RationalWiki talk:What is going on in the world?/Archive40

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Iowa

This sort of leads me to wonder how state-level civil rights law ended up covering gender identity in Iowa of all the places, in the first place. I don't think it's gone blue since even before gay marriage was federally legalized. Chillpilled (talk) 23:55, 1 February 2024 (UTC)

Midwestern states in general were once more "swingy" and regularly voted in Democratic politicians, regardless of whether or not they had a big urban city. Democrats held the governorship and the legislature in Iowa in 2007, so they were able to add in that clause then. [1] One of the key elements of the current "realignment" is the urban-rural dynamic. States whose largest cities are only modestly sized and have heavy rural populations, like Iowa, have gone heavier Republican as a result. (You can see the same thing happen with Indiana - Indianapolis is hardly a Minneapolis, Chicago, or Detroit.) BobJohnson (talk) 00:23, 2 February 2024 (UTC)

Oh, I see I skimmed past that one. Still a bit surprised that was put through as early as 2007. Chillpilled (talk) 00:38, 2 February 2024 (UTC)

Putin Says a Biden Presidency is better than a trump one

I read how we considered putin saying Biden Would be better than Trump a stopped Clock. BULL F"""""" S""". It's obvious that he's trying to trick people into voting for the cheeto nazi. You can see in these two articles at least https: [2] [3] . He may be evil but he's not stupid. & that was not a stopped clock. Yacob01 (talk) 14:29, 20 Febuary 2024 (AEST)

Who knows, maybe he really does mean it. It is true Trump is very erratic, which Putin said in this interview. Thinking away from the Ukraine war, Trump did take out Soleimani, a top general for Iran which is somewhat Russia-aligned. Which was a very bold move, and could have easily started a war. Chillpilled (talk) 14:00, 20 February 2024 (UTC)

On the Gaza truck aids

Apparently, we don't know exactly what happened. I'm not saying that this is the case (in fact, from what I've seen, it probably isn't) but this could be another Al-Ahli Arab Hospital explosion incident (ie. probably not the IDF's fault, at least to some extent). The CNN and The Guardian are adopting a more neutral tone.[4][5] I believe we should edit the entry and adopt a more neutral tone for now too. Again, I'm not saying that this isn't Israel's fault (I'm inclined to say it is), just that it's too early right now to reach a defining conclusion. What do you guys think? GeeJayK^{Where all evil dwells} _{Where every lie is true} 22:50, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

Israel also has a long track record of bullshitting (Here's just one example that the media so credulously repeated), so I think we'd need independent verification, which, as of October anyway, Israel was refusing to allow journalists into Gaza. There's also the problem that any reporting would take Israel's claims at face value, which they haven't really earned as an obviously biased party (and one with a long history of deceit). Also, keep in mind that NPOV is not necessarily objective. CNN at the very least also has a heavy pro-Israel bias, which is something we should factor into account. Carthage (talk) 23:11, 29 February 2024 (UTC)

Even the IDF admits they fired on civilians at some point. I'm editing my own entry with a couple notes. Chillpilled (talk) 05:52, 1 March 2024 (UTC)

"Same organization whose founder celebrated October 7th"

Disregarding the fact that @Monet edited my WIGO without permission, this would seem to count as a case of the genetic fallacy as the founder's personal opinions in no way undermine the reporting conducted by Euromed. Carthage (talk) 15:37, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

I think it's interesting. A humanitarian organization essentially saying, "Fuck yeah, violence!", tells me enough to say humanitarianism is just a farce for them.-Ryan1257 (talk) 15:53, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Is this guy even associated with Euromed anymore? And even if he was, how is this relevant to their reporting on the Flour Massacre? This seems like an attempt to fallaciously undermine my WIGO. Anyway, I'm more pissed off Monet edited my WIGO without permission. This should've been taken to the talk page first. Carthage (talk) 15:56, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

I didn't edit your WIGO, I only added a statement on Euromed being an unreliable source. The same organization that lied about the numbers of fighters killed, while even Hamas admitted that over 6000 of those killed were its fighters. And the founder is still the chairman of Euromed, Monet ^Ye 16:00, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Hamas fighters are not mentioned in your linked article. It says 92% of fatalities are civilians. So your contention that this is flawed reporting is based off of something that's not even contained in the text itself. You edited my WIGO without permission, and now you're attempting to justify it post-hoc.

You also didn't add a statement implicating Euromed as an unreliable source, you added personal opinions of the founder, which is irrelevant to the reporting on the Flour Massacre. Carthage (talk) 16:07, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

WIGO editing without permission should only be done for inaccurate paraphrasings or if the source is really bad. The opinions of the founder don't inherently seem relevant enough to discredit the source to me, nor do I think the news is controversial. I'm unsure about Euromeds relevance as a source, but we also have examples of groups such as Doctors without Borders holding Israel responsible. There are also a slew of independent statements from groups like UNICEF that indirectly call out Israel by noting the importance of safe access to humanitarian aid. -- Techpriest (talk) 17:28, 5 March 2024 (UTC)

Monet is also engaging in bad-faith misrepresentation. I looked at the tweets he provided, and none of them mention justifying the targeting of civilians. Consider that, as former Israeli general Giora Eiland put it in 2004, Gaza is a "concentration camp." The people of Gaza have been kept in an open-air prison for 16 years, as attested by human rights groups like Human Rights Watch. The tweets refer to the resilience of Palestinians and the desire to gain freedom from this prison camp. While some can question the meaning and connotation of these phrases, to suggest that he is endorsing the targeting of civilians is false. ^{— Unsigned, by: Cw64126 / talk}

There is, in any case, actually no scenario here in which Israel isn't responsible for what I suppose has been dubbed the "Flour Massacre". Even if their own account was entirely correct that most of the casualties were from a stampede, they engineered this situation in the first place — there would be no extreme crowding around aid trucks if more aid trucks were allowed in at all. There is a quote on that other wiki for the page about stampedes:

"Stampede is not only an incorrect term, it is a loaded word, as it assigns blame to the victims for behaving in an irrational, self-destructive, unthinking and uncaring manner, it's pure ignorance, and laziness […] It gives the impression that it was a mindless crowd only caring about themselves, and they were prepared to crush people. In virtually all these situations, this is not the case, and it is usually the authorities to blame for poor planning, poor design, poor control, poor policing and mismanagement. The truth is that people are only directly crushed by others who have no choice in the matter, and the people who can choose don't know what is going on because they're too far away from the epicentre. — Edwin Galea, professor of fire safety engineering at the University of Greenwich, England" Chillpilled (talk) 00:41, 6 March 2024 (UTC)

Teresa May's PMB

If you're going to present a lopsided version of events, couched in emotive language, either fact check or place it in blogs / clogs. This is RationalWiki. London Grump (talk) 13:37, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

I'm assuming this is directed at me, but I sorta feel I can immediately disregard it as you didn't even fact-check who wrote the bill. I feel pretty happy with the way I presented it :P (っ◔◡◔)っ ♥ Natsuki Marx ♥ (talk) 13:41, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

I have no idea who posted it because I didn't check. It's not about the person, it's the principle. London Grump (talk) 14:45, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

So you didn't do the bare minimum to check? Carthage (talk) 21:16, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

I didn't check who posted the story but I have been following the story. That's how I know it's bullshit.

It was a dead duck of a bill with zero chance of being chance of being heard in the first place. The British tabloids spun it to make it look like the woke Labour Party was trying to shut down a brave attempt to protect women and children from predatory trans.

The irony is that NHS England put a block on prescribing them earlier last week. The Bill was effectively redundant.

If it can't be presented factually here, it shouldn't be presented at all. London Grump (talk) 22:07, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Just wanna remind us all that Liz Truss' bill banned private healthcare from prescribing them, not the NHS. These are meaningfully different. And, what do you mean the story is "bullshit"? The filibuster didn't happen? (っ◔◡◔)っ ♥ Natsuki Marx ♥ (talk) 22:34, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

https://bills.parliament.uk/bills/3560

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/58-04/0035/230035.pdf

Was an earlier PMB discussed? Yes. Was it a filibuster? No. No more than Usain Bolt would bother sabotaging my running shoes. That didn't stop UK tabloids putting a spin on it.

Let's be clear. The system is rigged against Private Member's Bills. They are rarely even considered to become law. London Grump (talk) 23:02, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

I have no idea who's actually correct here but what London Grump is saying tracks precisely with the sort of hackery I've come to expect from British tabloids on this subject. Doesn't matter even if Labour capitulates a lot on the issue, the right-wing tabloids (that seems to be most tabloids) will continue pretending they're some kind of "woke"s. Chillpilled (talk) 23:06, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Liz Truss' bill has been reported as being "talked out" by The Independent. [6] The "ferret filibuster" concept seems to have come about as a talking point because one of the discussion topics was a bill concerning the import of certain pets (like ferrets).[7] The "talking out" thing sounds much milder than a filibuster to be honest, it sounds quite procedural.

My "from across the pond" impression of late is that Truss is trying to import the US style "culture war" bullshit to the UK in order to revive her career; while some Tories are sympathetic on this sort of thing, a lot are not. BobJohnson (talk) 23:30, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

Indeed. She met some interesting people at the recent CPAC and she has long established links with the Institute of Economic Affairs (and, by extension, their various culture war groups).

Culture war, like all propaganda, celebrates imaginary victories and mourns imaginary defeats to support a broader narrative. To celebrate an imaginary victory - even the Independent article is essentially he-said she-said - is to legitimise the concept of culture war.

This was an unexceptional parliamentary event. It would be interesting to find out how many MPs were in the chamber on Friday afternoon. It's usually no more than double figures. 09:48, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

According to British Tabloids...

An edit was made to the latest entry on the "ferret filibuster" about how British tabloids were exaggerating the story. That's weird because the source cited on the entry is an online newsletter acting as a watchdog of anti-trans legislation, primarily in the US. That source uses CNN articles in the coverage of this story. (Though this has been reported by some tabloids.) That user is named "London Grump" so I'm assuming they are a Brit who felt that Erin's framing was inaccurate, but if that's the case then why even mention tabloids?

Also searching "ferret" on The Mirror brought this up. Just wanted to share that. ^{— Unsigned, by: Not BoN / talk / contribs}

I mentioned the tabloids because the narrative around the story was shaped by the tabloids.

As I wrote in my original edit, this PMB had no chance of being heard, let alone go all the way through the parliamentary process to becoming law. It was the third PMB on a Friday afternoon, a time when backbench MPs try to look their best for their local newspapers knowing their Bill stands almost no chance - the last one that passed was in 2019.. The first PMB stands no chance, the second PMB stands no chance, the third PMB might as well not exist. This was cheap political theatre, nothing else.

The Brit tabloids presented it as the woke Labour Party trying to shoot down a brave attempt by a lone Tory to protect children. Bullshit from beginning to end.

So here we are, with a bullshit story via a blog via a US news channel presented in a factually incorrect way on the front page of RationalWiki.

Nah. I've edited it down to the bare bones, no adjectives, total NPOV. ^{— Unsigned, by: London Grump / talk / contribs} (talk) 22:14, 17 March 2024 (UTC)

ISIS-K

At first I was thinking it was some Chechen group that was responsible, but have any Chechen militia been this effective in recent years? It's still possible that this was some Chechen group claiming affiliation with ISIS-K rather than some blokes from Afghanistan, given that a) ISIS had a presence in Chechnya in recent years and b) ISIS is literally just a brand-name for Jihadists at this point. Carthage (talk) 14:06, 24 March 2024 (UTC)

Chechen nationalist/separatist terrorism is almost anachronistic these days. Most anti-Russian militants in the Chechnya have been Salafists-who believe Chechen nationalism is essentially irrelevant compared to "all Muslims in the North Caucasus vs the infidel Russians"-since, like, the late 2000s. The last president of the CHRI happily abolished his own government to help pave the way for the Caucasus Emirate. (Even the Caucasus Emirate was de facto destroyed by the time Al-Baghdadi entered the picture. Hell, even Islamic State-Caucasus Province is just a name lone wolves use nowadays.) The Dudayev/Maskhadov type nationalists are either dead or irrelevant. If any of the perpetrators turn out to be from Chechnya they will almost certainly be "a group of Chechens who fight for IS-KP" rather than "a Chechen group".-Flandres (talk) 15:55, 24 March 2024 (UTC)

So it turns out that six of those arrested were Tajiks, not Chechens. Carthage (talk) 13:31, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

Bridge collapse

Was going to add a wigo about it, but had an edit conflict. And yes, it is the same bridge from the greatest show of all time.[8] GeeJayK^{Where all evil dwells} _{Where every lie is true} 11:47, 26 March 2024 (UTC)

I question it's inclusion, period. It is neither missional and not much interest to non-Americans. KarmaPolice (talk) 14:06, 26 March 2024 (UTC)

It's actually being reported internationally as it's being recognised as a huge tragedy and not something we see very often at all. I think it's fine to include it. (っ◔◡◔)っ ♥ Natsuki Marx ♥ (talk) 17:52, 26 March 2024 (UTC)

That one Guardian article about True Blue

The summary on the main WIGO page missed out a crucial detail - The app isn't actually going to be released. The headline even reads "Tories planned to make millions from members’ data with ‘True Blue’ app", implying the app never left the ground in the first place. I've edited it to avoid confusion. Zenphia (talk) 11:08, 5 April 2024 (UTC)

Greta Thunberg arrested again

Yesterday Greta Thunberg was arrested in Hague at an environmentalist protest for blocking a highway. It should be in WIGO. 🇷🇸 Serbian Arbiter (What would you have your arbiter do?) 15:01, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Highlighting certain countries

"European UnionGay LGBT+ think tank ILGA Europe release its Rainbow Map for 2024. Top five countries are; Malta, Iceland, Belgium, Spain & Denmark. Bottom five are; Russia, Azerbaijan, Türkiye, Armenia & Belarus. Ireland came 15th and the UK came 16th out of 49 countries."

Is there any reasons for the extra mentioning of UK and Ireland? ^{— Unsigned, by: 2a0a:a549:20a1:0:f177:a8db:b3ce:f314 / talk / contribs}

because of the user base AMassiveGay (talk) 11:10, 17 May 2024 (UTC)

Ireland has a population of 5 million. That should be a higher user base than the large European countries? Are there any user statistics? ^{— Unsigned, by: 2a0a:a548:e3b6:0:a38b:e172:ee8:f45e / talk / contribs}

Taiwan has new president and the speech is chilling

'Stop threatening Taiwan', its new president William Lai tells China--John123521 (talk) 12:27, 20 May 2024 (UTC)

Why is it chilling? That he's calling it out? Have you not heard about how China is trying to claim the Taiwan Strait as 'internal waters' and thus stop foreign [esp military] ships going through it? Or bullying 'patrols' around Taiwanese islands? KarmaPolice (talk) 15:04, 21 May 2024 (UTC)

Guardian on Golden rice in the Philippines

As someone who is married to a Filipina and spending the winter time there every year. It's a non issue on Philippine media. In general, the most in the Philippines have similar problems than Americans. To much junk food, to much sugar, to little physical activities. The average Filipino eats six to eight cups of rice every day which is an additional huge carbon hydrate intake.It's not uncommon that they start suffering from diabetics type 2 in their late 40s. There is no general vitamin A shortage in the regular Philippine diet.

So why now this issue? There are a few mountain tribes who eat only rice. Nothing but rice. That's malnutrition and many of them die early. Only very few make it into their 40s. But the guardian figure of 100,000s of dying kids is heavily overblown. These tribes are relatively small. For years scientists are trying to convince them to add some local fruits or vegetables but they rejected. They tried Golden Rice. It was also rejected. What is needed? Another years or even decades of work. Golden Rice should neither been banned not seen as the only feasable solution. It should just be an option.

The Guardian published a piece of overblown lobby alarmism. They tried to balance it a little bit but it remains obvious. ^{— Unsigned, by: 2a0a:a548:e3b6:0:a38b:e172:ee8:f45e / talk / contribs}

'Vitamin A deficiency is a public health problem in more than half of all countries, especially those in Africa and South-East Asia.' (WHO report)

But I'm sure your own personal experience trumps the WHO and other experts. You considered the fact that they might have a better view of the big picture than you and that's what the article writer(s) were using as a factual basis? KarmaPolice (talk) 19:38, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

The AAAS estimated that 15% of Filipino infants and children have vitamin A deficiency, which is a number they may be obtaining from a DOST-FNRI survey that does indeed say the focus of the issue is among the poor and rural. Note that the Guardian estimate for 100,000 deaths per year due to vitamin A deficiency I think is a world-wide estimate, not specific to the Philippines (it matches the low-end of what is in the Wiki article on Vitamin A deficiency.)

The problem here is that the Greenpeace-pressured court decision does prevent Vitamin A rice from becoming "an option". As noted in the DOST-FNRI survey link, vitamin A deficiency is not an issue with most Filipino diets (if you include *anything* other than all-carb stuff like rice, it seems like you are covered) and I think the Matin Qaim quoted in the article is engaging in a little bit of hyperbole, considering that vitamin A also is available in other ways (eg supplemental pills). But it's an issue nonetheless for certain populations, of which Vitamin A rice might help. Greenpeace is not helping by engaging in GMO oogie-boogie here, which is not surprising for them. BobJohnson (talk) 20:54, 26 May 2024 (UTC)

There's questions on how well a human body can take up micros up via suppliments [the consensus appears to currently be 'better than nothing, but not as good as the Real Thing™'], staple fortification costs money [we in the West have been doing this to breakfast cereals, bread and fruit juices for a century] and we're all familiar with the use of flouride in drinking water [since the 1940s]. The idea of 'genetic fortification' is that it means the folks who consume the crop directly from the farms get the benefit, while traditionally the crop would need to be processed in a factory first. But we have to remember malnutrition is much more a contributory factor of early death rather than the direct reason; we see this in places where in the UK where millions of Britons [due to poverty and ignorance] are falling into the 'fat but malnourished' category [and I expect the Americans to be even worse here]. KarmaPolice (talk) 15:27, 27 May 2024 (UTC)

German legalities

Does this court case merit a mention here (or the Provisional Imperial Government page be updated). Anna Livia (talk) 19:31, 1 June 2024 (UTC)

Self-referential question

Would RW reaching 8k articles be noteworthy enough for this list? Anna Livia (talk) 23:45, 7 June 2024 (UTC)

I think not. Wikidrama isn't really news, is it? However, I wouldn't say no to having a front page banner on the main page for say, reaching 10k or say, reaching our 20th (22nd May 27). KarmaPolice (talk) 00:53, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

"Useful idiot"

This phrase crops up now and again here, usually to describe a left wing politician who questions western foreign policy, and leaves a bad taste in the mouth. Should we also start using it about every politician who tries to justify acts committed in our name?

Nobody is right if everybody's wrong. London Grump (talk) 10:32, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

...that's not what useful idiot means. A "useful idiot" is one who thinks they are truly fighting for a cause, when in reality they are merely parroting propaganda or in some way being manipulated politically without them realizing it. It's a Cold War leftover phrase, but still occasionally applicable. These days probably the most prominent "useful idiot" is hardly left-wing: Tucker Carlson, whose unrequited love of Vladimir Putin and other strongmen is obviously done with zero critical thinking and with much regurgitation of strongmen propaganda. Simply questioning a Western foreign policy does not make one a "useful idiot". BobJohnson (talk) 12:57, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Are there no examples of someone being called a useful idiot just for questioning Western foreign policy? In a field as charged as (geo)politics, I would be surprised if there were no examples of someone insinuating a critic is a propagandist or misled dupe to discredit their criticism. Carthage (talk) 13:06, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

According to the Wigo at least, she is not "just" questioning Western foreign policy, she supports downright dictators just because they are anti-western. If she isn't a useful idiot, she's extremely disingenuous. GeeJayK^{Where all evil dwells} _{Where every lie is true} 13:10, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Notice I wasn't asking about Clare Daly. Carthage (talk) 13:11, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

Not in the exact words, but in the past I have heard Jeremy Corbyn be called things like 'a tool' or 'being naive' in regards to his foreign policy stances. KarmaPolice (talk) 13:17, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

I took a quick scan of news headlines, and it didn't take long to find an example of the phrase applied wrong: Heritage tool Nile Gardiner calling Kamala Harris "Hamas' useful idiot" in the Torygraph for... er, tepid pressure on Netanyahu to not invade Rafah, I guess. [9] (Although by the absurdly overwrought rhetoric in the column, you would think that Gardiner was reacting to someone killing a puppy or something.)

So, yeah, that's an example of that phrase being used quite wrongly. I'm sure there's many more examples out there. But when you are at the level of being a Russia spy apologetic (as the Wiki on Daly seems to indicate), I think the term "useful idiot" could apply. BobJohnson (talk) 14:22, 12 June 2024 (UTC)

I was vague in my original post. We know how how it has been used generally from Lenin - who would have disagreed with Bob's definition - on. I was questioning how it is used here. As far as I can recall, it's only been used here about John Pilger, people concerned about Palestinians and this Daly person.

Hardly rational. Aren't we better than that? London Grump (talk) 13:57, 14 June 2024 (UTC)

Didn't you guys already add an entry about the Brazil Abortion stuff a few weeks ago? Why are we adding it again?

TheOneAndOnlyCirrusMan (talk) 16:58, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

Oh, I missed it. Chillpilled (talk) 17:06, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

North Korea?

@Euromec I question the accuracy of your last WIGO entry. Reasoning; https://www.nknews.org/2024/06/fact-check-north-korea-has-not-announced-plans-to-send-troops-to-ukraine-yet/ . KarmaPolice (talk) 18:43, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

Pope Francis

Are we gonna have another schism? Over the dumbest shit possible too. Carthage (talk) 12:18, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Schisms happen all the time with the Catholic Church, it's just that 95% of the never go anywhere. [qv: Independent Catholicism ] KarmaPolice (talk) 12:33, 8 July 2024 (UTC)

Biden

Shouldn’t we mention his outstanding performance last night? 2A00:23C4:AA1D:4A01:5868:136A:BED9:A1E1 (talk) 06:46, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

Burkina Faso

You know one of the underappreciated legacies of colonialism in Africa is homophobia. Like, you can trace a direct line between missionary activity and homophobic sentiment in Africa. I think that's context that a lot of people would rather not think about. Carthage (talk) 16:10, 12 July 2024 (UTC)

dunno if thats an underappreciated legacy. i thought was just an acknowledged fact these days. the draconian laws in uganda mentioned the article were drawn up with the direct involvement ofus evangelicals. this is not merely a throwback from colonialism, this current. AMassiveGay (talk) 18:08, 12 July 2024 (UTC)