Head of a serious State.

Most of the speeches were filmed from more than one angle, so it will be possible to cut between them in a way that will look professional even though the cameras involved were small and hand-held. Indeed, the fact that they were small and hand-held will, in a way, add an atmosphere of authenticity, which will contrast with the professional BBC footage with its nauseating echoes of coronations and royal weddings, with the appropriately reverential ‘Dimbleby-style’ tones. Our DVD, by contrast, will be edgy, and will seem more authentic in consequence.

If you would like your footage to be used in this way, please tell us about it. Not just the speeches, of course: we are just as keen on film of the march itself, with the banners, the funny antics, the good humour amid the seriousness. Still photos would also be useful and, as with movie footage, your name will be fully credited if your material is used. If anybody has interview footage, shot on the march, we might be able to use that too. No need to pre-edit, as we can take care of that.

Please send an email telling us about your material (but not yet sending it) to Details should include a synopsis, file format and file size. We'll then send you step-by-step instructions on how to get the footage to us via an online file-sharing system. The act of sending us your material will constitute your consent for us to use it, on a non-exclusive basis (meaning that you are still free to use it yourself in any way you choose)."

Richard Dawkins


Please complain to the BBC about its biased coverage of the Pope’s visit & protests. Point out how significant a news story the protest march in London was, with almost 20,000 people attending in protest at the Pope. Point out how few campaigners were interviewed, despite a great many Catholic leaders and supporters being interviewed and given studio space! Many thanks.

At this link.

5. RAISING MONEY FOR SNAP (Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests)

We are pleased to announce that the proceeds from our charity fundraising party raised over £1600 for SNAP, over $2500 US dollars at today's exchange.

Barbara Blaine with SNAP, who was at the party along with several other abuse survivors, had hoped to raise just $1500 US dollars, to fund the training of a support group leader here in the UK, to open the first British branch of the charity, and begin training others.

Photo by Andrew West, photographer of the British Humanist Association

A big thank you to Karen O Novak, organiser of the charity party, and thanks to everyone who helped, supported, donated prizes, performed, distributed flyers, sent out Facebook notices, dressed up, got married, played music, boogied, and made the evening such a success. The money we raised will really make a genuine difference to victims of the Church, who will soon have the specialised support here in the UK that SNAP provides for victims of sexual abuse by Catholic clergy.

Well done, everyone! Thank you!

6. DONATIONS AND ONLINE SHOP open until 20th October

The Protest the Pope Campaign is now closed. However we will keep our online shop open until the 20th of October: you can buy a t-shirt and support SNAP the Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests.

All profits will be distributed to SNAP, The Survivor’s Network of Those Abused by Priests.

You can also make a donation directly through our PayPal account.

Both the online shop and the paypal account will be closed on the 20th of October.


The Richmond LGBT Forum are a founding member of the RICHMOND COALITION AGAINST THE STATE VISIT, organiser of the Protest in Twickenham on Friday 17th September 2010.
The Richmond LGBT Forum have also launched a text campaign to gather support for our challenge to the views of the Pope and to simultaneously raise money for charities and others who support the victims of discrimination, hatred and hostility. Text POPE to 81400 NOW! Texts cost £1.50 plus your standard network charge.

Texts cost £1.50 plus your standard network charge. The text service will close on 1.10.10. See for full terms and conditions and for details of donations made with the proceeds.


Please stand up for secularism and human rights. Be counted.
Join one or more of the organisations supporters of the Protest the Pope Campaign.
In particular join the associations actively organising the Campaign:

British Humanist Association - [1]
Central London Humanist Group - [2]
Gay & Lesbian Humanist Association - [3]
Humanist Society of Scotland - [4]
National Secular Society - [5]
OutRage! - [6]
Richmond LGBT Forum - [7]


The Pope is now back in Italy. From Rome he will continue to oppose secularism and human rights in Europe and world wide, demanding exemptions from the laws and financial privileges, attacking women's equality and opposing equal rights for LGBT people.
That's why it's important to stand up against the Vatican and its undue undemocratic interference in european politics.
The next "NO VATICAN - London for a Secular Euope" will be on Saturday 17th September 2011.

Please join the mailing list of the "LONDON FOR A SECULAR EUROPE" Campaign at the following link:

23:48, 24 September 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast

dont bin me again[edit]

i now you are a dke buit dont bing me again just because i disagree with your views i will respect them from no one but you casnt expect me to like them ok Prejudicial (talk) 12:53, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Ok, one, a 'please' is missing from your request. Two, a little respect (not to mention grammar and spelling) goes a long way. Now, I hate to go newfag bashing, but carrying on as you have, is hardly going to endear you to the community at large. Yes, there are many things we all disagree on, but that does not mean we have to become abusive over it. Understand? Now, smarten up, sober up, or fuck off. Please. --PsyGremlinSiarad! 13:11, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
Susan probably binned you for either 1) The inability to use grammar; or 2) Being a sock of User:Tolerance, and whoever's sock Tolerance was. Bondurant (talk) 13:51, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
This user is not me. If I were to re-sock you would not Recognise me.--Tolerance (talk) 15:03, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

oh please i was merely expressing my opinion i cant believe you would want to silence me because of my views (talk) 14:06, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Hmm... a vandal with an 86.44.x.x/16 address who thinks it's amusing to harass Susan, now who could that be? Jack Hughes (talk) 14:19, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
It's not MC. It's not his range. Mc's range is 86.40.XXXXXXX or 86.45.XXXXXXX. The Spikey Punk I'm punking my punk! 14:24, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
It's still Eircom though, he may have moved. Redchuck.gif ГенгисRationalWiki GOLD member 14:41, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
Doubtful. MC is too above this sort of childish trolling. Remember, there are more than 5 trolls on the internet. Lord of the Goons The official spikey-haired skeptical punk 14:46, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
Sigh. You do realise that the majority of Irish internet users use eircom? Wevs. MarcusCicero (talk) 16:14, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
Goodpost.gif The Goonie Punk Can't sleep, clowns will eat me! 16:25, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
But why do most of our stupid trolls come from Ireland? No, don't bother answering that. Redchuck.gif ГенгисRationalWiki GOLD member 16:31, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
Have you ever read Patrick Kavanagh? George Moore? Somerville and Ross? If you have you should have no problems trying to understand that the Irish are a... unique race. MarcusCicero (talk) 16:48, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
DTTXT: Don't Tempt The Ex-Troll. Blue Talk 16:34, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Show the math![edit]

I assume you didn't expect that, did you? Laughing.gif Scarlet A.pnggnostic 14:58, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

You ain't kiddin'. Is anyone really following it? 15:18, 2 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
I "followed" it in college. Didn't notice any mistakes, and back then I was pretty sharp at funny looking equations. ħumanUser talk:Human 01:28, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

The force[edit]

Nice, thanks! ħumanUser talk:Human 01:28, 3 October 2010 (UTC)

Did you really?[edit]

say thisimg, or is Karajerk quote mining again. To lazy to check for myself. --PsyGremlinFale! 11:56, 9 October 2010 (UTC)

No! I don't know who he's quoting but it ain't me. The gender's wrong anyhow. 12:18, 9 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Aah, I see it's "Jeff Tavolieri": No connection with me. 12:21, 9 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
He added it below the "Jayne" section, so it is not necessarily a follow up on that thread.  Lily Inspirate me. 12:41, 9 October 2010 (UTC)
Ah yes, missed the heading there. Still good to little Willie still crying about being attacked. --PsyGremlinFale! 12:49, 9 October 2010 (UTC)
Refers to this. I don't know if he's emailed me lately: I've got him dumped to autodestruct. 13:02, 9 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast


To start, or end, the day. I like your "my creations" expando-box. Hope you are well. ħumanUser talk:Human 08:50, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Template cite[edit]

I think you should have a template like, it helps to keep references uniform. Thanks for warn me. Fabio (talk) 16:15, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Sex Wee[edit]

I would have though ad hominem attacks were beneath you, but I guess I was wrong. CrundyTalk nerdy to me 22:25, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Don't be silly. 11:12, 19 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
I thought Crundys Sex-Wee comment was damned funny. i9 21:12, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
Actually it was that comment Closely followed by a lecture on not taking the piss out of Ken that struck me as stupid. 21:28, 19 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Why? I can't make a joke in the bar and make a serious comment in Talk:WIGOCP? The two comments were mutually exclusive, and trying to suggest my toning down of the Ken bashing should be nullified by an amusing remark about something completely unrelated was itself completely stupid. You seem to have become a bit of an uptight bitch in your old age. Lighten the fuck up. CrundyTalk nerdy to me 21:32, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
Watching you guys fight makes me sex wee in my pants. i9 21:41, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
The point is, if I had made a comment in the bar saying something like "Hey, look at (random retard)! Lets post loads of comments on (his|her) (blog|site) for lulz" then your argument would have been valid. As it stands it was just a stupid ad hom. If you had a problem with my bar comment you should have posted your concerns there. CrundyTalk nerdy to me 21:43, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
Oh fuck off. 21:45, 19 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Nice to see intelligent debate hasn't left you quite yet. CrundyTalk nerdy to me 21:49, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
Just talking at your level. 21:55, 19 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
I think we should all just make up and get down to some loving. i9 21:56, 19 October 2010 (UTC)
I've never had a problem with Susan, and have always held her in high regard, but this was a knee-jerk reaction to a comment not out of place in the bar, made in the middle of a serious discussion. All previous respect for Susan is now revoked, but I'm sure Susan cares about that as much as I care about her apparent sudden loss of respect for me (which was more than likely never there in the first place). I feel no need to discuss this further. CrundyTalk nerdy to me 22:09, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Isn't it interesting....[edit]

What the fuck is Phil talking about? and why is he talking to himself? i9 20:22, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

It's rare that I dip my browser into the murky waters of aSK, but that made my day. PJR is the absolute embodiment of the stupid-but-doesn't-realise brigade, and the way he brought it up on his own talkpage was.... classic. No other word can work. –SuspectedReplicant retire me 20:27, 22 October 2010 (UTC)
His contention doesn't make any fucking sense though. What is he suggesting? That people who are in doubt don't count because they are cocksure of being in doubt hence they don't doubt? What the fuck? i9 20:30, 22 October 2010 (UTC)
Eggsackly. They are cocksure of being in doubt (and therefore intelligent), therefore they are actually stupid. TAKE THAT EVOLUTIONISTS!! CREATIONIST LOGIC WINS AGAIN!!1! -- Nx / talk 20:39, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Looking at the math section above that, I hope this isn't for a railway - they never go from straight directly to an arc of a circle, since the sudden transition creates a huge lateral acceleration. RW engineers use other conic sections to reduce this effect. ħumanUser talk:Human 20:47, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

Isn't that what Bezier curves are for - transitioning from curve to curve (or straight to curve etc) ? 21:00, 22 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast


You're a 'crat aren't you Sue? I think Kashfarooq deserves a demotion as punishment for their excellent homeopathy WIGO. As a lowly senior sysop I can't do the honours... DeltaStarSenior SysopSpeciationspeed! 18:58, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Great minds, I was just about to. 19:00, 24 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Good stuff. Can you make me a crat whilst you're at it please? DeltaStarSenior SysopSpeciationspeed! 19:08, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
errr .... No? 19:10, 24 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
You'll have to start a thread on the Saloon bar and convince people that we don't have enough crats. -- Nx / talk 19:12, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Hi. Can you make me a database administrator please? Good stuff. MarcusCicero (talk) 19:14, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Here you go. -- Nx / talk 19:16, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
That looks like swahili to me. MarcusCicero (talk) 19:58, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Hamwelewi ya Kiswahili, Marcus?--Drwatercress 20:22, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Hakuna?--Drwatercress 20:23, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Command-Line Format --transaction-isolation=name

Option-File Format transaction-isolationPermitted Values Type enumeration Valid Values READ-UNCOMMITTED, READ-COMMITTED, REPEATABLE-READ, SERIALI...--Drwatercress 20:24, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

I am a 'crat and just talking about it makes me sex wee. Fuckthat 20:31, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
DeltaStar, perhaps you should take up the cause on Rationalwiki:RFA. Pinto's5150 Talk 21:49, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Also, hello Susan, how's life? Pinto's5150 Talk 21:49, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Hi Pinto! I think of you now and then. Lovely to hear from you. I'm OK, how're you? 21:56, 24 October 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast

Local boy done good[edit]

Worksop's Lee Westward, number 1 golfer in the world. You must be either a) happy for him; or b) of the opinion that "golf is a good walk ruined." Bondurant (talk) 08:58, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Frankly,my dear, I don't give a damn. I've only been in Worksop for about 4-5 years & it's not a the nicest place - I'm a Sheffielder by birth and most of my adult life. Also, of course, Golf is rather silly but so are most hobbies/games/sports/pastimes to an outsider. 15:39, 1 November 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Ah fair enough. Never been to Worksop myself, but now that someone from Sheffield has said that "it's not the nicest place" I'll be less likely to than ever! Anyways, hope life isn't treating you too badly up there... Bondurant (talk) 17:21, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, Sheffield, like most large cities, is more a collection of villages with a hub that is occasionally visited. Interestingly(?) by the boundaries pre WW1 I was born & raised in Derbyshire slightly south of where I now live. I've never been to Nottingham, which I believe is your stamping ground, but from what I've seen/heard/read about it, it seems an interesting place. 17:44, 1 November 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
According to a mate of mine, somewhere near Worksop (Whitwell I think) has a South Yorkshire post code, is in Derbyshire but is in the Notts phone book (or some combination of those 3). Nottingham's not bad. The nightlife was great back when I was a student, but now I'm old and sensible and have to be at my desk by 9 each morning, I more appreciate the dining. Being originally a country boy, I miss birdsong and being able to see the stars at night. Bondurant (talk) 18:50, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Your Saloon bar posting[edit]

I read your creationist cosmology posting in the Saloon bar. All he is doing is describing current cosmological knowledge of how gravity works and shoehorning creationism into it. Nothing of any value. Aceword up 22:01, 3 November 2010 (UTC)


Thanks Susan. I have been visiting RationalWiki now, mainly to laugh at CP, for a couple of years. I've had ups and downs with it but have found it fascinating as well as entertaining. It's largely thanks to your posts and your attitude that I have got from it as much as I have. So just thought I'd stop by and say thanks. StarFish (talk) 08:45, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

Err ... thanks ... I think. Can't imagine what I've done to deserve such a positive comment. but ... thanks. 16:19, 9 November 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast


Thanks! Another ELO fan? Mr. Blue (talk) 21:29, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

Yup (but don't tell anyone please) 21:32, 22 November 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast

Re: Minor[edit]

Yeah. Sorry about that. I never get them correct. That (and spelling) is my mortal weakness. Mr. Blue (talk) 22:36, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


I do like that Adams quote on your userpage. Aceword up 03:09, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

Yeah. It's so applicable to many nutters. 03:12, 26 November 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast

Java edit bar[edit]

It has completely changed with the new MW update. Got any energy to spare to rewrite the help page(s) with duplicate info, monobook vs. vector? Hope you are well. Asterisk (talk) 01:24, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

"to rewrite the help page(s)": be my guest. 07:50, 29 November 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast


You have been nominated for the board of the RWF. Please go here to accept or not! Scarlet A.pnggnostic 04:31, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

You might as well de-nominate her. She won't be around. Him (talk) 10:51, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
Tomorrow never comes until it's too late....Aceword up 10:56, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Hey Babe...[edit] you doin'? P-Foster (talk) 01:48, 29 December 2010 (UTC)

Ok, but bored with this place. I've nothing to add to anything & it all seems to be going weird somehow.
Him & a couple of others & I are starting our own Wiki.
How're you? Haven't seen you around a lot lately.
01:56, 29 December 2010 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Took a long break--a little bored here, a little busy with Real Life (TM). Send me the link to your new project when it's up ad running. P-Foster (talk) 02:18, 29 December 2010 (UTC)
Indeed, send me a link to your new project also. Heck, I still help Bob M at his Wiki now and then, and I know nothing about teaching English as a foreign language. The Goonie Punk Can't sleep, clowns will eat me! 16:31, 30 December 2010 (UTC)
I'd also appreciate a linky when it's up. I won't contribute as I'm a hindrance, but it'd like to see it. And a happy new year to ya! SJ Debaser 17:55, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
It's almost ready, but contributors will be invitation only. I'll give a link for interest's sake though. Him (talk) 18:07, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
What's the theme on the new wiki, anyhow? --Kels (talk) 19:08, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
Have patience, all shall be revealed. Him (talk) 19:46, 31 December 2010 (UTC)
Patience? Yeah, I can learn patience, how long's that gonna take? --Kels (talk) 19:49, 31 December 2010 (UTC)


Hello! Do you realy [speak Russian]?--Bertran (talk) 18:23, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

hells bells.[edit]

nice to see you back. Ace McAwesome 10:06, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

It is! Not that I've been around enough to know you've not been around much... DalekEXTERMINATE
Hi! Thanks - unavoidable absence but I'm back. Him's been using my connection while I've been out - trust he's not been up to any naughtiness. 10:11, 28 January 2011 (UTC) SusanG Toast
I dislike the egregious use of socks so we'll pretend otherwise. Good to see my old RW friend back. Ace McAwesome 10:15, 28 January 2011 (UTC)
No! Not a sock: our neighbour, I've been hospitalised - he's borrowed my laptop & used my WiFi. Don't think his heart was in it though. We're working on a joint project now. 10:32, 28 January 2011 (UTC) SusanG Toast
An IRL RW person? Craaaa-zeeee! Nice to see you back, trust all's well. SJ Debaser 11:23, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

Yay! \o/ ThunderkatzHo! 21:57, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

BTW, that's yay-ing you being back, not the whole hospital thing, but glad you're well. Smiley.gif ThunderkatzHo! 21:59, 28 January 2011 (UTC)
Missed you, hope all is well with your fine self. P-Foster (talk) 22:00, 28 January 2011 (UTC)


Hi there Susan. I don't mean this in an accusatory way (and it will sound accusatory), but how did you find out about TK's demise? Cheers, FairyCupcake (talk) 20:06, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

Are you asking if she has an alibi? P-Foster (talk) 20:23, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
Was it with a candlestick in the conservatory? Or are you going to blame Colonel Mustard again? Ace McAwesome 20:28, 3 February 2011 (UTC)
I am indeed, Detective Inspector FairyCupcake has a ring to it. No I'm not, I was just curious as to how she stumbled across it, I wasn't implying that she is a murderer or a troll. Damnit, why do my innocent questions always sound probing? FairyCupcake (talk) 21:42, 3 February 2011 (UTC)

I never saw this before today.[edit]

Thanks. Made my day. Going home tomorrow to figure out what to do with the poor guy. somewhere on RW is a poem you once posted about a found cat that replaced a departed kitty. Do you remember what I'm talking about?— Unsigned, by: P-Foster / talk / contribs

This? (the first one not Kilkenny) I have no recollection of uploading that picture. 21:23, 4 March 2011 (UTC) SusanG Toast
Just checking, it's Ames' cat. 21:24, 4 March 2011 (UTC) SusanG Toast
The first one, yeah, thanks. And the cat in the drawer is mine -- the one who's ill. that's why i was glad to stumble across your lol-catting of him. P-Foster (talk) 21:36, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
Yeah, sorry, my mistake. You've seen it before! 21:41, 4 March 2011 (UTC) SusanG Toast
I'll be gOD-damned. Memory's the first thing to go, eh? Next I'll be the one they're euthanizing. P-Foster (talk) 21:44, 4 March 2011 (UTC)
Who said that? Nevermind ... could have sworn someone said something ...zzzzzz... Who are you? Nurse! Someone's stealing my clothes ... 21:48, 4 March 2011 (UTC) SusanG Toast