RationalWiki:Chicken coop

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HCM Level 6

All defenses on standby.

The chicken coop is for the avoidance, containment and resolution of cases of Headless Chicken Mode (HCM). Despite the name, this tends to be serious business.

This page can be used for reporting cases of administrative abuse (abuse of sysop or moderator abilities such as blocking, page deletion, or user rights management), general abuse (such as trolling, wandalism, and personal attacks), and conflicts which cannot be solved through normal talk page discussion (such as long-standing edit wars or article content disputes), as well as reporting the violation of non-standard sanctions. Please be specific and provide evidence by including links to any relevant discussions, page edits or logs.

All editors are welcome to comment on the cases raised here, and to try to reach a consensus on any action to be taken. If no consensus can be reached, and the HCM seems to be escalating, moderators are expected to take some action. However, any serious or permanent solution, such as removal of rights or lengthy ban, requires a community vote here according to the guidelines laid out in our Community Standards.

Please try to resolve conflicts directly through discussion on other editor's talk pages before reporting them. It's better to just talk to someone rather than try to drag their name through the mud.

If the issue is not conflict resolution, but concerns RationalWiki policies, suggested changes to how things work around here, or similar matters of principle, please post on on the Community Standards talk page instead.

When presenting a case here, be sure to include whom you are accusing, what exactly you are accusing them of, some hard evidence, and a brief explanation. Since the sole purpose of the Coop is to resolve these disputes, don't post unrelated or more generalized complaints here — if you do, your posts will be moved off the page. Any vote started within 24 hours of filing will be considered invalid.

Use {{CoopNotice}} to inform the user in question, so that they have a chance to discuss their actions here.

As a final note, if you think this page is a good tactic to apply in gaming the mob into doing your bidding, you may be shocked to see your post archived quite swiftly.

Unclescrooge

This discussion was moved here from RW:ATIM.

A walking behavioral violation. Constantly trolling and was given far too many chances, like it's fucking ludicrous to see patience we've displayed here. For instance this user deserved to be put swiftly in vandal bin and was let off quickly because the user incessantly begged, on terms and conditions which user violated immediately and got put back in the bin, which the removal of binning in the first place was a really poor display of judgement. Not to mention the disruptive pinging abuse, the gif abuse, the horrific quality posts and edits, the attempts to coop other users for frivolous reasons (which he has done right after Christopher made the mistake of undoing my block on him and made the coop before I even posted this comment; I'm exasperated also at Christopher, who has frequently undo/reduce blocks on this obvious troll), attempts to permaban other users, regularly personally attacks other users; there's a goddamn laundry list of violations but apparently I need to give him a warning to stop, and blocking for more disruptive comments is too severe. I'm now motioning mods for a long term block of 22 days minimum, but preferably a permaban. You can turn this into Chicken Coop if you need to, if mods disagree how to proceed, but I rather go through a coop with this troll than put up with this patience comedy act any longer. --It's-a me, 🎄LeftyGreenMario!🎄 22:52, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Coup Unclescrooge. He's abusing the coup process. I've had enough of that shit. In fact, I'll go ahead and do it myself. PanGalacticGargleBlaster (talk) 23:11, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

[EC]It wasn’t a mistake, like I said in the unblock message it gave him a chance to actually do something wrong. I seem to find him a lot easier to ignore than most people, and think he was treated too harshly initially when he wasn’t such an obvious troll, but I’d also support an extended block. I say 3.14 months and go from there, but won’t vote against a permaban. Christopher (talk) 23:13, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

@PanGalacticGargleBlaster scrooge is a complete nobody; we can vote to ban him here, please don’t start a coop case over some trolling. Christopher (talk) 23:14, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

No problem, we can discuss this here. PanGalacticGargleBlaster (talk) 23:16, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

In situations like this, it helps to ask the question "what are we losing if we sanction the user in question?" I would like people to consider that before they start defending scrooge, at least.-Flandres (talk) 23:18, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

He's been PMing me on Discord begging to unblock him and spamming his stupid Mario videos. I'm tired of this kid's bullshit. Rockford the Roe ^{boop my snoot}_{praise Oscar Wilde} 23:22, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Has Scrooge made any constructive mainspace edits? Bongolian (talk) 23:23, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

I'd favor a ban of π months (at a minimum) for egregious violation of the community standards, trying to coop anyone who upsets him, and making no worthwhile contributions here at all. —cosmikdebris ^talk stalk 23:24, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

(Edit conflicy) My deeming it as a "mistake" is not a literal mistake but my own exasperated judgement strongly disagreeing with yours, and my feeling correct when letting blocked would've prevented scrooge from further disruption. Perhaps there's silver lining that the unblocking also was a final straw for me and maybe something could be done, but this back and forth (which you might see as my actions as being too aggressive while I see yours as too accomodating) is tiring me. Apologies if I came off as abrasive. --It's-a me, 🎄LeftyGreenMario!🎄 23:24, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

(STOP GETTING INTO EDIT CONFLICTS WITH ME!!!) Flandres, I created the page on Red Eagle Politics. Christpher, I'm NOT a nobody!! Unclescrooge (talk) 23:25, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

No need to apologise, I take most of the blame for any conflict. I do stand by my earlier defence of him but lately it’s mostly just been stubbornness (and frustration at the often flimsy block justifications, given how easy it is to wait for actual block-worthy edits). Christopher (talk) 23:28, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘Personally I think these discussions should be about how much you’ve done wrong, not what you’ve done right, but he’s made less than 50 mainspace edits and none of them were very good. Christopher (talk) 23:29, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

Wow, amazing resume, Unclescrooge. What will the wiki do without a page on some blogger that's been in draft zone for over a month, that time better spent on article improvement than wasting other people's time with you?

Christopher, I do believe what he has done is blockworthy, just for disruption. Benefit of doubt is zero so in turn, bar for him getting blocked for disruption is also really low. That's how I saw things. I can see your way, I believe but I don't agree. --It's-a me, 🎄LeftyGreenMario!🎄 23:33, 28 May 2021 (UTC)

UncleScrooge's primary reason for being here is to be disruptive. His behaviour hasn't improved in spite of the multiple short term blocks and other small punishments he has received. He's going to get banned eventually. We might as well do it sooner rather than later. Spud (talk) 00:43, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

I would tolerate, even welcome US if he were original, funny or interesting at trolling. But he's just boring and tedious. I say we get rid of him. 主要行事月 (talk) 01:00, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

As noted in the coop, I support any punishment for Scrooge that looks like it could have enough support to pass. Bongolian (talk) 02:34, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Well @Unclescrooge, let me explain what you are doing wrong: everything. You are an embarrassment to the small community of virtuous trolls here on the wiki. Going to the CC to "coop ban" members in better standing than yourself makes you appear to be an idiot. LGM is one of the most even tempered editors on the site, and you managed to antagonize them. To what end? And funny? No chance of that. As has been pointed out, you are a froward contributor. UncleKrampus (talk) 02:50, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

I’d go up to a pi months block. I wouldn’t vote for a permaban, but this user is annoying enough that I also wouldn’t vote against it. Chef Moosolini’s Ristorante Italiano^{Make a Reservation} 06:13, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

I too am bored with the constant coop-trolling and grovelling. At this stage I'd support a short (pi week/month) block, and would support a much longer block if this was to continue afterwards . --RWRW (talk) 06:22, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

I say a 3.14 week block, with talk page access revoked so it is paid in full. If disruption insues after that, perm block.Gale5050 (talk) 12:18, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Definitely agree on revoking talkpage access, given how he uses it. It’d be good if people could make that clear when voting. There’s no rule saying you can’t state your opinion but remember you can’t vote as your account isn’t old enough. Christopher (talk) 12:23, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ I did block Scrooge initially for 3 weeks, then 3.14 weeks (as per RW tradition), only to realise that you were cooping him for the purpose of a block, which I didn't realise at the time. Sorry for my mistaken block, I'll try and avoid making this mistake in the future. Harry Potter (talk) 12:38, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

I vote Aye to cooping Unclescrooge, as there he clearly has a case to answer. Harry Potter (talk) 12:46, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

He’s already been cooped, and you don’t get a vote on how long he’s blocked for. See RW:CS#Franchise. Christopher (talk) 12:47, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

As for talk page access, I say revoke it. What would he use it for anyway? For the purpose of appealing the ban? But who would hear such an appeal, let alone unblock him anyway? I say if he wants to appeal, let him email the blocking admin. Otherwise, it should be revoked, or at the very least revoked at the first sign of trouble. I didn't know that, for the record is your claim that my account is younger than 3 months or that it does not have 75 edits? Either way I'm pretty sure you're mistaken, I am an eligible voter as both of those apply to me. Harry Potter (talk) 12:49, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Assumed your account was new because you only recently became active, my mistake. Christopher (talk) 13:19, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

That's correct, I technically created this account around September last year (so more than 3 months ago) but I took a long LANCB shortly after. Then I returned to RW quite recently. So I can understand, it's fine. :) By the way sorry about the my mistake in updating the status to the wrong one, I didn't know what HCM 4 meant but that's still my mistake. Harry Potter (talk) 13:21, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Can verify. There first edit was on 24 September 2020. But I didn't welcome them until May 12 though. Meanwhile my first was on 28 March 2021, so I will be eligible in a month. Gale5050 (talk) 14:58, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Ping me when it's time for a vote, I can't be arsed to care beyond that. ☭Comrade GC☭^{Ministry of Praise} 15:14, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

About the length of the block, most people above seem to support months. I'd also vote for 3.14 quarters of a year if that's an option, but would probably be neutral to years and to permanent. I mention this because I haven't seen a more moderate length above 3.14 months mentioned yet. (My current reasoning: Maybe Unclescrooge may change in time, but if it happens, I think it will probably take more than a few months.) --ApooftGnegiol (talk) 16:34, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

In most coops, I only see the following block increments offered-pi-days, pi-weeks, pi-months, and permablocking.-Flandres (talk) 16:42, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Feel free to add in any block length you want as an option when voting starts. If people want to stick to the dropdown options they can vote for them. Christopher (talk) 16:44, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Sorry, I noticed I'm too new (March 23) and can't vote anyway. Well, the idea may or may not be relevant for others who vote. --ApooftGnegiol (talk) 17:14, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

For the sake of clarity, has a vote been formally started yet? Harry Potter (talk) 17:23, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

No, because it has not been 24 hours.Gale5050 (talk) 17:31, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Could someone show a few diffs? I'm likely to support (I've seen Scrooges shittery) and it wouldn't surprise me it's more widespread than what I've seen...but seeing a few more diffs would help. ShabiDOO 18:59, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Most diffs taken in isolation look fairly harmless, off the top of my head there are his bullshit coops [1] [2] [3] Christopher (talk) 19:20, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

┌────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────────┘ I support pi months and a soft threat that if he doesn't stop with the crying wolf shit that we could see escalations from there. Scrooge is very tiresome to deal with and is one of the few reasons (not the only one) I took a short break from the wiki. Techpriest (talk) 20:04, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Well....

• Bullshit coops also had Unclescrooge calling users to be permabanned.[4][5][6]
• Inserting completely inappropriate entries for WIGO [7], similar habit in Salooon Bar.[8][9] Extremely low quality WIGO [10].
• Poor to horrific quality edits in mainspace[11] (generally removing categories with a dopey "huh?" edit summary) [12][13] [14]
• Constantly complaining about being binned/blocked / Begging to be removed from vandal bin [15] (this one is a promise to insert inappropriate Mario content for the wiki) [16][17](spammed Saloon Bar for this) [18] (post also calls for long-term blocking users) [19] [20] flaming Cosmikdebris, [21] calling Plutocow a "fascist" and begging for sysop powers, [22], [23] begging Christopher to be let back on a Discord server)
• Ping abuse[24]
• Trolling users, quick to flame them for doing the reasonable thing like preventing further disruption. [25][26] (calling Kevlastar a "fascist"), [27] (typical right wing trolling), [28] (calling Gale5050 a "fascist"), [29] calling Spud a "fascist", [30] (trolling Chicken Coop), [31] (trolling Chicken Coop; no that's not a copy/paste mistake), [32] (playing right wing troll against GrammarCommie for doing the correct thing of removing disruptive premature Chicken Coop voting)
• GIF spam, particularly including a giant ass gif including filtering so it looks horribly ugly.[33][34][35][36] The gif is his current user page content.
• Created several awful Debate pages.[37][38]. This one is the first one, and cemented extremely negative impressions by most users on him.
• Created shitty drafts, some shittier than the others.[39] (the shitty one).
• Created a horrific essay that ended up buried for going plain against RationalWiki's mission.[40].
• Reregged under another account to complain to Rockford Roe[41] and Rockford Roe has complained about him sending harassing DMs in this coop.

Also it doesn't take specific diffs to show his posting manner. He makes excessive use of punctuation. It's clearer than an Invisible Mario to me that this user's only intention is to draw much attention to himself through punctuation, all caps, ping spam, and GIF abuse, which are all traits of poor quality trolls. I think a month ban is appropriate but I also think that's on the "easy" side and I believe Unclecrooge should be yeeted off for a very long time. He's cemented his awful reputation since February and has been registered here since September 2020, and I had to type this up when I could be scrubbing toilets instead. Why are we keeping him here for so long? WHY have we kept him for this long? --It's-a me, 🎄LeftyGreenMario!🎄 20:14, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

@Shabidoo in addition to that, look at there terrible block log[42]. Gale5050 (talk) 20:52, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Thoughts

Scrooge is a (very) minor pest, and is in the bin where he belongs. To mitigate some of his genuinely irritating / disruptive behaviour, I'd propose the following:

1. The binning won't be reviewed for 12 months. If he complains about being in there, or asks to be unbinned, at any point before 29/05/2022, then it's escalating week-long blocks (1, 2, 3, etc.) from the first sysop / mod who sees it.
2. If he starts a coop case which is then judged to be frivolous by a simple majority of the mod team, then it's escalating month-long blocks (1, 2, 3, etc.).

As for his generally bad / dumb / argumentative edits, and bog-standard right-wing talking points, then that's just the perils of editing on an open wiki, and some of you seriously need to get a grip. Helena Bonham Carter (talk) 21:42, 29 May 2021 (UTC)

Scrooge was initially removed from the bin after begging, the quickly rebinned for repeat behavior. Binning has no effect on Scrooge other than reducing the frequency of bad behavior. Bongolian (talk) 21:52, 29 May 2021 (UTC)